134 replies to this topic

[Tina Benoit]

Questions for you MechWarriors!

In the last Town Hall Meeting with Russ (April 16th, 2015), a question came up regarding having Color Blind Mode in-game.

What we'll need from you first however are some statistics and definitions about this.

So let's discuss!

[MercJ]

I'm red/green colorblind, apparently, according to those stupid color dot tests. Hasn't really been much of an issue for gaming, although the color blind mode in the Battlefield series made a nice difference for me. I guess it's one of those things where you don't necessarily know what you're missing anyway

I can't think of a specific scenario, right now, in MWO, that I've been confused by any set of similar colors. I'll be thinking about it though, and will update if I notice anything. I'd rather have more FPS and a clearer HUD and UI anyway

EDIT: the below image is an example - have no clue what's in there, just looks like a bunch of dots. Frankly, this is the only scenario that I notice it. Might make a decent camo option, now that i think of it EDIT AGAIN: NO WAY!! On a white background, it's hard for me to see it - on the dark forum background, I think I see some green stuff in there. Is it a 21?? AM I CURED??!?!

Edited by MercJ, 17 April 2015 - 10:47 AM.

[Tina Benoit]

Maybe this would help!
As there are several different kinds of color blindness.
Such as on this chart below, Protan, Deutan and Tritan

[MercJ]

Not sure if I'm interpreting this right, but rows 4, 7 and 8 in the chart you linked all look different than the original block/color to me.

EDIT: Looking at it further, I'd assume that you're supposed to pick the column that most closely matches the original, and that would be your "type"? In that case, the Deutan column is probably the closest match, followed by the Protan (pretty close too). The Tritan is way off for me, looks mostly pink.

Edited by MercJ, 17 April 2015 - 11:01 AM.

[xWiredx]

MercJ, on 17 April 2015 - 10:42 AM, said:

EDIT: the below image is an example - have no clue what's in there, just looks like a bunch of dots. Frankly, this is the only scenario that I notice it. Might make a decent camo option, now that i think of it EDIT AGAIN: NO WAY!! On a white background, it's hard for me to see it - on the dark forum background, I think I see some green stuff in there. Is it a 21?? AM I CURED??!?!

Actually, I believe it's a 74. I could be colorblind to some extent, but I have never been told that I am and haven't had anything other than normal results, but you never really know.

A colorblind mode would be nice I suppose. I am not sure there are a lot of players out there with colorblindness as I've only seen a few and there are apparently several thousand players. Still, I'm sure my dad (colorblind) would appreciate the gesture.

[BladeSplint]

Glad to see you guys are on top of this and doing your research. I have trouble with the missile door lights on some maps and I don't even think I'm colorblind.

[MercJ]

BladeSplint, on 17 April 2015 - 11:14 AM, said:

Glad to see you guys are on top of this and doing your research. I have trouble with the missile door lights on some maps and I don't even think I'm colorblind.

Now why didn't I think of this? I knew they changed color, but this is a very good example - hard for me to tell the difference. The red/yellow change isn't drastic enough for me to tell between the two. A small detail, but I stopped looking at it because I couldn't tell the difference anyway.

[Conductor Rarity]

MercJ, on 17 April 2015 - 10:53 AM, said:

EDIT: Looking at it further, I'd assume that you're supposed to pick the column that most closely matches the original, and that would be your "type"? In that case, the Deutan column is probably the closest match, followed by the Protan (pretty close too). The Tritan is way off for me, looks mostly pink.

Same here for me. Unless it's Untouched green or cherry red; I have a difficult time distinguishing what's the most damaged component on a mech. It's gotten a lot easier with practice and time, but when I started playing this game I couldn't tell the difference at all. This game is very colorblind unfriendly.

BladeSplint, on 17 April 2015 - 11:14 AM, said:

Glad to see you guys are on top of this and doing your research. I have trouble with the missile door lights on some maps and I don't even think I'm colorblind.

Missile bay doors are useless for me. They just look the same color to me, on all maps. Always have to ask my unit members if they're open or not. The range indication to a lesser extent is the same. It was probably over a year before I noticed that It changed color if you're within optimum range or out of it.

[orcrist86]

I've contacted a veteran Dev at ubisoft I'm friendly with for his experience. Will see if he can provide some reference.

[Choppah]

I'm not colorblind but I believe every game should strive to at least add simple color changes to help those who are. I have heard comments mostly regarding the paper doll and how the subtle shade changes make it hard for certain types of color blindness. Allowing us to set the UI colors would be a good first step, but I think something along the lines of a HTAL paper doll would be beneficial for everyone, because even I have trouble knowing how much armor I really have left with the current system.

[Felio]

MercJ, on 17 April 2015 - 10:53 AM, said:

Not sure if I'm interpreting this right, but rows 4, 7 and 8 in the chart you linked all look different than the original block/color to me.

EDIT: Looking at it further, I'd assume that you're supposed to pick the column that most closely matches the original, and that would be your "type"? In that case, the Deutan column is probably the closest match, followed by the Protan (pretty close too). The Tritan is way off for me, looks mostly pink.

As a person who sees normally (I know for sure because I was screened going into the military), I think it is showing what the person with that kind of color blindness sees when she or she looks at the color in the first column. That's why it says "Simulation" over them.

So, for example, if your game uses Orange, Yellow and Reddish Purple, a person with Tritan color blindness will see all of them as shades of pink. But you would only know that from the chart if you see normally.

[Monky]

The simplest method is to allow customization of all elements of the HUD, color-wise.

This can be done with a 'change the color of everything' selector, breaking it into different groups like 'things that are by default red, yellow, blue, etc' or just allowing each element to be individually configured.

This benefits not only color blind players but people who want to highlight specific features for ease of eye relief and for people who value consistency between CLAN/IS HUD displays (currently, clans = blue, IS = yellow)

[IronChance]

I'm red-green colorblind and have been for all 41 of my years and this is the first I've heard of Protan, Deutan and Tritan. So, I'll just ignore those things and tell you what I have trouble with in game:

1) As mentioned above, missile bay doors. Can barely see the light and certainly can't tell if it changes.

2) Forest Colony. Everything is green and therefore it mostly looks greyscale to me. At over 500 meters, I basically fire at places I'm pretty sure mechs are instead of actually firing at mechs. This might be more of a lighting issue, though, as Viridian Bog does not present a problem, but maybe only b/c sight lines are so restricted.

3) Weapon charge up indiicator pips on the main HUD. Unless I am staring directly at them, I can't tell when these pips change color. Combine this with the inability to adjust the gauss rifle charge up volume independently of the master volume and the gauss rifle is a weapon that is nearly impossible for me to use with any proficiency.

4) Armor damage indicators. As mentioned by someone else above, I've learned to interpret these more or less accurately, but an orange component looks often times either red or yellow or vice versa.



I think that's it. The minimap used to be useless to me back in closed beta, but you guys did a fantastic job cleaning it up.

EDIT: I don't think I've ever played a game with a "color blind mode" exactly, but I know I've played games with "web safe" colors, which are generally conisdered colorblind safe. I know Civilization changed to those colors a number of years back. I want to say around CIV 3, maybe? It made a big difference in ease of play.

Edited by IronChance, 17 April 2015 - 12:43 PM.

[shellashock]

Rarity HD, on 17 April 2015 - 11:24 AM, said:

Same here for me. Unless it's Untouched green or cherry red; I have a difficult time distinguishing what's the most damaged component on a mech. It's gotten a lot easier with practice and time, but when I started playing this game I couldn't tell the difference at all. This game is very colorblind unfriendly.

Missile bay doors are useless for me. They just look the same color to me, on all maps. Always have to ask my unit members if they're open or not. The range indication to a lesser extent is the same. It was probably over a year before I noticed that It changed color if you're within optimum range or out of it.

FYI, I find it useful to try going quickly into 3rd person mode to see if my missile doors are open on things like the catapult and switching back to 1st person. It only works if missile doors are high up and open up like the Catapult, otherwise the mech blocks your view. Hope this helps a bit!

[markthenerd]

I don't have any issue with the HUD--If it has any colors that confuse my color blindness I don't notice.

What do notice is how much Forest Colony sucks for me. The light color combined with all the green/brown makes it almost impossible to see mechs unless I use thermal.


Actually--the missile bay door light color is impossible to see for me. Forgot about that.

Edited by markthenerd, 17 April 2015 - 01:11 PM.

[Stealth Fox]

I am red Green colorblind as well. The paper doll don't tell me crap.

Impliment the fricken individual health bars for the components as an option instead. Every other MW game did it.

This thing. http://gyazo.com/a8d...57d2fdd5e730814 right here..

this fricken thing..

And bring back the multicolor heat vision, the green on green on green night vision makes it very hard for me to see and the white heat vision is worthless.

Edited by Seph MacLeod, 17 April 2015 - 01:43 PM.

[9erRed]

Greetings all,

Just a question for those that do have some colour issues with elements with-in the game and in real life.

- Do these same 'effects' or visual colour differentiations change if you look through different tinted lens?

(the reason I ask this is, while in the Military, I found that having 'pink' tinted clip-on's for glasses, allowed definition and picking out targets better at dusk and dawn. More contrast between greens, black and white, while your eyes changed from gray to colour sensors with light changes.)
~ Similar to 'yellow' driving lenses for low light situations.

Now what has this to do with the game? Well if a single 'tint' change to the 'Mechs windows could assist in defining better recognition, it might help some. May not assist with HUD elements, but there could be an 'option' to 'filter tint' everything from the Pilots view. (like having 'clip-on's' for the Pilot)
- Rather than Tina work with the engineers to 'change the environment or game pallet', perhaps a simple user or client only 'filter' may help some. And much easer to design and allow use of.
- If a filter does help, each filter would need to be optically/Freq. corrected for each user, dependent on what range they have difficulty with.

For those of you giggling at using 'Rose coloured' lenses (ruby actually) in the Military, it quite a common filter for 'competition shooters' to make the targets 'jump out' in contrast. As well as an optical coating (laser protection) for bino's and vehicle optics.
- The time during dusk and dawn as the eyes change is an optimal 'operational' timeframe, any 'enhancement' could laterally save your life.

Just some ideas,
9erRed

Edited by 9erRed, 17 April 2015 - 01:47 PM.

[Wo0t]

Interesting topic! I am significantly colour blind, but not to the point where I don't see any colour at all. More or less I see more greys and browns than the average person and quite a few colours blend together (greens, reds, etc). When attempting the Ishihara test, I fail horribly on both eyes - something to the effect of 1/12 correct on my right eye and 2/12 on my left eye. Just some points for reference.

To be honest I have never really thought of the impact it has on me while playing MWO. Since this thread came up I have done some reflecting and I do feel that I encounter issues with colour blindness and functioning in the game. As far as the HUD goes, I think I do ok, but actual terrain colour palette makes it difficult for me at times. The best example I can think of is playing on forest colony, river city, parts of tourmaline and all night maps prove to be quite difficult and I find myself using other modes of vision to be able to compete ie. night vision or heat vision.

I am not sure if this helps at all, or how I can contribute, but I wanted to give you my perspective in hopes it helps gameplay in any possible way. I still manage to compete in this game and enjoy every aspect of it, so like most people that are colour blind would say - we're used to it because its all we know

Edited by Wo0t, 17 April 2015 - 02:39 PM.

[soulpole]

Add me to the list of "red/green" colour blind. From the research I've done for myself, I seem to have "pronatopia". This means I am missing or have very few of the red receptors. Bottom line is that pure red just sort of blends into the background. I seem to be able to pick up stop signs, but passengers always see them well before I do.

In regards to MWO, think about how many pure red indicators there are: damage direction, missle alerts, targeting carats... I've managed to get by alright, but most maps I just run in heat vision. I can pick out a mech shaped blob without the blue dorito. I also agree that the river colony map is the worst offender and night vision is next to useless. If I were to pick my favourite map from a colour palette standpoint, crimson straits is the best.

The other trick that I use is to adjust the colour balance on my monitor. I'll jack the red channel up which seems to help. I'd love to be able to run a colour replacement though and make all red indicators something that stands out to me.

[Void Angel]

xWiredx, on 17 April 2015 - 10:55 AM, said:

Actually, I believe it's a 74. I could be colorblind to some extent, but I have never been told that I am and haven't had anything other than normal results, but you never really know.

A colorblind mode would be nice I suppose. I am not sure there are a lot of players out there with colorblindness as I've only seen a few and there are apparently several thousand players. Still, I'm sure my dad (colorblind) would appreciate the gesture.

There's both, kinda. The 2 is a reddish tint (partly overlaid on the green in places,) and the 1 is green. The test is designed so that people will see different numbers based on which, if any, of the three color receptors they lack.