13 replies to this topic

[grendeldog]

Hey there people! So my current drop deck is a Misery, GHR-4H, HBK-4P(C), FS9-S(C). The Hunch is stock, while the rest have modifications to one degree or another - Misery with AC/20, FS9 with a faster engine and 5 MPL, etc. All the mechs carry radar perversion except the FS9, the HBK has seismic, and all four have weapon module slots filled completely.

My current build for the Grasshopper then is an XL330, 2 LPL in the wonderfully high torso mounts, 1 LL in the center torso, and 4 ML (2 in the arms, 2 in the side torsi to force the LPLs up to the high mounts). I find that it performs as an excellent weapons platform with good heat characteristics. In my experience most of the engagements in CW take place close enough that the LPLs and LL are quite effective, while the mediums are only there for when I absolutely must pump out the most damage possible, because at longer ranges the reduced damage isn't worth the heat.

I also think that the movement and torso twisting speeds provided by the higher than stock engine rating more than offset the added fragility that comes with an XL engine. I can tank damage with my arms, legs, and then generally all over my torso segments much more effectively than I could with the lower engine rating that would be required when running a STD reactor.

However, I also have a GHR-4N that carries 8 MPL using the same XL330. And so my question is whether you guys think it would be more effective to bring my current build on the GHR-4H or whether I should try taking the 8 MPL GHR-4N?

I definitely have range anxiety about the 4N. On a map like Grim Portico it would likely do just fine, with tons of cover and tight-quarters trench warfare. But on maps with larger sightlines - looking at the Takga's broken arse specifically - I am concerned I wouldn't be able to close range in time.

Furthermore, there's a period of time in every CW match where nothing is happening besides trading. And the 4N would seem to come out poorly in my mind as a choice for trading fire, again because of the range. Currently I can go with either the Misery or my longer ranged 4H first depending on whether I am on the offense or defense. With the lackluster long range trading ability of the 4N, I would only be able to use it when I am sure that I could get close enough to be really effective, which then affords me less flexibility as far as the order with which I chose to drop my mechs.

So what do you guys think? Can the 4N with 8 MPL be effective in CW? Any input would be greatly appreciated!

[Odins Fist]

I love XL engines in I.S. Mechs...

Keep using them.

[grendeldog]

Hah, I know they can be easier to pop than a standard engine build would be, but in certain heavy and assault mechs an XL can be beneficial.

The Grasshopper is an example of a heavy that needs an XL in order to have both adequate weaponry and adequate speed (both movement and torso twist); the Banshee is an example of an assault that can run an XL.

It is true that an XL is premature and certain death in most IS heavies and assaults, but there are indeed exceptions to that rule.

EDIT: I should add that I die in my XL GHR most often to center torso destruction. When I do die to having a side torso cored, I would die a few seconds later to center torso destruction anyway - like if I am the target of multi-enemy focus fire.

Edited by grendeldog, 01 May 2015 - 04:39 PM.

[Monkey Lover]

Resistance wave 1 and looks like wave 2 has no place in cw. . If you want to boat mpl get the 5ss.

Edited by Monkey Lover, 01 May 2015 - 05:12 PM.

[grendeldog]

Mm, maybe they do, maybe they don't. I have Grasshoppers but not Thunders at the moment, and they fulfill my tonmage requirements. I can always do a reliable 300 to 800 damage in the Hopper, so while they may not conform to the current 'must have' list of IS mechs for CW, they work well enough for me and play in an enjoyable way.

[MischiefSC]

If you don't have a thud, use a Dragon. GHR is a bad mech. Well, low end of average. A Dragon or even Cataphract would be better for any given role.

The GHR is the new Quickdraw.

[Monkey Lover]

grendeldog, on 01 May 2015 - 06:48 PM, said:

Mm, maybe they do, maybe they don't. I have Grasshoppers but not Thunders at the moment, and they fulfill my tonmage requirements. I can always do a reliable 300 to 800 damage in the Hopper, so while they may not conform to the current 'must have' list of IS mechs for CW, they work well enough for me and play in an enjoyable way.

with an good mech you would, pull 600-1600. What is not enjoyable about living longer and playing more?

[Jon Gotham]

Depends on what you want to do with your GH and what your team is doing with that wave of mechs. If you are doing an aggressive push your med pulse one would fit in, but if it's more of a "trade" wave your first one could also do that.

[Gorgo7]

If you have a Zen for Energy builds then the Grasshopper is excellent. Although a tall mech it is slim and mostly legs. Hard for energy to spend too much time on if you are in motion. The build out is purely a matter of preference as the OP inadvertently points out.
It jumps, moves smartly for a 70 ton machine, the energy points are higher than you think given the long legs.
Good energy mech.

[Alienized]

alot of quickdraws been used in the event and they done well. my QKD also runs a XL but performs as good as most thunerbolts if played well.
boating large lasers aint something the QKD should do. its more of a hole-filler between the thunderbolts and other mechs.
didnt use a GHR in the CW because they arent mastered yet but the high hardpoints of 2 of the versions should make them work.

even used a Zeus and it smacked clanmechs in the face with 10 kills and 1k+ damage.
the blackjack 1x also served me well in many CW'S already.
used a enforcer as well with quite good success.
cant use panthers because i am one of these guys that have at least one ecm in the deck which is a raven-3L.
it pretty much depends on the team's dropdeck and tactic but they do work.

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

grendeldog, on 01 May 2015 - 04:28 PM, said:

The Grasshopper is an example of a heavy that needs an XL in order to have both adequate weaponry and adequate speed (both movement and torso twist); the Banshee is an example of an assault that can run an XL.

My Warhammer 6K Grasshopper Proxy's would disagree with you.

[grendeldog]

Monkey Lover, on 02 May 2015 - 05:31 AM, said:

with an good mech you would, pull 600-1600. What is not enjoyable about living longer and playing more?

Fair enough point for sure. Mostly at the moment I am short on C-bills, and while I have no objection to spending real money on mechs, I just blew a bunch of cash at the start of Tukayyid to load up on modules and Stalkers and Firestarters and a even a Crab for the heck of it since I enjoy my AC/20 Misery so much. The KGC wasn't really a purchase for CW, but I'm not spending more cash in the next month out of having a proper budget.

I also worry about buying Thunders based on quirks when that chassis was garbage not too long ago. PGI doesn't seem to be able to quirk in moderation - it's either mediocre or totally nuts - and I am concerned that the Thunderbolts may be reworked, returning to a state of crappiness.

If I keep playing CW I will likley end up grabbing three Thunderbolts, I just can't at this specific moment. So I want to work with what I have until that time.

Gorgo7, on 02 May 2015 - 06:54 AM, said:

If you have a Zen for Energy builds then the Grasshopper is excellent. Although a tall mech it is slim and mostly legs. Hard for energy to spend too much time on if you are in motion. The build out is purely a matter of preference as the OP inadvertently points out.
It jumps, moves smartly for a 70 ton machine, the energy points are higher than you think given the long legs.
Good energy mech.

Yes, this mirrors my experience with the Hopper. It performs admirably in the pug queue, and serviceably in CW. I often get neglected in favor of more properly meta mechs, I can often trade with the high mounts without taking return fire from low-slung clan mech arms, and the mobility and jumping are good.

Flash Frame, on 02 May 2015 - 09:35 AM, said:

My Warhammer 6K Grasshopper Proxy's would disagree with you.

Interesting. What do you run on it?

[Gas Guzzler]

Monkey Lover, on 02 May 2015 - 05:31 AM, said:

with an good mech you would, pull 600-1600. What is not enjoyable about living longer and playing more?

Almost always put out 1000-1800 damage in my 'hopper. In a competitive sense, the 5SS is better, but I still enjoy the Grasshopper a lot, and it is at least "meta compliant" even if it is not the best.

My build is similar to the OP, only I run. An XL 325, 3 LPLs, 4 MLs and 18 DHS.

[MischiefSC]

Gas Guzzler, on 02 May 2015 - 10:25 AM, said:

Almost always put out 1000-1800 damage in my 'hopper. In a competitive sense, the 5SS is better, but I still enjoy the Grasshopper a lot, and it is at least "meta compliant" even if it is not the best.

My build is similar to the OP, only I run. An XL 325, 3 LPLs, 4 MLs and 18 DHS.

There are quite a few mechs that fit into that category, to be fair. I run a 1G Battlemaster with 3 ERLLs + 1 Gauss and a STD engine on any map but Caustic. Sword and board it does solidly. With the quirks it has that Gauss fires *fast* and I can't count the number of times I dropped a gauss round in on a hill-humper trying to twist and back out at the last second, blowing out a ST or finish a kill. Lasers are great and all but that 15 pt ppfld has a magic all its own. For anyone with the Resistance Pack who would love to find a use for their loyalty bonus mechs that particular build does rock solid in CW. Play it to side lean and not hill hump, run a STD and it crushes great at 600-800m.

I absolutely get that a Stalker 1N is a better investment of 85 tons. I don't actually own one right now and I don't want to blow cbills on one when my expectation is that it'll be nerfed down to 'average' in the next patch.

The ideal setup is either the 2xDragon 2xThud or comparable 4x Heavy setup for pugging/small groups or 2x Assault 2x Light for a 12man with a plan but the reality is for anything EXCEPT comp vs comp there's a lot of wiggle room for alternate mechs and builds.

So long as nobody starts mistaking 'does alright' for 'meta'.

Edited by MischiefSC, 02 May 2015 - 02:59 PM.