121 replies to this topic

[AssaultPig]

long range pinpoint needs to die in a fire

multiple gauss should not be able to fire at the same time

[Joseph Mallan]

AssaultPig, on 16 April 2015 - 09:43 AM, said:

long range pinpoint needs to die in a fire

multiple gauss should not be able to fire at the same time

I disagree. What needs to happen is Pin point should be difficult at range.

[Gas Guzzler]

AssaultPig, on 16 April 2015 - 09:43 AM, said:

long range pinpoint needs to die in a fire

multiple gauss should not be able to fire at the same time

Reducing convergence is one thing, but the way this is written tells me you want to stand at 800-1000m and not move and not have to worry about getting hurt, probably shooting LRMs. That may not be true, but the desperation that this comment exudes hurts me on the inside a little bit.

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 16 April 2015 - 10:11 AM.

[Impossible Wasabi]

The Space Pope for one is happy with gauss rifles as they are.

[Felio]

Kuritaclan, on 16 April 2015 - 07:20 AM, said:

3 ppc - every mech which could equip 3 of them and has a >20% ppc or weapon energy range quirk has the same pinpoint.

Much slower projectile, shorter range (as I said), way, way more heat, and ghost heat. Also probably more tonnage once you factor in all the required heat sinks.

Edited by Felio, 16 April 2015 - 10:57 AM.

[Burktross]

i vote flamers only weapon

[Revis Volek]

Abisha, on 16 April 2015 - 06:20 AM, said:

ugg the duel gauss is flavor of the month again.
see them more and more in the battlefield.

I think its because of the Gauss bug we had (not protected by CASE for the last 3 weeks or so) and now all of the Gauss fans, myself included, are using them again because i dont die to CT death when my Gauss get hit anymore!

[Mystere]

Hydrocarbon, on 15 April 2015 - 03:45 PM, said:

I think just 1-shot kills need to go for pinpoint weapons. The most simple formula of {IF Armor+Structure>1 AND DMG>Armor+Structure THEN Armor=0 Structure =1 AND all_nonengine_crits=assploded} would do it for CT/ST/Head locations. I know from playing other FPS games with semi-hardcore modes where only a few weapons could 1-hit really disrupt play. It was absolutely fine in modes where a 9mm pistol to the leg would kill, but fat chance of getting a serious HC mode in MWO.

What you're sugessting is more "magic force fields". We already have a "magic force field" protecting the cockpit. We do not need more.

Removing near-instant, perfect and pinpoint convergence or adding CoF or both should mitigate 1 shot kills but not eliminate them completely.

Edited by Mystere, 16 April 2015 - 11:06 AM.

[Raggedyman]

Kristian Radoulov, on 15 April 2015 - 02:20 PM, said:

As stated. TY

I have studied your thesis with great interest, and whilst I believe I have understood the basic intricacies of your argument I do have one question to ask:

Where?

[Mystere]

DaZur, on 15 April 2015 - 08:32 PM, said:

Which typically happens when one is standing around with their thumb up their butt and they get scoped out down-range...

No down sides? Anything running dual Gauss has sacrificed 30 tons + 14 slots + typically another 3 to 5 tons of ammo. Meaning they sacrificed armor, speed or secondary weapons.

Everything has potential trade-offs in MW:O if you pay attention and not just look at numbers in a vacuum...

But many players' idea of "balance" is precisely to look at single pieces of equipment in a vacuum because those same players want nothing less than 1-on-1 symmetrical balance.

[HlynkaCG]

CapperDeluxe, on 15 April 2015 - 04:12 PM, said:

Perhaps, but it's easy to see why 30 pinpoint damage that generates zero heat and has very good range and fast projectiles speed might seem OP. Hence why my thought it perhaps one way to try to help balance it a bit better is only allow one to be charged at a time. But only if its charge time and charge duration is increased to boost the effectiveness of a single gauss.

Tell you what, remove the charge-time on the gauss (so i can snap shoot lights again) and I'll accept a charge restriction that prevents me from firing more than one gauss round per second.

Otherwise leave it as is.

[AssaultPig]

Gas Guzzler, on 16 April 2015 - 10:09 AM, said:

Reducing convergence is one thing, but the way this is written tells me you want to stand at 800-1000m and not move and not have to worry about getting hurt, probably shooting LRMs. That may not be true, but the desperation that this comment exudes hurts me on the inside a little bit.

lulz

long range pinpoint is awful, it's always been awful, it always will be awful. It's the main thing contributing to how static the average match is; everybody has to be afraid of being hit for ~30 damage on one component should they do so much as crest a hill.

long range damage is fine (lasers are fine, lrms are fine, even most small autocannons), but big pinpoint should be happening only at short range if ever

[bad arcade kitty]

so you want to nerf the importance of scouting and the role of light mechs?

[Gas Guzzler]

AssaultPig, on 16 April 2015 - 03:47 PM, said:

lulz

long range pinpoint is awful, it's always been awful, it always will be awful. It's the main thing contributing to how static the average match is; everybody has to be afraid of being hit for ~30 damage on one component should they do so much as crest a hill.

long range damage is fine (lasers are fine, lrms are fine, even most small autocannons), but big pinpoint should be happening only at short range if ever

Why don't we just remove Gauss rifles from the game then.

I don't seem to have a problem with it but since some people do its probably best to just remove it from the game.

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 16 April 2015 - 04:03 PM.

[That Dawg]

Kristian Radoulov, on 15 April 2015 - 02:20 PM, said:

DUAL GAUSS NEEDS TO GO

my advice is try it..........and learn how utterly ineffective dual gauss is until you spend hours learning to use it...and even then, more times than not, its the WRONG weapon at the WRONG time

[Gas Guzzler]

HlynkaCG, on 16 April 2015 - 11:34 AM, said:

Tell you what, remove the charge-time on the gauss (so i can snap shoot lights again) and I'll accept a charge restriction that prevents me from firing more than one gauss round per second.

Otherwise leave it as is.

I would accept a large PPC velocity boost whilst maintaining the charge mechanism, and then restricting to one gauss round at a time as well.

[HlynkaCG]

Gas Guzzler, on 16 April 2015 - 04:10 PM, said:

I would accept a large PPC velocity boost whilst maintaining the charge mechanism, and then restricting to one gauss round at a time as well.

Assuime the one shot at a time applied to the PPCs as well, I would prefer that mechanic to ghost heat.

[Kristian Radoulov]

Yeah, definitely a l2play issue. I'm sure I wouldn't have killed this poor mech if he only had torso-twisted better, or run across the entire open water area to rush me and "out dps me", or not tagged at all to reveal his position since he was being protected by ecm.

Yeah, if only he had not done anything at all and just hide behind cover, he would have lived. That is the counter-play to dual gauss: doing nothing. You guys were right all along. I was just bad and didn't know what I was talking about.

https://youtu.be/454pn7h_48Q

Edited by Kristian Radoulov, 17 April 2015 - 02:13 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Mystere, on 16 April 2015 - 11:23 AM, said:

But many players' idea of "balance" is precisely to look at single pieces of equipment in a vacuum because those same players want nothing less than 1-on-1 symmetrical balance.

1 Gauss is good
2 Gauss is better

Maybe not if you are being shot by them. But that's not my problem now is it?

[Bigbacon]

IMO gauss actually takes some skill to use well anyway. I run some dual gauss builds and I am not that good with them. Like any weapon they are OP if you get yourself in the right place against targets who make it easy.

There are players who are just good with them and can hit what they want when they want. they can do high damage and no heat but i think they take more skill than anything else to use.