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Players Have Voted: Clans Are Not Op!


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#61 FragKommando

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Posted 26 April 2015 - 12:46 PM

View PostMcgral18, on 26 April 2015 - 12:34 PM, said:


You don't want to carry LRMs. They are terrible.

You want to carry many lasers. Clam lights cannot do that. IS lights more 30% faster, with more firepower in the majority of cases.


You really are clueless.



I like fast lrm boats so a clan light with an lrm 30 and 6 tons of ammo is unheard of for IS... pretty OP in my opinion

Edited by FragKommando, 26 April 2015 - 12:48 PM.


#62 LordBraxton

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Posted 26 April 2015 - 12:47 PM

View PostFragKommando, on 26 April 2015 - 12:44 PM, said:


IS moves faster that's it when it comes to firepower I dont think they can match a clans... add some srms or streaks with some lasers and you are good, and maybe the firestarter when it comes to firepower but we all know those are OP and lrms arent that terrible if you know how to use them...


stahp

we can MAYBE complain after we see how the arctic cheater performs

Edited by LordBraxton, 26 April 2015 - 12:47 PM.


#63 Andi Nagasia

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Posted 26 April 2015 - 12:49 PM

View PostFragKommando, on 26 April 2015 - 12:46 PM, said:


IS moves faster that's it when it comes to firepower I dont think they can match a clans... add some srms or streaks with some lasers and you are good, and maybe the firestarter when it comes to firepower but we all know those are OP and lrms arent that terrible if you know how to use them...

I like fast lrm boats so a clan light with an lrm 30 and 6 tons of ammo is unheard of for IS... pretty OP in my opinion

maybe, but remember IS has more Choices as well, not just in Mech Variants and Customization,
but in weapons as well, C-UACs/C-ACs arnt anywhere near as good as IS-ACs,
Stream Missiles get Eaten by AMS and have to hold Lock longer for all to hit,
so your Choice is Lasers or Srms, and even then they are hot in Mass,

#64 Mcgral18

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Posted 26 April 2015 - 12:53 PM

View PostFragKommando, on 26 April 2015 - 12:46 PM, said:



I like fast lrm boats so a clan light with an lrm 30 and 6 tons of ammo is unheard of for IS... pretty OP in my opinion


Aside from also being physically larger than their IS counterparts, they also lose cooling.


The Myth Lynx and Cute Fox require 2 extra DHS to match the dissipation of a FS9 with 10 DHS. They need to pay 2 tons to be match it.


Also, LRMs are bad. I'll assume you're trolling at this point, or at the deepest level of the Underhive.

#65 FragKommando

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Posted 26 April 2015 - 01:11 PM

View PostAndi Nagasia, on 26 April 2015 - 12:49 PM, said:

maybe, but remember IS has more Choices as well, not just in Mech Variants and Customization,
but in weapons as well, C-UACs/C-ACs arnt anywhere near as good as IS-ACs,
Stream Missiles get Eaten by AMS and have to hold Lock longer for all to hit,
so your Choice is Lasers or Srms, and even then they are hot in Mass,


I agree IS AC's are better, but the adder does really well with a UAC-20. It is a really fun build you can basically go the whole match tearing up mechs esp if you go for the big guys. The gauss rifle for the adder is also really fun too, most games I would have enough ammo till the end and you can really do some damage tearing off components of the larger mechs and even taking out lights with a few hits. I would like to see an IS light do that... again OP in my opinion...

#66 Xetelian

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Posted 26 April 2015 - 01:17 PM

View PostFragKommando, on 26 April 2015 - 12:46 PM, said:



I like fast lrm boats so a clan light with an lrm 30 and 6 tons of ammo is unheard of for IS... pretty OP in my opinion


Your opinion on what is OP is so vastly different from what I consider OP that we have got to get together and talk about it.

Personally, I don't bring LRMs I like my damage to hit 1 or 2 spots not shower everything with 1 damage over and over.

Now, I know LRMs have their place, they work well at keeping lines from pushing and have an area denial effect. They just don't do it for me.

#67 Pjwned

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Posted 26 April 2015 - 01:18 PM

View PostMilesTeg1982, on 25 April 2015 - 10:49 AM, said:

That leaves only one conclusion:
Most players in CW right now consider IS-Mechs/Weapons better than Clan-Mechs/Weapons.

Maybe they are right - maybe it is time to stop the buff IS and nerf Clans policy.


It's hard to come to a more faulty & unreliable conclusion based on your evidence.

#68 Mawai

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Posted 26 April 2015 - 02:05 PM

View PostLordBraxton, on 26 April 2015 - 12:42 PM, said:


I disagree with all your other posts but we are on the same page on this one man. IS wins lights, hands down.


I agree with you that IS lights are generally better. I play a lot of lights ... I have mastered 3 Jenners, Ravel-3L, Spider-5D, 2 Firestarters. I have also mastered the Kitfox-Prime (I don't see any point in mastering more than one variant of most clan mechs since the CT is in many cases the same).

Although the Kitfox is not as quick as most IS lights so is unsuited to long range reconnaissance ... it can pack on quite a bit of fire power into a 30 ton mech. I've run 2 ERPPCs on it ... way too hot but can be an effective sniper. TAG+LRM20+2xERML or something like that (LRMs are less of a good idea these days given the amount of ECM that is out), lots of CERML, CLPL or CERLL can also work. If you want to counter LRMs then the ECM+3AMS is an option ... though not one I would recommend these days. Anyway, after mastering it, I would say that the Kitfox is a useful support light mech and as long as it stays with the team it can contribute significantly.

In the medium, heavy and assault class the clans have mechs that are arguably the best in the game .. better than any of the IS counterparts even with quirks. In lights. although the IS probably has the best ones, I would still rate the clan options as above average ... certainly better than most Spiders/Commando/Locust and some Raven variants.

#69 Knyx

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Posted 26 April 2015 - 02:26 PM

It is really simple actually. IS players only think on-paper values hold weight when it comes to any sort of advantage they think Clan mechs have.

Do Clan mechs for the most have more hardpoints and the lighter weapons to fill them all? Yes

What happens in practice when a clan mech is fitted for the most firepower?
It has only 2 choices, between doing good damage once and awhile and spending most of the match shut down (+most likely dead in practice), or it does miniscule burst damage (unlike the IS counter parts) which is the most important type of damage in any PVP a million times over.

Do clan lasers have more range then IS lasers *on paper*? Yes

Do clan lasers have more range then IS lasers *in practice*? According to the IS quirk gods, big fat NO

Do clan lasers have more burst damage *on paper*? Nope. Simple math here.
Lets take Large pulse lasers as an example (and you can use any).

C-LPL: 13 damage @ 1.12 duration. 10 heat and 3.25cd
LPL: 11 damage @ 0.67. 7 heat and 3.25cd

13 damage over 1.12 is actually 11.6 damage in one full second
11 damage over 0.67 is actually 16.4 damage in one full second.
and since both have same cooldown (not even getting into quirks), anyway you calculate it from here, IS Pulse lasers win.

What advantage does lower duration give? Better trading, more pinpoint damage into same location.
What advantage does longer duration give? Nothing
The only thing arguable is heat generated per full second, but is easily shut down by the fact of same cooldown... and ofc many quirks.

"But clan lasers weigh less!" We already covered this because even the very tippy top clan mechs struggle in being able loadout enough firepower to match an IS mech at or around same tonnage and not overheating trying to do the same or even close to the same burst damage and in most cases DPS as well.


DO I even need to get into Clan Ballistics vs IS ballistics? lol

Still don't believe me or are (stubbornly) biased? I'd put money down that you take even one of the top clan mechs, and load them out in the best possible way (firepower+DHS mix ), and take an IS mech at the same or even close to the same tonnage and fit it out equally. Have both mechs face to face at 100m both still and aiming at CT. Both pilots firing in even the most Burst or even most DPS efficient way possible, the clan mech is gonna die first 8-9 times out of 10.



Population numbers do matter. It has already been covered and beaten like a dead horse that IS mechs and clan mechs equal out in terms of cost for fully fitting and mastering. However population, as even seen in real life scenarios based on populations always flooding towards path of least resistance, or shortest path to success and the psychology behind it. It is very easy to conclude the population has decided which side has the most powerful mechs. Even if IS has a cheaper "entry fee" as you may want to call it, No player is going to stick with a side that has inferior mechs, especially if they have been told the other side has OP ones, unless they are a RPer / actual loyalist. How much of the population in MWO fit the RP/ actual loyalist category? 2%? 5%? even 10% would be really pushing it. So if that majority thinks the other side has superior mechs they would either switch in droves or quit the game all together out of frustration.

So the biased IS players and alt accounts can continue to come to the forums and *claim* clan tech/ T-wolf or Crow or HBR whatever is overpowered, but even with all that outcry that you have done for so long, the majority still thinks and knows you are full of yourself.

Edited by Knyx, 26 April 2015 - 02:29 PM.






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