11 replies to this topic

[Summon3r]

So Russ acknowledged that there is an issue with the rushing of gens somewhat, just gonna throw a thought out. but was a very hard issue to try and deal with.

so "if" this is an issue the ability to scout/recon and have it actually mean something would be useful?

so we send out our recon elements, recon reports incoming lights/fast mechs and a lot of them, order goes out to get into your mechs that are better suited to deal with fast mechs. pilots head to there mech hangars and select appropriate mech. same deal if recon reports incoming assault force, you jump in mechs that you consider to be better suited to deal with heavier slower tougher mechs.

thoughts?

[SuperNobody]

Interesting idea. If I understand correctly, you could choose to drop just a few scouts and depending upon what they find the rest could then drop in an appropriate mech. I think it could work if the timing was right. As it is now, I think the maps are too small since you would not have much time to drop before the lights would already be in base. If there were better base defenses that couldn't just be easily bypassed by a mass of JJ light mechs then this could work and add some more strategy to the game.

[Summon3r]

SuperNobody, on 17 April 2015 - 11:09 AM, said:

Interesting idea. If I understand correctly, you could choose to drop just a few scouts and depending upon what they find the rest could then drop in an appropriate mech. I think it could work if the timing was right. As it is now, I think the maps are too small since you would not have much time to drop before the lights would already be in base. If there were better base defenses that couldn't just be easily bypassed by a mass of JJ light mechs then this could work and add some more strategy to the game.

something like that, there would be many ways to implement the idea. my thought was just a rough outline of my suggestion to help this. i know its frustrating as hell when you drop in an Atlas or Dire Wolf (for arguements sake) then have a swarm of fast mechs either melt you or just bypass you like you dont exist. just a wasted mech and next thing you know omega is going down lol

[sycocys]

I don't mind the idea, but it will make pug life extremely difficult - especially the ones that don't play CW because they can't yet comprehend matchups and teamwork.

Not that it will ever happen, but to me it would be a much better plan to implement lance objectives that split teams apart for the first 2 drops anyhow. Would be easier for pugs to figure out "Alpha lance objective - capture/defend communications tower, point waypoint Delta"

Split out among 3 lances, once those objectives were complete/failed either have a second set or open the gates and let the game continue on - there could even be sub-objectives that gave either side an advantage that needed to be taken/destroyed or defend right up to the base.

Basically any of the objectives you took part in for the campaigns for the previous games would work because all you are doing is swapping humans for ai. Its stuff that would engage all players and make every match feel like its own little war which would keep even the pugs that stay in standard drops coming back for more.

Will it happen? No. But that's also why this game won't have the decades long player base like the previous titles do.

[AlmightyAeng]

He said he finds Zerg-rushing mind-bogglingly frustrating.

Maybe he can find a nice unit to teach him how to deal with that.

[Telmasa]

Ghost Badger, on 17 April 2015 - 12:40 PM, said:

He said he finds Zerg-rushing mind-bogglingly frustrating.

Maybe he can find a nice unit to teach him how to deal with that.

Oooooooor, maybe he can fix the game with better asymmetric mech & weapon balance, combined with map overhauls, expansion, and redesign (including spawn points and objectives and whatnot) such that "spawncamp" or "lightrush" tactics would be vastly inferior to truely coordinated teams of Battlemech lance grouping.

[Summon3r]

sycocys, on 17 April 2015 - 11:20 AM, said:

I don't mind the idea, but it will make pug life extremely difficult - especially the ones that don't play CW because they can't yet comprehend matchups and teamwork.

Not that it will ever happen, but to me it would be a much better plan to implement lance objectives that split teams apart for the first 2 drops anyhow. Would be easier for pugs to figure out "Alpha lance objective - capture/defend communications tower, point waypoint Delta"

Split out among 3 lances, once those objectives were complete/failed either have a second set or open the gates and let the game continue on - there could even be sub-objectives that gave either side an advantage that needed to be taken/destroyed or defend right up to the base.

Basically any of the objectives you took part in for the campaigns for the previous games would work because all you are doing is swapping humans for ai. Its stuff that would engage all players and make every match feel like its own little war which would keep even the pugs that stay in standard drops coming back for more.

Will it happen? No. But that's also why this game won't have the decades long player base like the previous titles do.

i love these ideas (long as we arent talking AI defended stuff other then turrets or what ever), having lance objectives like a capturing or a destroying a comm center or relay or sensor cluster something would be awesome. all on one huge map/battlefield... that is how i had originally envisioned cw.

[1NV1CTUS]

The most simple solution to this issue is to reduce the amount of damage the gens take in the first x number of minuets in the match. For example take 70% damage in the first 8 minuets, then full damage after that.
It'll slow down light mech gen rush's but, a hard "legitimate" push would be unaffected.

Edited by 1NV1CTUS, 17 April 2015 - 02:58 PM.

[AlmightyAeng]

Telmasa, on 17 April 2015 - 02:26 PM, said:

Oooooooor, maybe he can fix the game with better asymmetric mech & weapon balance, combined with map overhauls, expansion, and redesign (including spawn points and objectives and whatnot) such that "spawncamp" or "lightrush" tactics would be vastly inferior to truely coordinated teams of Battlemech lance grouping.

Keep dreaming, you'll get that pipe someday.

Now I know why this was created:



It's Paul's little nod to Russ on game mechanics.

Edited by Ghost Badger, 17 April 2015 - 04:08 PM.

[Mystere]

1NV1CTUS, on 17 April 2015 - 02:57 PM, said:

The most simple solution to this issue is to reduce the amount of damage the gens take in the first x number of minuets in the match. For example take 70% damage in the first 8 minuets, then full damage after that.
It'll slow down light mech gen rush's but, a hard "legitimate" push would be unaffected.

Great, more magic force fields, but with a time-based delay. Fantastic!

[Jakob Knight]

The problem with the idea is that scouting isn't required right now. The maps ensure the Defenders already know exactly where the Attackers will go, and can pretty much engage them with only minimal movement. The Defenders also already have advantages given to them in both additional firepower from super-accurate turrets, more powerful dropships that the Defenders -must- accept fire from if they want to achieve the objective, and superior position to defend said objectives.

Adding in the additional ability for only the -defenders- to switch their mechs mid-battle anytime they see what the enemy has coming would be just too much. The reason Units use the rush tactic right now is because the attacking force has no other acceptable alternative if they want to achieve victory with the conditions as they are. The -only- way an attacking force will achieve victory by direct combat on an Attack map is if the Defending team is -markedly- inferior in both skill and/or equipment. As the Unit composition for both sides are set up to prevent this as a precondition, this means the Defending force would have to deserve to lose in order for it to be an 'even' combat encounter now, and that fact alone disallows any notion that it is the Defenders who need help.

Maybe if the maps were larger, and the attacking force could assault from any direction, if the Defenders had to choose how to deploy their own forces well before the engagement, and if there were no additional combat assets given to the Defenders than the Attackers, I could see this as a consideration. As things stand now, however, the whole idea that this tactic needs to be countered is simple bias that the Defenders should never lose an Attack battle if they are even close to an even opponent, or that battles should not be decided by thinking but brute, mindless brawls. Because that is all these measures will result in.

Edited by Jakob Knight, 17 April 2015 - 08:08 PM.

[Telmasa]

Ghost Badger, on 17 April 2015 - 04:05 PM, said:

Keep dreaming, you'll get that pipe someday.

Now I know why this was created:



It's Paul's little nod to Russ on game mechanics.

And they even went so far as to hand me that cockpit item with the basic urbie bundle on the twitch stream! Now I have to wonder if that wasn't done on purpose.

I will say those glasses make me giggle inside when running around with my urbie. Nothing like downing a Timber-god with 4MGs and just seeing the rolling eyes when they hear the Urbie-warhorn go off.