56 replies to this topic

[Tarogato]

ShinVector, on 23 March 2015 - 07:36 PM, said:

Did your premium time run out ?

A: I thought premium didn't affect contract bonsus
B: No, I'm getting more rewards today than I was all weekend, and I've had premium intermittently from the event.

[ShinVector]

Tarogato, on 23 March 2015 - 08:16 PM, said:

A: I thought premium didn't affect contract bonsus
B: No, I'm getting more rewards today than I was all weekend, and I've had premium intermittently from the event.

I think it does... I am suppose to have 100K contract on a win but I get 150K instead.
So it seems premium gives %50 contract cbill/LP bonus.

Edited by ShinVector, 23 March 2015 - 09:09 PM.

[Revis Volek]

Shimmering Sword, on 23 March 2015 - 03:02 PM, said:

Davion has been pummeled on all sides over the past 2 months, and is currently being eaten by Liao. If "doing kinda ok" factions like Marik get an income boost, when will Davion get theirs?

and when will Kurita stop being one of the highest paid? Been a long time and they have many, many units already.

Davers, on 23 March 2015 - 06:14 PM, said:

These regards rewards don't seem to translate into how CW is working though. Kurita has the manpower to fight multiple factions, yet receives the max bonus rewards? Davion has no bonus rewards and loses consistently to all it's neighbours?

im just gonna repeat this one....the wolves too. Poor pups...

Edited by DarthRevis, 23 March 2015 - 09:17 PM.

[Elizander]

Shimmering Sword, on 23 March 2015 - 03:02 PM, said:

Davion has been pummeled on all sides over the past 2 months, and is currently being eaten by Liao. If "doing kinda ok" factions like Marik get an income boost, when will Davion get theirs?

I lose like 99% of my pug matches in CW so the reward actually doesn't matter to me. I just get by with the 200-600 loyalty points I get from fighting. If this is an incentive, it certainly isn't much of an incentive for pugs but I suppose organized units benefit from the bonus quite often.

Edited by Elizander, 23 March 2015 - 09:43 PM.

[Tarogato]

Elizander, on 23 March 2015 - 09:38 PM, said:

I lose like 99% of my pug matches in CW so the reward actually doesn't matter to me. I just get by with the 200-600 loyalty points I get from fighting. If this is an incentive, it certainly isn't much of an incentive for pugs but I suppose organized units benefit from the bonus quite often.

At lease you said "like", because 99% is probably a gross overstatement. Start actually tracking your W/L. =P
I only lose ~60% of my pug matches and only win ~80% of my group drops. Sample size is only 27 matches altogether because I started recently, but it's growing.

However, the inherent problem with your post is the word "pug" in the first place. Don't play pug - just... don't do it. Find a teamspeak that keeps a group going and join it. Last I heard Liao had a nice faction-wide TS server. If it's not being used, come play with the FRR guys, we've been making great use of our TS FRR Hub (hence that 80% winrate of mine), and we're very friendly. We're not tryhard, but we're not garbage, either.

[luxebo]

Tank, on 23 March 2015 - 03:35 PM, said:

What nerf? Rasalgue is better off without easy riders seeking easy fights. Besides your system is flawed - Clans would get the second best rewards after us, witch will lead to most possible overflow of mercs on their side.
Why won't they come to us? Because CW is a hard mode and fighting for FRR is pure insanity. Most of people out there seek easy victories.
Rewards are more the adequate.

Davers, on 23 March 2015 - 06:14 PM, said:

These regards don't seem to translate into how CW is working though. Kurita has the manpower to fight multiple factions, yet receives the max bonus rewards? Davion has no bonus rewards and loses consistently to all it's neighbours?

Right here is the answer Tank. Davion doesn't receive any bonuses as it's a huge population with losses from all sides. Yet Kurita has a small population (I don't think it's that small though, they have QQ Mercs on their side), and therefore gets double the bonuses for winning, just because there are less people with the dragon tag than a sword tag.

If a faction was struggling that faction would gain more, not due to low population numbers. Clans are obviously not struggling (except maybe hibernating Bear not making much of a move), so the rest of the Clans get a lesser bonus. However Davion, Steiner, FRR, possibly Kurita?, and possibly Marik? all need some help on the constant losses our factions has been in. (Mostly the first three, maybe Kurita but I think they are holding well if not doing much better than before despite a surrounded capital, and Marik hasn't really gained much recently.)

We lost 30 LP bonus, which isn't too bad but it sorta sucks considering we couldn't have been losing that much more over time.

[Deathlike]

DarthRevis, on 23 March 2015 - 09:14 PM, said:

and when will Kurita stop being one of the highest paid? Been a long time and they have many, many units already.

Probably never?

Note that Kurita has multiple fronts and that's not their fault for having that many fronts.

Quote

im just gonna repeat this one....the wolves too. Poor pups...

I'm not feeling bad for Wolf considering they have Mercstar on their side at this point in time.

mrripley9, on 23 March 2015 - 06:46 PM, said:

PGI, it would be nice if Steiner and Davion ACTUALLY GOT REWARDS. They've been fighting for TWO MONTHS on so many fronts and we don't really have a lot of people, other than pugs, and most of the people who are Davion don't even play CW. Please change something.

I lean towards no on that.

While I believe the planet count actually suggests massive losses on both factions (though, the Davion stuff is kinda inexcusable due to not having a clan front - something a Steiner could claim), but if your faction has the most people and aren't getting any better... maybe it's not entirely the fault of the Clans for that.

But hey... it's Steiner and Davion... the most noted Houses in the IS...

Edited by Deathlike, 24 March 2015 - 12:17 AM.

[Kinski Orlawisch]

I don t understand why this Little boost has such an Impact to the Players. One game gives 600.000 C Bills and more. What are 25.000 Bonus? Or in LP. 900 to 2500 and a 25 boost Impacts the Player....is everybody braindead or do I oversee something?

[Deathlike]

Marc von der Heide, on 24 March 2015 - 12:24 AM, said:

I don t understand why this Little boost has such an Impact to the Players. One game gives 600.000 C Bills and more. What are 25.000 Bonus? Or in LP. 900 to 2500 and a 25 boost Impacts the Player....is everybody braindead or do I oversee something?

Well, the values also accounts for Ghost Drops... not that such drops should be rewarded well.

A regular drop and a ghost drop are technically considered "the same" at the moment.

[Loganauer]

The Free Rasalhague Republic was reduced to a single planet because clans for some reason don't like taking capitals, and you're giving them the same bonus as Kurita and Liao? Really?

Why not have a better bonus for people who accept permanent contracts like increased rewards from general matches to bring people who are otherwise afk into the fold. Maybe something to help pugs against premades, maybe make massive rewards for specific factions specifically if a planet is gained or lost.

From a lore perspective, why is Rasalhague our magical protected zone instead of Tukkayid? Our faction was essentially annihilated due to PGIs inability to balance the game, and we should at least get something to make it up to us.


Perhaps make a capacity on how many planets can be conquered of a faction so that CW stays at least -roughly- consistent with lore so we'd have 6 planets that don't get conquered, they can be attacked but don't flip.

Edited by Loganauer, 24 March 2015 - 12:44 AM.

[Elizander]

Tarogato, on 23 March 2015 - 10:28 PM, said:

At lease you said "like", because 99% is probably a gross overstatement. Start actually tracking your W/L. =P
I only lose ~60% of my pug matches and only win ~80% of my group drops. Sample size is only 27 matches altogether because I started recently, but it's growing.

However, the inherent problem with your post is the word "pug" in the first place. Don't play pug - just... don't do it. Find a teamspeak that keeps a group going and join it. Last I heard Liao had a nice faction-wide TS server. If it's not being used, come play with the FRR guys, we've been making great use of our TS FRR Hub (hence that 80% winrate of mine), and we're very friendly. We're not tryhard, but we're not garbage, either.

I've won CW twice out of 12 battles and one of them was actually a ghost drop so the only official win is 1. Pug is an option in the game. Without pugs to fill up the groups there won't be a lot of people to fight with and no one for groups to stomp. It's a feature presented in the game where I can queue up by myself and others will do the same and we can be put up against more organized groups which is fine, but that doesn't change the fact that a lot of pug drops end up as losses. I am not complaining about pug drops in general, but I am saying that reward changes don't matter to me simply because I lose most of the time in CW.

If random pugs were not needed to make CW work then PGI would have simply locked anyone out and require a 12 man like their original plan. The fact that they allow pugs in means the population cannot support 12-man only groups and pugs are needed as fillers.

I'm fine with losing and getting 500 loyalty points. It makes the loyalty rewards from winning pretty trivial to be honest.

[Tarogato]

Elizander, on 24 March 2015 - 01:51 AM, said:

I've won CW twice out of 12 battles and one of them was actually a ghost drop so the only official win is 1. Pug is an option in the game. Without pugs to fill up the groups there won't be a lot of people to fight with and no one for groups to stomp. It's a feature presented in the game where I can queue up by myself and others will do the same and we can be put up against more organized groups which is fine, but that doesn't change the fact that a lot of pug drops end up as losses. I am not complaining about pug drops in general, but I am saying that reward changes don't matter to me simply because I lose most of the time in CW.

If random pugs were not needed to make CW work then PGI would have simply locked anyone out and require a 12 man like their original plan. The fact that they allow pugs in means the population cannot support 12-man only groups and pugs are needed as fillers.

I'm fine with losing and getting 500 loyalty points. It makes the loyalty rewards from winning pretty trivial to be honest.

If everybody who plays as a pug looked for a group, unit, or TS server to drop with instead, they wouldn't have to be pugs anymore, and they'd be having a lot more fun. For instance, there's a guy named Theaus in the FRR who recruits pugs left and right. Every pug he comes across he tries to give them a new home. The unit is called Sons of Odin and it's starting to get kinda large by now. Because he literally recruits anybody he can, it's not exactly the most competitive group, but at the very least it's a somewhat organised group and they seem like they're having a lot of fun doing it. This is the type of attitude we need to have about CW.

You don't need to suffer alone in pugland forever. =3

[sycocys]

Never made much sense to me either why the short contract was rewarded so much better (because you can simply bounce away) than the permanent contract. Giving mercs and short timers the same rewards as those that are willing to battle for only one unit seems kind of short sighted.

Also why wasn't FRR buffed up even slightly? We are probably the lowest population faction of active players?

Seriously though - boost permanent contract match rewards.

[Elizander]

Tarogato, on 24 March 2015 - 02:11 AM, said:

If everybody who plays as a pug looked for a group, unit, or TS server to drop with instead, they wouldn't have to be pugs anymore, and they'd be having a lot more fun. For instance, there's a guy named Theaus in the FRR who recruits pugs left and right. Every pug he comes across he tries to give them a new home. The unit is called Sons of Odin and it's starting to get kinda large by now. Because he literally recruits anybody he can, it's not exactly the most competitive group, but at the very least it's a somewhat organised group and they seem like they're having a lot of fun doing it. This is the type of attitude we need to have about CW.

You don't need to suffer alone in pugland forever. =3

You do understand that the majority of players will just want to click the defend button without having to go outside of the game, right? Getting one or a dozen more people into a group won't change the overall landscape of solo pugs going to CW. It's like getting one poor orphan from the slums and giving him a good home, but it won't change the situation where he came from for the rest. The point is that solo queue is a feature and you cannot fault people for using that feature.

This problem isn't unique to MWO mind you. If you try to queue for a dungeon in Tera Online, especially the harder ones, you'll have the same experience of clueless/inexperienced/undergeared partymates. I'm sure a lot of other games have the same issue.

My point simply is that the win reward is so small that it doesn't bother me at all not getting it. CW for me right now is going in, trying to get around a thousand damage and collecting that 500 loyalty points. Some better players say they can get 1,000-1,500 loyalty even when losing.

If they really want it to matter more, they can add more objectives rather than just the base reward. Let's say you REALLY want people to join Davion (just as an example) you can add a mission where players need to get 10-20 wins under Davion contract and they win 1-3 Mechbays, a random color or camo, and/or (this is where I have problems since there are not enough shiny things that PGI can give away. Notice the Loyalty rewards are mostly stuff that already exists).

Custom Camo Mechs (like heroes but no c-bill bonus) would be great especially if the camo is for the House/Clan specifically. Special warhorns, purple lasers, you know, stuff you can't get from the store. It's dev intensive for the assets/art team and any logical thinker would rather set those work hours for something that you can directly sell for profit rather than to patch up a feature with ambiguous returns.

Heck, I'd go with renamed 'branded' weapons like Martell Medium Laser or Omicron 3000 Medium Laser just for personal fluff. Having a Luxor Devastator 20 AC/20 or a Magna Firestar ER PPC which your enemy can see when they check your loadout in battle would be fun and add more flavor to the game and these are just weapon renames. PGI can make them color purple too cause they're epic. Weapon color in loadouts when checked by enemy can change color the more kills the weapon has so the enemy will know you can at least hit stuff with those.

They can go the route of Dota 2 and make these special weapons track kill shots and what not, adding more fluff without changing balance.

Anyway, that's just what I think is missing from CW for rewards. Rewarding me more of the same for winning isn't as fun.

Edit:

I also think that active units are not given enough spotlight. When people log in they should see which units did well capturing and defending planets in a news feed for the last cycle and a log of the last few cycles kept in there for good measure. As a casual player I have no clue who is fighting for who so I can't say I'm all that involved in or aware of what units are doing these days. It can make players curious and want to join them if they are given more praise.

Edited by Elizander, 24 March 2015 - 03:01 AM.

[Tarogato]

Elizander, on 24 March 2015 - 02:56 AM, said:

You do understand that the majority of players will just want to click the defend button without having to go outside of the game, right? Getting one or a dozen more people into a group won't change the overall landscape of solo pugs going to CW. It's like getting one poor orphan from the slums and giving him a good home, but it won't change the situation where he came from for the rest. The point is that solo queue is a feature and you cannot fault people for using that feature.

This problem isn't unique to MWO mind you. If you try to queue for a dungeon in Tera Online, especially the harder ones, you'll have the same experience of clueless/inexperienced/undergeared partymates. I'm sure a lot of other games have the same issue.

My point simply is that the win reward is so small that it doesn't bother me at all not getting it. CW for me right now is going in, trying to get around a thousand damage and collecting that 500 loyalty points. Some better players say they can get 1,000-1,500 loyalty even when losing.

If they really want it to matter more, they can add more objectives rather than just the base reward. Let's say you REALLY want people to join Davion (just as an example) you can add a mission where players need to get 10-20 wins under Davion contract and they win 1-3 Mechbays, a random color or camo, and/or (this is where I have problems since there are not enough shiny things that PGI can give away. Notice the Loyalty rewards are mostly stuff that already exists).

Custom Camo Mechs (like heroes but no c-bill bonus) would be great especially if the camo is for the House/Clan specifically. Special warhorns, purple lasers, you know, stuff you can't get from the store. It's dev intensive for the assets/art team and any logical thinker would rather set those work hours for something that you can directly sell for profit rather than to patch up a feature with ambiguous returns.

Heck, I'd go with renamed 'branded' weapons like Martell Medium Laser or Omicron 3000 Medium Laser just for personal fluff. Having a Luxor Devastator 20 AC/20 or a Magna Firestar ER PPC which your enemy can see when they check your loadout in battle would be fun and add more flavor to the game and these are just weapon renames. PGI can make them color purple too cause they're epic. Weapon color in loadouts when checked by enemy can change color the more kills the weapon has so the enemy will know you can at least hit stuff with those.

They can go the route of Dota 2 and make these special weapons track kill shots and what not, adding more fluff without changing balance.

Anyway, that's just what I think is missing from CW for rewards. Rewarding me more of the same for winning isn't as fun.

Edit:

I also think that active units are not given enough spotlight. When people log in they should see which units did well capturing and defending planets in a news feed for the last cycle and a log of the last few cycles kept in there for good measure. As a casual player I have no clue who is fighting for who so I can't say I'm all that involved in or aware of what units are doing these days. It can make players curious and want to join them if they are given more praise.

A good post with all good suggestions that I'd LOVE to see PGI consider.

You're right that "the masses" would prefer to just log in and just play an instant CW match without all the fuss of finding a unit or TS hub outside of the game. That still doesn't change the fact that it's the worst way to play CW and there are still things that need to be done to encourage people to put in the effort of finding a group to play with. Again, you made some good suggestions up there. Also, PGI is bringing in some basic Looking For Group functionality to the UI, so that will be a step in the right direction.

But since I'm talking to you personally and you're lamenting on your own personal CW experiences... and as somebody who already goes through the effort of posting extensively on the forums, I don't see why you can't find a group to play with so you can be on the lucrative winning side of things for once. You have plenty of options and I'm sure you know where to look, you just need to do it. You would always be welcome in the FRR if you're willing to leave the Green Arm behind.

The only reason I see that could hold you back is your region. I feel like Oceania doesn't play CW at all, sometimes. The most active hours are 1am to 1pm in your time zone. If you are stuck playing outside of that window, then I understand your frustration - there's simply not many options and opportunities during the Filipino day/evening. My unit has an Oceanic subset, so again, if you were interested in FRR you might find some opportunities, even if small, in the Isengrim.

[Kshat]

If you want to improve the atraction of House Marik, maybe you should consider some tweaks in your attack system. Shouldn't been a problem to construct some "lend lease"-agreement to justify Marik and Davion-units joining the fun against the clans lorewise.
Otherwise, I've seen some units defecting to the clans which I'm really happy about.

In principle, I would like to see some kind of regulation to ghost drops. I fully accept that a planet can't be defended by the sole virtue of "if we don't fight, we can't loose", but given the fact that players in this game are divided into timezones it just isn't possible to be ready for defensive drops all the time.
And it is really frustrating to see planets switch due to almost solely ghost drops over night.

To add some "spice" to the fun: what the hell is up with the CW-software which decides our attack vectors? I mean, our border to Clan Jade Falcon measures almost half the friggin Inner Sphere, and during the weekend there had been at least one full day where we had no single attack vector on clan space. I mean... I can't believe CJF is in need of such dishonorable measures therefore I believe it's a bug. So please do House Marik a favour and supply us with a constant flow of attack vectors on clan space.

[Dawnstealer]

The best we can do in Steiner, when we DON'T have the merc units, is hold the line, and that's it. And truth be told, we don't even do that well as evidenced by the fact that our faction (I'm pretty sure) has lost more worlds than any other. Marik, on the flip-side has WON more worlds than any other.

These rewards make no sense.

[Modo44]

This has been nagging at me for a while. Should it not be ComStarNews instead of InnerSphereNews?

[Dawnstealer]

sycocys, on 24 March 2015 - 02:38 AM, said:

Never made much sense to me either why the short contract was rewarded so much better (because you can simply bounce away) than the permanent contract. Giving mercs and short timers the same rewards as those that are willing to battle for only one unit seems kind of short sighted.

Also why wasn't FRR buffed up even slightly? We are probably the lowest population faction of active players?

Seriously though - boost permanent contract match rewards.

This is my thought, too. The reward for being a merc is the freedom to play for any faction you want. The reward for being permanent is...

What, exactly?

I realize in the RP/TT game, the reward would be "YOU'RE A MEMBER OF HOUSE STEINER!! [or whatever]" But in this game, where it's really become more of "where do the mercs play next?" than "House units win the day!"

Kurita's an exception on that one, but for everyone else, it's just feast or famine and waiting for the mercs to come. Bump rewards for loyal units, especially permanent players, way, way up.

[YCSLiesmith]

Shimmering Sword, on 23 March 2015 - 03:02 PM, said:

Davion has been pummeled on all sides over the past 2 months, and is currently being eaten by Liao. If "doing kinda ok" factions like Marik get an income boost, when will Davion get theirs?

davion has only two fronts and gets a lot of the new players anyhow.

Edited by YCSLiesmith, 24 March 2015 - 05:15 AM.