95 replies to this topic

[Slambot]

Yeah shield arms... lol THAT makes up for the massive difference in alphas. You forget that almost all IS mechs depend on arm mounted weapons and not a single mech I listed uses shield arms. In fact, all of them depend on arm mounted weaponry. Take off a dragon's or a griffins right arm and see what happens.

The clan UAC5 is an awesome weapon in the hands of a skilled pilot.
One ams cant make up for the half-weight of clan lrms. Also, as I stated, lrms are pretty dead in cw.
9 variants is entirely correct for clan ECM mechs. (only one hellbringer variant mounts ecm, but I challenge you to find one of the other two variants that doesn't run ECM as well.)

SCRs and Timbers are two of the most resilient mechs in the game period. I can't even begin to wonder where you came up with the opinion that they aren't.

Clan srms are NOT less effective than IS. In fact, you can mount SRM + artemis for LESS tonnage than IS standard variants. Several of my mech builds use SRMs and they are devastating at close range.

Notice you didn't mention streaks...

Not many people use PPCs. The heat to damage ratio is horrendous yes. Yet, the clan PPC is not useless and is viable on a couple mechs that can mount 20+ heat sinks. You forget also, that IS PPCs are heavier, and take up more space. The standard PPC has only 540m range and does 0 damage inside 90m.

Clan gauss...really...12 tons, 5 crits 15 damage
IS gauss 15 tons 6 crits 15 damage...

C-ER large lasers 4 tons, 1 crit 740m range ...11 damage
IS ER large laser 5 tons 2 crit 675m range... 9 damage

C-ER med laser 1ton 1 crit 405m range 7 damage
IS med laser 1 ton 1 crit 270m range 5 damage

C-med pulse laser 2 tons 1 crit 7 damage 330m range
IS med pulse laser 2 tons 1 crit 6 damage 220m range

hell your small laser variants are viable with their 200+ m ranges

It really only comes down to tactics. The IS must force a close range situation or they will lose. The Clans MUST keep the IS at range or they will overheat and lose.

Do I favor nerfing clans... no
Do I favor buffing IS... not really, they just need a medium or a heavy that's useful for CW that can mount ECM.

[Slambot]

Clans are also about to get decent light mechs, a literally devastating 45 ton mech, a really nasty heavy and an assault that I withhold judgement on. The clan light rush is gonna be on.

[Bwelt29]

Not to disagree with the OP but I think this is the BIGGEST reason the Clans lost this weekend:

http://mwomercs.com/...4#entry4332374.

Hard to justify winning 53% of the matches but still losing 50 plus worlds other than CW is in (BETA). No to mention in a couple of weeks we are looking at a map reset.

Edited by Maverick Brewer, 02 April 2015 - 12:29 PM.

[Czarr]

Guys , thier is nothing wrong with the mechs it's an even game right , in fact Russ even said the clans won 55% of all drops in the event weekend. The reason why clans lost planets is because the attack/defend que is bugged to make the larger faction progress and not the lower populated faction

[Lord0fHats]

Slambot, on 02 April 2015 - 11:48 AM, said:

Yeah shield arms... lol

When using an IS XL engine, shield arms will always be useful.

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9 variants is entirely correct for clan ECM mechs.

My point about the variants is that Omnipods render them moot. The only reason we even have 3+ versions of each Clan mech is to fit in with the current Pilot trees. There is no other reason. Until Clan Quirks of worth are released, why use a Stormcrow C or D? The Prime can get the same torso and arm hardpoints and has a lasr in its head. The Hellbringer A has a laser in its torso. Why use the other two?

Variants just don't mean anything to clans.

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SCRs and Timbers are two of the most resilient mechs in the game period. I can't even begin to wonder where you came up with the opinion that they aren't.

I said no such thing. The opposite in fact (earlier in the thread I said that Clan mechs are generally more survivable).

There is imo an interesting dynamic right now though where it comes to IS vs Clan survivability. Shield sides are a useful tool. They simplfiy armor rolling allow a player to choose armor to sacrifice because its lose doesn't matter. Clan mechs are typical more symetrical. Losing a right arm is as significant as the left. In turn, losing the weapon side on an IS mech really tears out its offensive ability.

<- People constantly harp about 'balance' like the numbers of the weapons tonnage, heat, and damage is all that matters, but this is an intriquing dynamic and I'd like to see it developed further.

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Clan srms are NOT less effective than IS. In fact, you can mount SRM + artemis for LESS tonnage than IS standard variants. Several of my mech builds use SRMs and they are devastating at close range.

Everything is not about straight tonnage. Yeah they're lighter but even with artemis they spread like crazy. Even firing point blank right into a mech's face half the missiles will hit everything from the right arm to the left arm which isn't very desirable. Plus, SRMS still have bad hitreg.

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Notice you didn't mention streaks...

I didn't disagree with your assessment and felt no need. CSSRMs will eventually need addressing, but for now it's the only counter Clans have to Light Rushing so I'm reluctant to push for a fix right now as it would leave the Clans horrible neutered in CW. New net code and the Cheetah should help with that.

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Not many people use PPCs. The heat to damage ratio is horrendous yes. Yet, the clan PPC is not useless and is viable on a couple mechs that can mount 20+ heat sinks.

No Clan mech can do this without being terrible. Yeah it's lighter but so what? 50% more heat for the same amount of point damage?

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It really only comes down to tactics. The IS must force a close range situation or they will lose. The Clans MUST keep the IS at range or they will overheat and lose.

It's not really an issue of overheating, but that Clan Lasers make up the bulk of useable Clan Weapons. And they're good weapons. Real good. AC's are bad. UACs are only good if you cans stack them, our SRMS have too wide a spread to be usable only anything but a Splat Dog/Splat Crow which is blarg in general as an idea. Lasers, barring smalls, aren't ideal brawl weapons due to heat and on top of that as I said earlier, longer duration on the beams = more time exposing CT to enemy fire.

Plus; Compare this then to how Clans have to expose themselves to fire longer to deal their damage. The 6 LL Stalker outguns the Timber at range, not because of higher damage, but beacause it can pop those lasers off and quickly disappear behind cover before the Timber can even deal its full damage + The Stalker has (imo) the best hitboxes in the game. If you cant hit their legs, your basically pulling teeth. Stacking Stalkers is terrifyingly effective.

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Do I favor nerfing clans... no
Do I favor buffing IS... not really, they just need a medium or a heavy that's useful for CW that can mount ECM.

Black Knight PGI. Screw the timeline. Make it so

Edited by Lord0fHats, 02 April 2015 - 01:21 PM.

[Gremlich Johns]

All Clan players should just take a two week break - ALL Clan-centric players.

You will get PGI's attention. There are other games to play while the time ticks down.

[_Comrade_]

Gremlich Johns, on 02 April 2015 - 05:18 PM, said:

All Clan players should just take a two week break - ALL Clan-centric players.

You will get PGI's attention. There are other games to play while the time ticks down.

bloodborne for PS4 is really good i hear

[SethAbercromby]

Grimwill, on 02 April 2015 - 05:31 PM, said:

bloodborne for PS4 is really good i hear

Please don't remind me I don't have one. I'm trying my best to stay clear of any related videos already...

[Repasy Cooper]

Czarr, on 02 April 2015 - 12:28 PM, said:

Guys , thier is nothing wrong with the mechs it's an even game right , in fact Russ even said the clans won 55% of all drops in the event weekend. The reason why clans lost planets is because the attack/defend que is bugged to make the larger faction progress and not the lower populated faction

53% actually. I totally agree with you, it's really close! I'm almost surprised it was that close, but this weekend provided loads of game data to analyze, so that statistic is more reliable than it's ever been.

[Lawrence Elsa]

Maverick Brewer, on 02 April 2015 - 12:25 PM, said:

Not to disagree with the OP but I think this is the BIGGEST reason the Clans lost this weekend:

http://mwomercs.com/...4#entry4332374.

Hard to justify winning 53% of the matches but still losing 50 plus worlds other than CW is in (BETA). No to mention in a couple of weeks we are looking at a map reset.

Yeah, didn't even think about that. Article updated.

[Lawrence Elsa]

Repasy, on 02 April 2015 - 06:18 AM, said:

This is all wrong.

Biggest reason the Clans lost this weekend was population disparity. All other issues are irrelevant in the face of this.

It's been controlling ComWar since the start, and despite everyone's best attempts to deny it this issue has never been more profound. We need population caps on factions, some way to control population from getting one-sided.

Fair enough Reapsy, fair enough

[Alex Razorblade]

Slambot, on 02 April 2015 - 11:48 AM, said:

Yeah shield arms... lol THAT makes up for the massive difference in alphas. You forget that almost all IS mechs depend on arm mounted weapons and not a single mech I listed uses shield arms. In fact, all of them depend on arm mounted weaponry. Take off a dragon's or a griffins right arm and see what happens.

The clan UAC5 is an awesome weapon in the hands of a skilled pilot.
One ams cant make up for the half-weight of clan lrms. Also, as I stated, lrms are pretty dead in cw.
9 variants is entirely correct for clan ECM mechs. (only one hellbringer variant mounts ecm, but I challenge you to find one of the other two variants that doesn't run ECM as well.)

SCRs and Timbers are two of the most resilient mechs in the game period. I can't even begin to wonder where you came up with the opinion that they aren't.

Clan srms are NOT less effective than IS. In fact, you can mount SRM + artemis for LESS tonnage than IS standard variants. Several of my mech builds use SRMs and they are devastating at close range.

Notice you didn't mention streaks...

Not many people use PPCs. The heat to damage ratio is horrendous yes. Yet, the clan PPC is not useless and is viable on a couple mechs that can mount 20+ heat sinks. You forget also, that IS PPCs are heavier, and take up more space. The standard PPC has only 540m range and does 0 damage inside 90m.

Clan gauss...really...12 tons, 5 crits 15 damage
IS gauss 15 tons 6 crits 15 damage...

C-ER large lasers 4 tons, 1 crit 740m range ...11 damage
IS ER large laser 5 tons 2 crit 675m range... 9 damage

C-ER med laser 1ton 1 crit 405m range 7 damage
IS med laser 1 ton 1 crit 270m range 5 damage

C-med pulse laser 2 tons 1 crit 7 damage 330m range
IS med pulse laser 2 tons 1 crit 6 damage 220m range

hell your small laser variants are viable with their 200+ m ranges

It really only comes down to tactics. The IS must force a close range situation or they will lose. The Clans MUST keep the IS at range or they will overheat and lose.

Do I favor nerfing clans... no
Do I favor buffing IS... not really, they just need a medium or a heavy that's useful for CW that can mount ECM.

1. ERRPC, GAUS, MG, LRM/SRM, TAG, LBX-10C have some range on clan and is. Any quirk on range extend effective range. Clan have Less effective range.
example:
JM6-A (BALLISTIC RANGE: 20.00 %) effective range without gaus module = 780. clan have 650. With gaus module 845 vs 715
ON1-VA ( MISSILE RANGE: 25.00 % ) effective range without lrm module = 1250 and 1350 with module


2. ER Large Lasers. Any quirk on range = 10% set effective weapon range for IS ER Large = CLAN ER Large. If quirk > 10% then IS have more effective weapon range
example:
TDR-5SS ( ENERGY RANGE: 25.00 % ). without range module 843 vs 740. with weapoon module 911 vs 814 and 852 with TK4 (some tons and slots as 4 IS ER Large)

RVN-4x ( ENERGY RANGE: 30.00 % ) without range module 875 vs 740. with weapoon module 945 vs 814 and 838 with TK2 (some tons and slots as 2 IS ER Large)

3. Do not forgot quirks on cooldown, duration and heat generation ( clan do not has any )
4. What clans medium/heavy can hold dual gaus/ac10/ac20 or quad ac5 with normal amount of ammo?

[Lawrence Elsa]

Remember everyone, This has nothing to do with who's side has better mechs, but rather what the Clans can do to incourage cross-unit teamwork

[MW222]

Communications is and will always be a large factor in any game/match. Another reason CW is not working out is the time delay and I agree with others here that clan mech's due to their cost limit the number of clan players.

I do feel that a large part of the issue is also that CW is just an assault game with doors.

(Sorry DEV's)

Oh and add in the fun fact that if you don't have four clan mech's you have play 3 or 4 trail mech's and they are not the mech's you have built up and gained experience on.

I have 15 mech's * and of them only one is a clan mech. I have spent a lot of time on my IS mech's and I am not likely to speed huge amounts of time and money on clan mech's.

* (More then some and probably a lot lot less then most- all Ccred purchased or won as prizes.)

I'm Jade Falcon because I was invited to a group of like minded other players who for some unknown reason liked my stile of play or lack of it. 8-)

I know I could go to an IS house or go Merc and play my IS mech's in CW and still play with my friends. To me it's just not worth the hassle right now. What can I say, I like being a Jade Falcon Blood Falcon. Anyway that's my two cents.

Lastly to the Coding gang - HANG IN THERE DEV'S the basic game and CW are getting better every day, support e-mails are answered quickly and issues are addressed. Know that your efforts are MUCH appreciated.

[PhoenixNMGLB]

Just a suggestion - make use of the faction chat to invite people to ts and groups before a match starts.

I can not always speak on ts but as a pug I am always willing to listen.

[anonymous161]

Haven't seen Seth in a game in a long time now.

If you are cordinating as a team a dire can do a ton of damage I have done this but I favor using storm and timbers over using a dire.

[PhoenixNMGLB]

Lawrence Elsa, on 01 April 2015 - 04:37 AM, said:

Then let's teach them! Let's show them where to aim, what to call, help them learn the Phonetic Alphabet and what to put on their mech!
Like I said, we need to stop resenting them and start encouraging them and showing them the ropes! Yes, they need to participate, but we need to be willing to accept if they do. Send them links to good mwo.smurfy-net.de builds, tell them what to shoot for on certain meta-mechs, show them the places in CW where you have the most cover and vantage points!

This, so much this.

[Gremlich Johns]

Methinks the iLchi are needed now more than ever.

[Czarr]

Clans are as weak as their totem animals

Jade Falcon- Psssh a falcon? If i saw a falcon swooping down i would just punch it
Wolf- can be defeated with bacon bits and tennis balls
Ghost Bears- Call the ghost busters
Smoke Jag- go chase laser pointers

[S E M T E X]

Gyrok? You have been summoned to this thread,enlighten us with your deep understand,Sire