625 replies to this topic

[lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol]

LordKnightFandragon, on 22 March 2015 - 11:58 AM, said:

THe issue isnt they are to hot, they should be. THey should be hot to fire. The issue is they only deal 10 damage for that 15 heat.

Um, I disagree... you can't have TT/Lore Prime loadout, and not have TT/Lore "true DOUBLE heat sinks" for this mech because it makes it much hotter than originally intended. Just look at the Nova Prime.

[RazorbeastFXK3]

I'm slightly curious as to the extent of the "risk" of damage to the wielder of the ER PPC since it doesn't have the inhibitor on it but I've never noticed any damage done to my 'mech when using them unless the +5 heat is the extra damage for the extended range.

Also wondering why the PPC/ER PPC doesn't deal Heat Damage as well. I figure it would work the same as how it did in Mechwarrior 3 where, when you fired the PPC/ER PPC and connect with the target, the target would suffer a sudden small jump in heat.

I'm enjoying the current quirks available for the PPC and the ER PPC but still wasn't sure about the actual mechanics of it for mwomercs.

[Gorgo7]

After confabbing with Santa we decided that the underpowered Clan Omni-Mechs should get 50% bonuses to everything!

oh wait...

Santa doesn't exist!

Omni Mechs do not require quirks that boost performance. Just quirks that reduce their performance to manageable levels.

[FupDup]

Gorgo7, on 23 March 2015 - 02:32 PM, said:

After confabbing with Santa we decided that the underpowered Clan Omni-Mechs should get 50% bonuses to everything!

oh wait...

Santa doesn't exist!

Omni Mechs do not require quirks that boost performance. Just quirks that reduce their performance to manageable levels.

You do know that not all Clan Omnis are as lucky as the Mad Cat, Doomcrow, Dire Whale, and Loki...right?

[Dagorlad13]

FupDup, on 23 March 2015 - 02:45 PM, said:

You do know that not all Clan Omnis are as lucky as the Mad Cat, Doomcrow, Dire Whale, and Loki...right?

The Dire Wolf is probably the most difficult mech to level up and keep alive in the game. The Dire Wolf is only powerful when the mech it is targeting is not able to out maneuver it. Anyone who thinks otherwise has never owned or played a Dire Wolf.

[FupDup]

IronClaws, on 23 March 2015 - 03:02 PM, said:

The Dire Wolf is probably the most difficult mech to level up and keep alive in the game. The Dire Wolf is only powerful when the mech it is targeting is not able to out maneuver it. Anyone who thinks otherwise has never owned or played a Dire Wolf.

That applies more to chaotic pug queue people making mistakes than the mech itself. When the Whale is actually in a good position, and has a team that doesn't go full derp, it basically devours everything. It's the best assault because of its sheer unadulterated killing power. People leaving their team's Whales behind isn't a deficiency with the mech itself, it's a deficiency with the players. The same applies to the Whale being caught in a bad position.

In highly coordinated situations like comp play or good premades in the group queue, its weaknesses are marginalized. Even in puglandia they can eat through people, but of course there's also times when their derpy teammates leave them stranded alone (covered above).

[LordKnightFandragon]

00ohDstruct, on 22 March 2015 - 04:50 PM, said:

Um, I disagree... you can't have TT/Lore Prime loadout, and not have TT/Lore "true DOUBLE heat sinks" for this mech because it makes it much hotter than originally intended. Just look at the Nova Prime.

Yeah, I am with you there lol. But the point is, we have a TT lore loadout, with TT heat and no true dubs dealing 10 dmg vs the TT 15 but still for 15 heat...which really is just another ****** thing...

CERPPC...15/15, or for the love of sanity, atleast 13/14 or something...but 10/15? its getting really old firing 10 CERPPC into the torso of a mech, shutting down and watching the guy walk away...and firing into stripped torsos and watching the guy walk off....

CERPPC just needs its damage buffed, or is PGI to afraid that if they gave the Clans a 15/15 CERPPC they would cease using lasers entirely?

[Dagorlad13]

FupDup, on 23 March 2015 - 03:09 PM, said:

That applies more to chaotic pug queue people making mistakes than the mech itself. When the Whale is actually in a good position, and has a team that doesn't go full derp, it basically devours everything. It's the best assault because of its sheer unadulterated killing power. People leaving their team's Whales behind isn't a deficiency with the mech itself, it's a deficiency with the players. The same applies to the Whale being caught in a bad position.

In highly coordinated situations like comp play or good premades in the group queue, its weaknesses are marginalized. Even in puglandia they can eat through people, but of course there's also times when their derpy teammates leave them stranded alone (covered above).

Like I have said many times before, in multiple threads, Clan mechs as they are in MWO currently, are not OP, they only seem OP when they are piloted by a skilled pilot, or when they are part of a coordinated team. IS mechs are just as powerful under the same circumstances.

LordKnightFandragon, on 23 March 2015 - 05:18 PM, said:

Yeah, I am with you there lol. But the point is, we have a TT lore loadout, with TT heat and no true dubs dealing 10 dmg vs the TT 15 but still for 15 heat...which really is just another ****** thing...

CERPPC...15/15, or for the love of sanity, atleast 13/14 or something...but 10/15? its getting really old firing 10 CERPPC into the torso of a mech, shutting down and watching the guy walk away...and firing into stripped torsos and watching the guy walk off....

CERPPC just needs its damage buffed, or is PGI to afraid that if they gave the Clans a 15/15 CERPPC they would cease using lasers entirely?

If IS mechs can fire three ERLLs linked with no ghost heat penalty, then it is time to make the Clan ERPPC do 15 points of pinpoint damage like it is supposed to.

[FupDup]

IronClaws, on 23 March 2015 - 05:51 PM, said:

Like I have said many times before, in multiple threads, Clan mechs as they are in MWO currently, are not OP, they only seem OP when they are piloted by a skilled pilot, or when they are part of a coordinated team. IS mechs are just as powerful under the same circumstances.

I'm not generalizing all Clan mechs, right now all we're talking about is the Whale.

In the Whale's specific case, it's the best assault (if not abandoned) because it can oneshot or twoshot practically anything in the game if built certain ways, and its speed/agility weaknesses don't matter much when it has a good team with it.


Are there some Clan mechs that aren't that great? Yes, there absolutely are. The worst offender is probably the Mist Lynx, because "look ma, no arms!" There's also the Gargles, Nova, Ice Fridge, etc. that could use a bit of quirk loving. A few pages ago I also posted some proposed (significant) quirks for the Puma.

But the Dire Whale, on the other hand, is one of the few ones (probably 3-4 total that are that lucky) that doesn't need any help, it's already a top gundam. It's Tier 1 easily.

Edited by FupDup, 23 March 2015 - 06:01 PM.

[LordKnightFandragon]

IronClaws, on 23 March 2015 - 05:51 PM, said:

Like I have said many times before, in multiple threads, Clan mechs as they are in MWO currently, are not OP, they only seem OP when they are piloted by a skilled pilot, or when they are part of a coordinated team. IS mechs are just as powerful under the same circumstances.



If IS mechs can fire three ERLLs linked with no ghost heat penalty, then it is time to make the Clan ERPPC do 15 points of pinpoint damage like it is supposed to.

Given the laser vomit meta in general, its high time they give the clans atleast 1 other non-Gauss PPFLD weapon. How many other combos can you come up with equal to and more then a 15dmg PPC blast for less then 15 heat? Or atleast somewhere in the ballpark? Hell, lets start with 1 CLPL dealing 13dmg for 10 heat.....idgaf that its spread, the point is, the dmg is 13 for 10 heat, while a nice hot ass CERPPC is a 10 dmg weapon for 15 heat.

Ofc, the poor IS ERPPC, but atleast some mechs got that quirked nicely.


I would happily trade a 5s CD for a15 dmg 15 heat CERPPC. Atleast in quirk form for WHK. maybe just 13/1/1 /15 for the Adder and extra velocity and stuff. SUmmoner, it should straight up get 15/15, 30% velocity buff and cool down buff.

WHK: 15/15, 5s CD, 30% Velocity buff. delicious.

FupDup, on 23 March 2015 - 05:57 PM, said:

I'm not generalizing all Clan mechs, right now all we're talking about is the Whale.

In the Whale's specific case, it's the best assault (if not abandoned) because it can oneshot or twoshot practically anything in the game if built certain ways, and its speed/agility weaknesses don't matter much when it has a good team with it.


Are there some Clan mechs that aren't that great? Yes, there absolutely are. The worst offender is probably the Mist Lynx, because "look ma, no arms!" There's also the Gargles, Nova, Ice Fridge, etc. that could use a bit of quirk loving. A few pages ago I also posted some proposed (significant) quirks for the Puma.

But the Dire Whale, on the other hand, is one of the few ones (probably 3-4 total that are that lucky) that doesn't need any help, it's already a top gundam. It's Tier 1 easily.

Speaking of which, did Gargle's quirks even make a dent in it's level of suck? Reviewing some of hte clan quirk pass 1, I would vote an emphatic hell no...

[Dagorlad13]

FupDup, on 23 March 2015 - 05:57 PM, said:

I'm not generalizing all Clan mechs, right now all we're talking about is the Whale.

In the Whale's specific case, it's the best assault (if not abandoned) because it can oneshot or twoshot practically anything in the game if built certain ways, and its speed/agility weaknesses don't matter much when it has a good team with it.


Are there some Clan mechs that aren't that great? Yes, there absolutely are. The worst offender is probably the Mist Lynx, because "look ma, no arms!" There's also the Gargles, Nova, Ice Fridge, etc. that could use a bit of quirk loving. A few pages ago I also posted some proposed (significant) quirks for the Puma.

But the Dire Whale, on the other hand, is one of the few ones (probably 3-4 total that are that lucky) that doesn't need any help, it's already a top gundam. It's Tier 1 easily.

You can do the same Gauss / PPC loadout on a King Crab, which is much more maneuverable than a Dire Wolf. Yes the Crab would not have the 2.5 points of splash damage on either side, but the increase maneuverability more than makes up for it.

[FupDup]

IronClaws, on 23 March 2015 - 11:00 PM, said:

You can do the same Gauss / PPC loadout on a King Crab, which is much more maneuverable than a Dire Wolf. Yes the Crab would not have the 2.5 points of splash damage on either side, but the increase maneuverability more than makes up for it.

Crabby however can't do 6 UAC/5 for monster DPS (the Whale's sheer boating ability makes Clan UACs actually good) and 2 ERLL + 6 ERML + 2 Gauss (94 point megaalpha). Depending on the build, that Crabby might also die from losing 1 side torso (if XL).

Crab is probably more pug-friendly because it can usually keep up better, but as said earlier that's more of a problem with people who split up their team rather than a problem with the mechs. The Crabby does probably have more build variety (just for funzies) though via hardpoints and engine/internal tweaking.

[Dagorlad13]

FupDup, on 24 March 2015 - 09:34 AM, said:

Crabby however can't do 6 UAC/5 for monster DPS (the Whale's sheer boating ability makes Clan UACs actually good) and 2 ERLL + 6 ERML + 2 Gauss (94 point megaalpha). Depending on the build, that Crabby might also die from losing 1 side torso (if XL).

Crab is probably more pug-friendly because it can usually keep up better, but as said earlier that's more of a problem with people who split up their team rather than a problem with the mechs. The Crabby does probably have more build variety (just for funzies) though via hardpoints and engine/internal tweaking.

The 6 UAC/5 build requires the Dire Wolf to stand relatively still and maintain fire to do the full amount of damage, which leaves it very vulnerable to any mech that it is not targeting. The Crab can mount 4 Ultra AC/5s and two Large Lasers; the pinpoint damage of the four IS UAC/5s allow the crab to move and fire effectively. If the Clan UACs did pinpoint damage with a single slug like IS ADs, then I would agree that the 6UAC Dire might need some nerfs.

Edited by IronClaws, 24 March 2015 - 10:39 AM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

IronClaws, on 24 March 2015 - 10:37 AM, said:

The 6 UAC/5 build requires the Dire Wolf to stand relatively still and maintain fire to do the full amount of damage, which leaves it very vulnerable to any mech that it is not targeting. The Crab can mount 4 Ultra AC/5s and two Large Lasers; the pinpoint damage of the four IS UAC/5s allow the crab to move and fire effectively. If the Clan UACs did pinpoint damage with a single slug like IS ADs, then I would agree that the 6UAC Dire might need some nerfs.

You are more likely to run into a 5 UAC5-4 ERML Dire than anything. The problem with the Crab is that to mount that 4 UAC5-2 LL you are either running as fast as the Dire or are running an XL which are equal losing points for that mech. If you think it is hard to land CUAC shots on any slow assault, you overestimate the problems with them.

Either way, in a rapid fire fight like that, the specific builds don't necessarily matter, all that matters is who lands the first shots because after that, it is pretty much a done deal on who comes out alive.

[Dagorlad13]

WM Quicksilver, on 24 March 2015 - 11:01 AM, said:

You are more likely to run into a 5 UAC5-4 ERML Dire than anything. The problem with the Crab is that to mount that 4 UAC5-2 LL you are either running as fast as the Dire or are running an XL which are equal losing points for that mech. If you think it is hard to land CUAC shots on any slow assault, you overestimate the problems with them.

Either way, in a rapid fire fight like that, the specific builds don't necessarily matter, all that matters is who lands the first shots because after that, it is pretty much a done deal on who comes out alive.

The King Crab is all CT, with big, shield arms, so it can safely run an XL. One on one, the King Crab and Dire are pretty evenly matched.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

IronClaws, on 24 March 2015 - 11:28 AM, said:

The King Crab is all CT

The CT is smaller than the sides, just like the Whale and Warhawk. It is far away from being a giant CT like the Locust or Jenner.

IronClaws, on 24 March 2015 - 11:28 AM, said:

with big, shield arms

Again, they act as good of a shield as the Dire Wolf's arms do, in that they aren't good shield arms at all. The only mechs that tend to have good shield arms are humanoid mechs. The Cauldron Born and Shadow Cat will be one of the few bird profile mechs to have good shield arms as well thanks to arms being cockpit level rather than low hanging like the Crab.

Edited by WM Quicksilver, 24 March 2015 - 11:50 AM.

[Dagorlad13]

WM Quicksilver, on 24 March 2015 - 11:50 AM, said:

The CT is smaller than the sides, just like the Whale and Warhawk. It is far away from being a giant CT like the Locust or Jenner.


Again, they act as good of a shield as the Dire Wolf's arms do, in that they aren't good shield arms at all. The only mechs that tend to have good shield arms are humanoid mechs. The Cauldron Born and Shadow Cat will be one of the few bird profile mechs to have good shield arms as well thanks to arms being cockpit level rather than low hanging like the Crab.

Just the fact that the Crab can torso twist better than a Dire Wolf, makes the arms better for shielding.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

IronClaws, on 24 March 2015 - 12:13 PM, said:

Just the fact that the Crab can torso twist better than a Dire Wolf, makes the arms better for shielding.

They have to actually be inline and have a similar profile with the torso to be able to shield. They may be better at shielding than the Nova, but they suffer a similar fate in being near worthless for shielding a torso.

[Brandarr Gunnarson]

Can't speak to the other 'Mechs, but have to agree that the Summoner remains a joke (despite traditionally being a loved 'Mech)

Old quirks for Summoner were better but not enough.

I don't want to out-gun the TW; I want a mobile, jump capable heavy that it, at the least effective.

Besides a return to something like the old quirks, here is a summary of quirk changes I would like to see on the Summoner:

Speed: 5% -> 7.5%
JJs: 25% Thrust/Distance
Movement: Medium Type

And for the love of God, just unlock ES on it! Not everything has to be canon!

And if it were all canon, Summoner would be faster and jump way farther, anyway!

Please make it viable.

[LordKnightFandragon]

WM Quicksilver, on 24 March 2015 - 11:50 AM, said:

The CT is smaller than the sides, just like the Whale and Warhawk. It is far away from being a giant CT like the Locust or Jenner.


Again, they act as good of a shield as the Dire Wolf's arms do, in that they aren't good shield arms at all. The only mechs that tend to have good shield arms are humanoid mechs. The Cauldron Born and Shadow Cat will be one of the few bird profile mechs to have good shield arms as well thanks to arms being cockpit level rather than low hanging like the Crab.

To bad the Warhawk cant semi shield its ST with its arms, due to how low PGI decided to place them....when they should be fair bit higher up...if the bottom barrel was sitting where the upper barrel is now, that would be about right. WE should totally be able to see te upper gun from the cockpit, just like in MW2....or like the Zeus when an AC is on it.