37 replies to this topic

[Evan20k]

Topic title unrelated.


Most of the current balance problems in the game are the result of a deep-seated phobia of the poptart meta of old. What made the poptart the 'best' playstyle back then was far more complex than stronger JJs, faster velocities on PPCs or ACs. There's several aspects of the game that are suffering simply because the game was a different beast back. The big difference from then to now is that quirks and the introduction of clan mechs radically shift the dynamics of the battlefield to allow for more viable options in the face of someone hiding behind a rock. Coupled with the fact that we have gauss charge (making poptarttng with it harder) and better hitreg (making it easier to punish someone jumping), the return of better jumpjets and PPCs wouldn't be the gigantic meta dominating beast that I think a lot of people are afraid it would be. We might even see Victors and Highlanders more than once in a blue moon again too.

tl;dr I want to slingshot myself into the skybox with my spider 5V.

[FupDup]

I suspect that there's going to be a whole lot of people who judge this thread by its title instead of the original post...

[Evan20k]

FupDup, on 03 April 2015 - 12:12 PM, said:

I suspect that there's going to be a whole lot of people who judge this thread by its title instead of the original post...

That was absolutely the intention. My intention with the OP is to encourage thinking critically about what a change would do to a game(or a post on the forum) instead of defaulting on what their preconceived expectations would suggest.

[Xetelian]

Wanted at the very least 255 engine.

[FupDup]

FupDup, on 03 April 2015 - 12:12 PM, said:

I suspect that there's going to be a whole lot of people who judge this thread by its title instead of the original post...

Evan20k, on 03 April 2015 - 12:14 PM, said:

That was absolutely the intention. My intention with the OP is to encourage thinking critically about what a change would do to a game(or a post on the forum) instead of defaulting on what their preconceived expectations would suggest.

-->

Xetelian, on 03 April 2015 - 12:15 PM, said:

Wanted at the very least 255 engine.

[Mystere]

Xetelian, on 03 April 2015 - 12:15 PM, said:

Wanted at the very least 255 engine.

Bingo!

[InRev]

[Rhaythe]

Play-styles in an attrition game will gravitate towards roles that put the player in the least amount of danger while inflicting the greatest amount of damage. That has not changed. Better jumpjets *will* encourage more poptarting. The weapons being used in this playstyle - be them PPCs or ACs or wubs - is irrelevant in that regard. Boost jumpjets globally, and poptarting will come back because it's one of the easiest and safest options to safely deliver weapons payload. It survived throughout Mechwarrior 4; it will come back to MWO if PGI lets it.

Not lost in this is the fact that poptarting is extremely newbie-unfriendly. You have to wonder how many new players we lost during that era.

Whether or not weapons systems in this game have developed enough that poptarting is an acceptable commonplace tactic is another story. Frankly, it's my opinion that the game is in a better place without everything mounting jumpjets bouncing around with PPCs. But that's my opinion.

Though I'm loathe to promote further quirkening, granting better jumpjetting power to select mechs intended to be air-mobile might be a safer solution, as that fighting style would just be the "flavor" for that mech.

[Evan20k]

There's a middleground between poptarting of old and where JJs are now. For example the accuracy loss when using JJs more or less makes poptarting as a dedicated playstyle impossible as of now; there's plenty of room for adjustment where it's a valid tactic yet not overwhelming. JumpJets are supposed to open tactical doors for mechs capable of them, not just be nearly wasted tonnage.

[MechaBattler]

If it's not in the ToS, it should be, you shouldn't post misleading titles to get attention.

[Rhaythe]

Evan20k, on 03 April 2015 - 12:30 PM, said:

JumpJets are supposed to open tactical doors for mechs capable of them, not just be nearly wasted tonnage.

Agreed totally. I sympathize with Victor and Highlander owners. But nor do I believe the entire game's balance should be skewed just so those two chassis are useful again. Small increments to Jump Jets might be in order, but again I don't believe it should be global. I can't help but think jump jet quirks are the way to go for those chassis that are underperforming.

Seriously. Legions of Timberwolves are also just waiting for Jump Jets to get a global buff. But at the same time, the Summoner definitely needs it.

Edited by Rhaythe, 03 April 2015 - 12:36 PM.

[Evan20k]

MechaBattler, on 03 April 2015 - 12:34 PM, said:

If it's not in the ToS, it should be, you shouldn't post misleading titles to get attention.

You missed the point entirely. The OP is there to prove how stuck we get in one mindset once we get an idea planted.

Rhaythe, on 03 April 2015 - 12:35 PM, said:

Agreed totally. I sympathize with Victor and Highlander owners. But nor do I believe the entire game's balance should be skewed just so those two chassis are useful again. Small increments to Jump Jets might be in order, but again I don't believe it should be global. I can't help but think jump jet quirks are the way to go for those chassis that are underperforming.

Seriously. Legions of Timberwolves are also just waiting for Jump Jets to get a global buff. But at the same time, the Summoner definitely needs it.

The TBR is an outlier in the overall balance of the game. Almost every other heavier JJ capable mech 'needs' a boost (huehuehuethepuns) in performance. I think the boosts should be global, but they should be tied into which type of jumpjet a mech mounts.

Edited by Evan20k, 03 April 2015 - 12:40 PM.

[MechaBattler]

Evan20k, on 03 April 2015 - 12:35 PM, said:

You missed the point entirely. The OP is there to prove how stuck we get in one mindset once we get an idea planted.

He should find another way to make his point. : /

[Rebas Kradd]

Bait and switch title.

[Mcgral18]

We'll likely never get anything other than HoverJets™ because the gravity is set to ~4x G.

This means you fall nearly immediately after cutting thrust, giving you the precision to expose your weapons then fall down without being touched.

Apparently animation would have to be redone if we touch the gravity, so we're stuck with Terribad HoverJets™, which are in a sad state for anything over 50 tons.


The main issue, I suppose, is control. You can control how much of your robot you expose, for a tiny amount of time because of the large G force pulling you down.

I want the Test Server with fewer G's demonstrated...even if there is broken animation. "Looking weird" isn't a reason to not do it, if it helps balance.

[MonkeyCheese]

Evan20k, on 03 April 2015 - 12:07 PM, said:

tl;dr I want to slingshot myself into the skybox with my spider 5V.

But you can. I took my 12 jumpjet 5v spider to the north west corner of alpine last week and actually found the sky out of bounds.

[Mechteric]

Jump jets from before were bad too, they need to be more like they are in MWLL. Fast, hot, and fun.

Edited by CapperDeluxe, 03 April 2015 - 01:28 PM.

[Soy]

Hehe...

[Brody319]

This thread is only worth this statement from me explaining that I think its not worth enough of my time to do anything but leave this comment.

[Soy]

That's sad Brody considering he crit the current meta in the face for over 9000.

Just noticed you weren't even here for the real heyday, so whatever. The **** you even in this thread for.