42 replies to this topic

[Haeso]

Tweaks, on 01 December 2011 - 06:33 AM, said:

In order for a sample to be representative, the sample has to contain representative variety of voters. The people that vote on forums are usually the most expressive, and the most hardcore players (i.e. the BT geeks and MW twitchers). When you publish a poll such as "Are you for or against salvage?" you will attract only people that do care about it or feel like expressing themselves because they have a strong opinion of it. Most people will skim the poll and just say "Meh...", move along without voting and note leave any reply.

Less than 1% of the total members of a forum is not representative at all, the sample is too small, especially considering you can't know the quality of the voters. Your poll had over 2,846 views but only 208 votes (and the view counter only increments the first time a member views the post). Skimming through it, I noticed that most of the replies are long quoted debates between the same handful of players (with you on top of the list). This is hardly representative, sorry, but you're dead wrong.

You never took a statistics class apparently. If you want to think it's not good enough, good for you. Something as skewed as 91% will not flip no matter how the community grows.

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You're saying...


Sorry again to burst your bubble, but to quote Matt from the Q&A:


That's right... no persistence beyond that. So it looks like it will be much more as I expect it to be than how you expect it to be...

I'm not talking anything like WoW, or an MMORPG. A simple economic model is not somehow turning the game into an MMO. Unless diablo is an MMO.

But nice strawman!

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30-60 seconds after every match? Are you crazy? That is way too long, and in fact, it will probably me more than that! I also don't expect this to work very well with total strangers and 14 years old kids and grievers trying to get everything for themselves or cry because they can't. The only way this would work is if battles are much longer than 20 minutes (i.e. epic 1 hour battles) and that it's always with players you know (i.e. players in your own Merc Corp). What you're suggesting is very close to the sharing of loot after a raid in World of Warcraft, and it's nothing but quick and simple!

For a 20 minute match that's nothing, and it shouldn't even take that long if streamlined. The system doesn't even involve other players directly. It shows you very obviously didn't even read the system I didn't suggest. Everyone gets a share of salvaged 'Mechs, it goes through each player who picks one if he wants one, how order is determined doesn't matter. If he 'Buys' one, he buys out the other player's shares in exchange for a 'Mech. There's no actual sharing or loot system anything like those games.

You have no clue what I was suggesting. Are you just intentionally misrepresenting my ideas or are you too lazy to read and understand them?

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Thing is, many players will just want to play solo, and not be in a player-owned Merc Corp. The majority of players will prefer quick in-and-out types of random matches. That's the current tendency in the F2P world and successful multiplayer action games in general, for good reasons. Not many want a tedious social system with an economy and have to report to a "clan" or Merc Corp. I know I don't anyway, and I know I'm certainly not alone.

This is designed to work specifically for solo play in fact, if you read it you'd see that. Personally I would like to see something more in depth for Merc Command Vs Merc Command. My system was incredibly simple and streamlined, you're blowing it way out of proportion.

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The average player will mostly want to spend a minute or more upgrading his 'Mech or selecting skills for his pilot, once every few matches (when he has something to upgrade), but otherwise grind as fast as possible in between. That's in the nature of most "normal" players. The expressive forum geek is the exception, not the majority.

Buy several 'Mechs at once. Play several matches in a row. Use a starter 'Mech, play infinite matches in a row.

Piranha adds a button that lets you re-purchase a lost 'Mech with the same specifications if you have the C-Bills. Couldn't be simpler. Pretending it's some complex and impossible to understand system when it's painfully simple isn't helping you...

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That's it, I'm done arguing with you. Not only you qualify my replies as "non-intelligent", but all you can do is counter every single argument with the same bs and redirect to your own post as if you had the answer to everything.

I wasn't insulting you, I was welcoming debate within the confines of the topic, that is with certain assumptions made. You need to stop getting defensive over some forum posts my friend. Until you became all hostile for no reason I was more than happy to discuss with you.

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Your idea is just that, an idea, it's not the absolute truth or the perfect solution, whether you work in game design or not is completely irrelevant. Just because 189 (less than 1%) of the forum members voted in favor, doesn't make it so either. You haven't conceded any single point or bent any of your views so far no matter how many times people argue about it or disagree with your post, and this is getting quite irritating!

I've added two major sections brought on by the posts of others, and am still mulling over Ep's post and how to work with that. I am more than open to discussion, it's why I made the thread, not necessarily to push my system, but to A: Explain how a salvage system could work without being hardcore or overly complex (Hell it's downright simple!) for those worried about that, and to give people a starting point that is more than "Do you want salvage or not" because that thread was very simple in it's approach, do you want it or not lead to a whole ton of different meanings for what salvage should be.

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Stick to your wet dreams if you wish, but I know for a fact it's not going to be that way. That is not an assumption, it's pretty clear when you read between the lines of the FAQ and the Q&A #1. I'm not pretending to know precisely what it will be in the end, but I have a pretty good idea of what it will not be.

I'm amazed you can understand what's between the lines since you couldn't even understand my post unless it's an intentional strawman and you did understand it. If you want to discuss, I'm happy to, but all you've been is hostile and argumentative. And when you deliberately taunt and mock me unwarranted, don't expect me to be overly nice to you.

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I'm done with this debate, this is going nowhere. And by the way, thanks for hijacking my thread ...not!

Hijacking? I didn't realize relevant discussion was Hijacking a thread. The proposition that a hardcore mode that segregates the community and forces exceedingly harsh penalties onto people who want more than just some shallow MechAssault Online is something I'm against, other people brought up how something like salvage was too hardcore, I contended it wasn't at all and explained why. I didn't hijack anything.

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Your pilot would be mortal, meaning if he dies in combat, it's game over. Ejecting would be the only way to stay alive if your 'Mech is close to become destroyed

If I want salvage, I also have to eliminate any serious sense of progression and RPG elements from the game for myself? No thanks. Hell, what if I wanted to play with friends who weren't Hardcore but I was? Tough luck?

Edited by Haeso, 01 December 2011 - 07:57 AM.

[Tweaks]

Haeso, you just made it to my ignore list. Congrats, you're the first. I'm sick and tired of your insults. I did read your whole post, and I still stick to my view. I'm not lazy, and I'm not stupid like you're suggesting, and to be honest I'm quite offended by what your allusions. If I'm misinterpreting it, then perhaps it's not clear enough or that it's so clear to you that you can't fathom that someone else could not understand it the way you do? It's 3 freakin' pages long after all, I don't call that "downright simple".

Anyway, thanks for ruining my thread. When I mentioned you hijacked my thread I meant that you kept redirecting to your own personal thread instead of talking directly about what I suggested in my original post.

I'm asking for it to be locked by a mod, there's no point in keeping this opened since you obviously won't bulge from your own vision.

[Garth Erlam]

Why hello personal attack thread, you make me so sad.

As Monsieur Tweaks here has said, this thread has been sidetracked. Closing.