625 replies to this topic

[Mike Forst]

Brandarr Gunnarson, on 24 March 2015 - 05:01 PM, said:

Can't speak to the other 'Mechs, but have to agree that the Summoner remains a joke (despite traditionally being a loved 'Mech)

Old quirks for Summoner were better but not enough.

I don't want to out-gun the TW; I want a mobile, jump capable heavy that it, at the least effective.

Besides a return to something like the old quirks, here is a summary of quirk changes I would like to see on the Summoner:

Speed: 5% -> 7.5%
JJs: 25% Thrust/Distance
Movement: Medium Type

And for the love of God, just unlock ES on it! Not everything has to be canon!

And if it were all canon, Summoner would be faster and jump way farther, anyway!

Please make it viable.

Unfortunately, the quirks system cannot affect jump jets in any way (at least at this point in time.) Likewise, they cannot alter anything to do with the movement profile.

[Metus regem]

Mike Forst, on 25 March 2015 - 09:47 AM, said:

Unfortunately, the quirks system cannot affect jump jets in any way (at least at this point in time.) Likewise, they cannot alter anything to do with the movement profile.

Are you 100% certain on that Mr. Forst? I mean they did alter the Gargoyle's hill-climb ability by changing or adding a line to the code for it...

[Revis Volek]

Kin3ticX, on 16 March 2015 - 12:37 PM, said:

PGI has to be careful with quirks, even with mechs that are considered somewhat underdog or starved of podspace/hardpoints. The Gargoyle has some capable laser vomit builds(especially with the bonus variant). Proton and Writhen are driving the 6ERML, 6ERSL, 27DHS "Mangoyle" and doing amazing against the general group queue.

I do AWESOME against the general queue in a stock gargoyle.... whats your point? Just because some can doesn't mean it good. This has been gone over MANY, MANY times!

You really think a 6 ERSML gargoyle ( a loudout a 35 ton IS mech can do BETTER) is something to fear?

Mike Forst, on 25 March 2015 - 09:47 AM, said:

Unfortunately, the quirks system cannot affect jump jets in any way (at least at this point in time.) Likewise, they cannot alter anything to do with the movement profile.

Thats rather vauge....SMN? Or do you mean the Movement archtype and such?

Cuz im pretty sure you made the SMN more nimble and have a higher top speed which is MOVEMENT ASSOCIATED but not necessarily the MOVEMENT PROFILE if i have my MWO semantics correct that is.

Edited by DarthRevis, 25 March 2015 - 09:58 AM.

[Summon3r]

Brandarr Gunnarson, on 24 March 2015 - 05:01 PM, said:

Can't speak to the other 'Mechs, but have to agree that the Summoner remains a joke (despite traditionally being a loved 'Mech)

Old quirks for Summoner were better but not enough.

I don't want to out-gun the TW; I want a mobile, jump capable heavy that it, at the least effective.

Besides a return to something like the old quirks, here is a summary of quirk changes I would like to see on the Summoner:

Speed: 5% -> 7.5%
JJs: 25% Thrust/Distance
Movement: Medium Type

And for the love of God, just unlock ES on it! Not everything has to be canon!

And if it were all canon, Summoner would be faster and jump way farther, anyway!

Please make it viable.

+1, i can understand not unlocking endo... but as you say this mech absolutely needs a JJ thrust boost... if it is not possible (just yet) it at least needs some legitimate cooldown quirks. for example the the prime LA absolutely needs to go back to 10% ballistic cooldown and then on top of that like 10% lbx cooldown, same for right arm or PRIME 10% energy cooldown and 10% erppc cooldown.

those changes would still leave the PRIME less then to be desired but would make it fun to drive.... tbh i dont see why the lbx10 cant be like the CN9-D what is it 40% cooldown? and you still rarely see them running around spamming lbx10.

Edited by Summon3r, 25 March 2015 - 09:56 AM.

[Mike Forst]

DarthRevis, on 25 March 2015 - 09:55 AM, said:

I do AWESOME against the general queue in a stock gargoyle.... whats your point? Just because some can doesn't mean it good. This has been gone over MANY, MANY times!

You really think a 6 ERSML gargoyle ( a loudout a 35 ton IS mech can do BETTER) is something to fear?




Thats rather vauge....SMN? Or do you mean the Movement archtype and such?

Cuz im pretty sure you made the SMN more nimble and have a higher top speed which is MOVEMENT ASSOCIATED but not necessarily the MOVEMENT PROFILE if i have my MWO semantics correct that is.

Quirks can change the Acceleration/Decelration Rates, Turn Speed, Reverse Speed, Max Speed and all sorts of torso and arm movement rates.

They cannot alter the underlying movement profile itself that affects hill climbing and how a mech's collision interacts with the geometry.

That is what you are asking for when you want it changed to the Medium type and that cannot be done via quirks.

Metus regem, on 25 March 2015 - 09:54 AM, said:

Are you 100% certain on that Mr. Forst? I mean they did alter the Gargoyle's hill-climb ability by changing or adding a line to the code for it...

I don't have the ability to change any of those settings.

[Metus regem]

Mike Forst, on 25 March 2015 - 10:16 AM, said:

Quirks can change the Acceleration/Decelration Rates, Turn Speed, Reverse Speed, Max Speed and all sorts of torso and arm movement rates.

They cannot alter the underlying movement profile itself that affects hill climbing and how a mech's collision interacts with the geometry.

That is what you are asking for when you want it changed to the Medium type and that cannot be done via quirks.



I don't have the ability to change any of those settings.

Okay that makes sense to me, then what about going about giving it quriks that let it mimic those of the medium movement archtype? Such as the mentioned:

Acceleration/Decelration Rates
Turn Speed
Reverse Speed
Max Speed
all sorts of torso and arm movement rates
And perhaps adjusting the hill-climb to match?


I push on this subject, as it really annoyed me that the Timber Wolf S was added over the D when they were introduced, as the S, basically did everything the Summoner does, but better... I would love to have seen the reason to chose the Summoner over the Timber Wolf being mobility as well as Jump Jets.

[Brother Sherlock]

it appears the latest patch comes with a computer virus. can this be fixed?

[Gorgo7]

Clan Mechs require nothing to make them "more competative" with the IS mechs. Ton for ton they are all superior machines to the quirked IS machines.
ALL OF THEM.
Perhaps a re-balancing regarding themselves is in order but at the end of the day they are omni mechs and you pay for the superior design by not having as much stand out "quirks" as the IS.
This thread is a self perpetuating myth based upon Clanners wants and desires. There is zero logic here.
Get over yourselves.
Want proof?
How about 250 vs. 240 or even 255 vs. 240. This is not being instituted to punish the clan it is simply a blancing act for IS vs. Clan EVEN AFTER the quirk system was brought in.
Notice how few Clanners wish to fight other clanners. That is not because of any central clan philosophy but because of the ease they have fighting the IS.
This WHOLE thread is devoted to making it easier for the clan to fight the IS not as a balancing feature.

Shame on you.

[Mcgral18]

Gorgo7, on 25 March 2015 - 01:13 PM, said:

ALL OF THEM.

[Mike Forst]

Metus regem, on 25 March 2015 - 11:50 AM, said:

Okay that makes sense to me, then what about going about giving it quriks that let it mimic those of the medium movement archtype? Such as the mentioned: Acceleration/Decelration Rates Turn Speed Reverse Speed Max Speed all sorts of torso and arm movement rates And perhaps adjusting the hill-climb to match? I push on this subject, as it really annoyed me that the Timber Wolf S was added over the D when they were introduced, as the S, basically did everything the Summoner does, but better... I would love to have seen the reason to chose the Summoner over the Timber Wolf being mobility as well as Jump Jets.

Acceleration/deceleration and turn/reverse/max speed are functions of the engine size, not the movement archetype. The hill climb values cannot be quirked at this time, nor do I have the ability to adjust them.

[Wildstreak]

Gorgo7, on 25 March 2015 - 01:13 PM, said:

Clan Mechs require nothing to make them "more competative" with the IS mechs. Ton for ton they are all superior machines to the quirked IS machines.
ALL OF THEM.

Adder vs any IS 35 tonner.
Thanks.
Have fun.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Mike Forst, on 25 March 2015 - 01:57 PM, said:

Acceleration/deceleration and turn/reverse/max speed are functions of the engine size, not the movement archetype. The hill climb values cannot be quirked at this time, nor do I have the ability to adjust them.

Do you have the power to suggest to Russ about changing the classification of movement archetypes to something else, like traversal archetype or hill climb archetype so it is less confusing to people not already in the know? Just so you can avoid having to clarify that all the time.

Without any knowledge about this looking through game files or from word of mouth, it is too easy of an assumption to make that the archetypes affect maneuverability and not just the ability to climb a hill thanks to the nomenclature.

[Mike Forst]

I can suggest it but it's unlikely that any changes would be made to the names inside the game files (it's a LOT of work) so I'm not sure how much changing it would help the matter.

[FupDup]

While you're here Frost...is it possible to quirk the RoF attribute of MGs and AMS? There's already a module for AMS RoF, so I would think so...

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Mike Forst, on 25 March 2015 - 03:05 PM, said:

I can suggest it but it's unlikely that any changes would be made to the names inside the game files (it's a LOT of work) so I'm not sure how much changing it would help the matter.

Just changing it as far as the UI goes would do it, no need to mess with the innards of game files. I only suggest it so you (or other devs) don't have to clarify that every time because it is sort of misleading.

[Wintersdark]

WM Quicksilver, on 25 March 2015 - 03:10 PM, said:

Just changing it as far as the UI goes would do it, no need to mess with the innards of game files. I only suggest it so you (or other devs) don't have to clarify that every time because it is sort of misleading.

Movement archetype isn't shown in the UI, is it?

[Wintersdark]

FupDup, on 25 March 2015 - 03:10 PM, said:

While you're here Frost...is it possible to quirk the RoF attribute of MGs and AMS? There's already a module for AMS RoF, so I would think so...

AMS RoF quirk would be really cool, as would range. Not useful for everyone, but it would make improve a mech fairly noticeably in pugging and mid-level play where LRM's are common.


Mr. Frost: Flamers. They're garbage, and I think everyone expects them to remain so. If there's no internal interest in making them not-garbage, could you consider a ridiculously OP (in numerical terms) Flamer buff for the Adder? Something that could make it's hardmounted Flamer actually useful instead of a 1T dead weight?

Edited by Wintersdark, 25 March 2015 - 03:25 PM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Wintersdark, on 25 March 2015 - 03:20 PM, said:

Movement archetype isn't shown in the UI, is it?

For some reason I thought it was, but I don't see it so I guess not. Though it would be nice to have in the UI, we will have to see if UI2.5 gains that. Either way when releasing new mechs it could be named something else in the patch notes.

Wintersdark, on 25 March 2015 - 03:24 PM, said:

AMS RoF quirk would be really cool, as would range. Not useful for everyone, but it would make improve a mech fairly noticeably in pugging and mid-level play where LRM's are common.


Mr. Frost: Flamers. They're garbage, and I think everyone expects them to remain so. If there's no internal interest in making them not-garbage, could you consider a ridiculously OP (in numerical terms) Flamer buff for the Adder? Something that could make it's hardmounted Flamer actually useful instead of a 1T dead weight?

Pretty sure the range will never be buffed due to the animation for it. It is the only non-missile weapon who's range and max range is the same. It is also only 0.5T since it is a Clan Flamer

Edited by WM Quicksilver, 25 March 2015 - 03:27 PM.

[Mike Forst]

Wintersdark, on 25 March 2015 - 03:24 PM, said:

AMS RoF quirk would be really cool, as would range. Not useful for everyone, but it would make improve a mech fairly noticeably in pugging and mid-level play where LRM's are common. Mr. Frost: Flamers. They're garbage, and I think everyone expects them to remain so. If there's no internal interest in making them not-garbage, could you consider a ridiculously OP (in numerical terms) Flamer buff for the Adder? Something that could make it's hardmounted Flamer actually useful instead of a 1T dead weight?

From what I know, it's just best to leave flamers be for now. I'm not the best qualified to speak as to why though. I can try to get you some answers on that topic.

FupDup, on 25 March 2015 - 03:10 PM, said:

While you're here Frost...is it possible to quirk the RoF attribute of MGs and AMS? There's already a module for AMS RoF, so I would think so...

Maybe.

[Alistair Winter]

Mike Forst, on 25 March 2015 - 04:07 PM, said:

From what I know, it's just best to leave flamers be for now. I'm not the best qualified to speak as to why though. I can try to get you some answers on that topic.

Please! Yes! We've been begging for an answer about that for years, literally! Would be much appreciated.