268 replies to this topic

[Bishop Steiner]

Darth Bane001, on 15 March 2015 - 10:13 AM, said:

This.

The true fans need to close their wallots to let pgi know that they wont keep profiting form their incompetence for much longer. If you guys want mechwarrior to mean something if it really matters to you, then stop supporting this version until they fix it.



Then let it tank, someone down the line is likely to pick it up, perhaps they will do a better job...well just about anyone else can manage to do slightly better at least, pgi should never have been given the franchise. All they did was poop on it at least comparing it with lets say mechwarrior 3.

I rather someone else be given a chance because these guys just dont get it.

yes, because so many people were lining up for that chance...is the point. Nobody moved on the IP. None. For a decade. Aside from a few modders, who put out a game SO AWESOME that it had at peak a couple hundred players.

MWO dies, mechwarrior video games die for a good long time.

[Myke Pantera]

The more I look at it the less dramatic I think this issue really is. The torso isn't slim but hitboxes will be better than the Phracts. Most of the height comes from the legs which are rather skinny anyways. If a part of the sidetorso belongs to the arms it might actually be XL friendly. On a positive note, the Torso hardpoints are rather highish and the arms short, making them relatively high as well. So gimme the damn thing on Tuesday. They won't change it anyway. At least it's feature rich and beautiful.

[Bishop Steiner]

LordBraxton, on 15 March 2015 - 09:58 AM, said:

The grasshopper isn't (even close to being) thin enough to justify it being 100ton height, also, the zeus is depicted as tall and thin as often as it is depicted bulky. 'short' has never been an adjective used to describe the zeus however, so you are simply wrong.

and I for one am glad we didn't get anorexic AWS and ZEU that so many people want. Mid you, didn't want the AWS to be quite as hefty as it became, but I sure am glad the mechs are as poorly proportioned as the traditional art.

Just poorly scaled.

[hybrid black]

Darth Bane001, on 15 March 2015 - 10:13 AM, said:

This.

The true fans need to close their wallots to let pgi know that they wont keep profiting form their incompetence for much longer. If you guys want mechwarrior to mean something if it really matters to you, then stop supporting this version until they fix it.



Then let it tank, someone down the line is likely to pick it up, perhaps they will do a better job...well just about anyone else can manage to do slightly better at least, pgi should never have been given the franchise. All they did was poop on it at least comparing it with lets say mechwarrior 3.

I rather someone else be given a chance because these guys just dont get it.

or you dont get it..
keep up the good work PGI there are far less people like this tool then people that enjoy the game.

[Alienized]

if i look at the original arts on sarna i could cringe..... no one would drive a qkd then. or literally anything at all.
of lately i looked at the mw4 models... and damn they are poorly made. looking at the timberwolf there...
just for all the crying players i would love to see that thing here how it is in mw4.
the summoner tho looked amazing.



i leave this here.

Edited by Alienized, 15 March 2015 - 10:33 AM.

[PACoFist]

Yes size is pretty screwed up. Especially compared to the Zeus.

I hope it will be a good mech nonetheless. It was always one of my favourites.

Ohh yeahh and I still hope PGI will fix Jumpjets one day, so my GHR can do more than hover a few metres above ground

[Tezcatli]

Tahribator, on 15 March 2015 - 06:01 AM, said:

The Grasshopper is tall but to compensate for it, it's very skinny compared to similar heavies. Just like how the Spider is extremely survivable compared to a Kitfox which is shorter but very chubby. Plus it will get a ridiculous amount of extra armor from quirks. In MWO being tall but skinny is better than being short and wide (like the CTF).

The Grasshopper is going to be one of the most survivable IS heavies if PGI doesn't botch the hitboxes. No need to panic at all.

I would hardly call it "very" skinny. Somewhat skinnier. But not enough to warrant it's ridiculous height.

[Alienized]

PACoFist, on 15 March 2015 - 10:37 AM, said:

Yes size is pretty screwed up. Especially compared to the Zeus.

I hope it will be a good mech nonetheless. It was always one of my favourites.

Ohh yeahh and I still hope PGI will fix Jumpjets one day, so my GHR can do more than hover a few metres above ground

why should a GHR have any JJ problems if a victor has none. just put max JJ in it.

[Armorine]

Yuck the tt zeus. That thing was horrible. I loved it in mw4. 84Kph with a heavy gauss, large laser and twin lrm20s(on mine) thing would lay down a hurting and run away before the enemy knew what happened. Loved running that thing almost as much as running the Fafnir.

[Vassago Rain]

Bishop Steiner, on 15 March 2015 - 10:27 AM, said:

yes, because so many people were lining up for that chance...is the point. Nobody moved on the IP. None. For a decade. Aside from a few modders, who put out a game SO AWESOME that it had at peak a couple hundred players.

MWO dies, mechwarrior video games die for a good long time.

If this minimally viable product is the future of the franchise, obviously, it deserves to die.

The moment PGI folds, someone else will move in and make a better game. Just imagine. They got millions for a broken game, built on grab deals and lies.

A better developer would get rich.

[Xetelian]

WOW that is way to tall.

Bishop Steiner, on 15 March 2015 - 10:27 AM, said:

MWO dies, mechwarrior video games die for a good long time.

I don't think it'll be the end of mechwarrior as we know it. It'll hurt and it'll be a while before another comes along but it wont be the end.

Edited by Xetelian, 15 March 2015 - 11:03 AM.

[Agent 0 Fortune]

I still don't see why people are so bent out of shape, the grasshopper has very high hardpoints, much higher than torso/arm of the Cataphract, but with similar surface area. All that height is in the legs, this is probably going to be a hill-humper/jumpshot's wet dream.

[SgtMagor]

dunno if the comparisons mean anything. height+volume makes a difference, ie: Zeus vs QD, the Zeus's torso is larger and bulkier than the QD even though its a little shorter.

Edited by SgtMagor, 15 March 2015 - 11:09 AM.

[Vassago Rain]

KraftySOT, on 15 March 2015 - 11:03 AM, said:

Sadly thats not how itll work. This franchise already has the Toxic label. PGI just maintained that label. The people who pick this up after PGI will be the exact same kind of people as PGI.

Neither Battletech nor MW ever made enough that someone out there sees the potential should it be done correctly.

Its not like Spiderman, where even though the television show and 80s movie was so terrible it made children cry, there was still that ridiculously successful line of comics that "if done right" would make oodles of money.

Minimum viability is what this franchise will always have, because its easy to gouge the small player base of hardcore fans.

I don't know if you know, but it's not 2008 anymore, and old franchises like wing commander, heavy gear, elite, most fighting games, and probably a bunch of other stuff I don't even know about are coming back strong.

Not only that, but it's possible for a small team of virtual nobodies to crowdfund a niche videogame for devoted fanbases. This game is, and always will be, the best example of a hostage IP.

And people are seemingly okay with it, because they're super scared that if PGI were to fold, they'd never have another mechwarrior. The instant this game fails, someone else will license it, and make a far better mechwarrior title. That is if microsoft themselves don't put it to use for xbone and PC unity, obviously.

No one's foolish enough to leave this much money on the table, except PGI, who wanted to go to space.

[KraftySOT]

Vassago Rain, on 15 March 2015 - 11:14 AM, said:

I don't know if you know, but it's not 2008 anymore, and old franchises like wing commander, heavy gear, elite, most fighting games, and probably a bunch of other stuff I don't even know about are coming back strong.

Not only that, but it's possible for a small team of virtual nobodies to crowdfund a niche videogame for devoted fanbases. This game is, and always will be, the best example of a hostage IP.

And people are seemingly okay with it, because they're super scared that if PGI were to fold, they'd never have another mechwarrior. The instant this game fails, someone else will license it, and make a far better mechwarrior title. That is if microsoft themselves don't put it to use for xbone and PC unity, obviously.

No one's foolish enough to leave this much money on the table, except PGI, who wanted to go to space.

Oh yeah definitely, and ill say I dont know exactly what the deal is with PGI holding it till 2020. Jordan has it till 2020, and is still technically, on paper, with PGI, but clearly doing his Shadowrun thing. So im not sure how that works. If its actually tied up until 2020, we're screwed. By then something else greater and more awesome will come along and relegate us to the trashbin for at least a few years until someone decides to revive this at which point, id imagine its the same type of company as PGI, buying up a cheap license to produce some minimally viable product.

You saw PGI try and do that with Tranverse. Sadly some of the people making these reboots arent any better. I love the Wasteland reboot for instance but at the end of the day, its no Interplay Fallout 2.

Now if PGI folds before 2020, and Jordan still has dibs, and microsoft wants free money...yes then youll see a good Btech product come out. Jordan loves money. Microsoft loves money. Theres no reason theyd leave that on the table.

Its a matter of if PGI holds onto it until the reboot craze passes by or not.

I totally agree that if PGI folds, we'll get a good Btech game. Theres no reason the two money loving people still in the game, would leave that money on the table. Especially not Microsoft.

But id say if its true PGI holds on to this as a minimally viable product for the next five years...itll drive the franchise into the ground until at least 2024.

Were also not the only comeback failure.

Nor will all the comeback reboots, succeed in the future either.

No one will ever make me believe the Doom reboot will be good. iD hasnt made a good GAME (Carmack still churns out those awesome engines) since Romero was **** canned and went to make Daikatana. (which without Carmark and Todd Hollenshead was complete trash)

Edited by KraftySOT, 15 March 2015 - 11:24 AM.

[Creovex]

hybrid black, on 15 March 2015 - 10:29 AM, said:

or you dont get it..
keep up the good work PGI there are far less people like this tool then people that enjoy the game.

He has been saying that the last 3 years... Its white noise to most of us and probably PGI.....
-Phoenix Pack "Close your wallet, no CW"
-Clan Invasion "Close your wallet, no CW"
-CW "Close your wallet, Ghost Heat still exists..."
-Clan Wave 2 "Close your wallet I want an IS pack"
-Resistance Pack "Close your wallet I want a Clan Pack, and now this^^"

Most the people here need to get over these minor changes. Go make a game with the old models and argue how the TT looked better.... Look at this Jenner, it has a 4-story apartment building on it.... between the flying saucer cockpit that sits on a plank of wood connecting the saucer to the apartment complex... with long super model legs that have ZERO way to move forward... of a ship....... If PGI made it like this **** they would not have made it this far.

Edited by Creovex, 15 March 2015 - 11:57 AM.

[Ultimax]

Bishop Steiner, on 15 March 2015 - 07:57 AM, said:

and people used "logic" when all the SHD QQ was abundant. And it was much ado about nothing. Might it prove so here, too?

My logic is that the game is different.

Pop-tarting with a Shadowhawk was possible.

Asymmetric builds with ACs & PPCs were possible.

High mounted weapon hardpoints make for good snipers.


The Shadowhawk is tall, but it is not as wide as the Victor.



The Grasshopper is in the era of hoverjets.

It won't even be able to combine ACs with PPCs if that ever becomes a thing again.

Many builds will not be asymmetric (laser boating).

I has no primary weapon systems mounted high, only the one slot missile hardpoint in the head.




Logic tells me that the Grasshopper is going to be too large for it's own good.

It's going to be like Sparky vs. Enforcer. Take a look at how wildly different their scaling is, the Enforcer is easily the more survivable of the two.

[Bishop Steiner]

SgtMagor, on 15 March 2015 - 11:08 AM, said:

dunno if the comparisons mean anything. height+volume makes a difference, ie: Zeus vs QD, the Zeus's torso is larger and bulkier than the QD even though its a little shorter.

Zeus makes me think of an Assault version of the basic HBK, but with somewhat better arms.

Ultimatum X, on 15 March 2015 - 12:02 PM, said:

My logic is that the game is different.

Pop-tarting with a Shadowhawk was possible.

Asymmetric builds with ACs & PPCs were possible.

High mounted weapon hardpoints make for good snipers.


The Shadowhawk is tall, but it is not as wide as the Victor.



The Grasshopper is in the era of hoverjets.

It won't even be able to combine ACs with PPCs if that ever becomes a thing again.

Many builds will not be asymmetric (laser boating).

I has no primary weapon systems mounted high, only the one slot missile hardpoint in the head.




Logic tells me that the Grasshopper is going to be too large for it's own good.

It's going to be like Sparky vs. Enforcer. Take a look at how wildly different their scaling is, the Enforcer is easily the more survivable of the two.

and yet, even now, the SHD is a good solid chassis, in the era of non poptart, hoverjet mechs. Huh. Go figure.

Also, Sparky? Really? GRFs are almost as easy to tank in as a SHD.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 15 March 2015 - 12:07 PM.

[Ultimax]

Bishop Steiner, on 15 March 2015 - 12:06 PM, said:

and yet, even now, the SHD is a good solid chassis, in the era of non poptart, hoverjet mechs. Huh. Go figure.

You mean the 2K, really. The one with 3 head level mounted energy hardpoints that people put 3x LLAS/ERLLAS in.


If the GRH had 3 head level energy hardpoints, I promise I'd be singing a very different tune.

Bishop Steiner, on 15 March 2015 - 12:06 PM, said:

Also, Sparky? Really? GRFs are almost as easy to tank in as a SHD.

And yet compare it to the Enf.

I find Griffins much easier to both kill and die in than the Enforcers, which consistently surprise me with their resilience.

[Vassago Rain]

Creovex, on 15 March 2015 - 11:55 AM, said:

He has been saying that the last 3 years... Its white noise to most of us and probably PGI.....
-Phoenix Pack "Close your wallet, no CW"
-Clan Invasion "Close your wallet, no CW"
-CW "Close your wallet, Ghost Heat still exists..."
-Clan Wave 2 "Close your wallet I want an IS pack"
-Resistance Pack "Close your wallet I want a Clan Pack, and now this^^"

Most the people here need to get over these minor changes. Go make a game with the old models and argue how the TT looked better.... Look at this Jenner, it has a 4-story apartment building on it.... between the flying saucer cockpit that sits on a plank of wood connecting the saucer to the apartment complex... with long super model legs that have ZERO way to move forward... of a ship....... If PGI made it like this **** they would not have made it this far.

But I've never said those things. I don't care about ghost heat, ECM, LRMs, or any of the other popular problems.

My issues are with PGI the company, their business model, and management. That's why I've given them no money since 2012. Whenever I'm tempted, threads like this happen, and I'm reminded of why I don't pay for stuff in MWO.

I don't know, man. You guys wanna keep throwing money into the pit, feel free, but don't be surprised when others mock you, or you keep receiving poor, rushed products.