260 replies to this topic

[Pjwned]

Pezzer, on 06 May 2015 - 10:21 AM, said:

Gauss charge up doesn't need to be removed, Gauss ammo should just do less damage to Lights. I think that's the only way to fix the weapon system without turning it into something completely different.

It's just unfair to die in one hit, period. Especially in a game like this. When someone can kill me in 1 hit from the across the map while I'm running at full speed, there's something wrong. Yes, you can try to dodge hits, but lucky hits are going to happen and a lucky hit shouldn't take someone out of the game. Headshots are the only exception to this rule.

"Hard hitting weapons should deal less damage to me because I have weak armor despite knowing that I'm fast."

How is that anything other than scrub whining?

Pezzer, on 06 May 2015 - 11:06 AM, said:

A few hits is fine. ONE HIT FROM ACROSS THE MAP while I'm using my speed and agility to its' fullest possible extent is NOT. And this is a common occurrence, hence why I posted about it at all.

A Light mech should be able to make it to the end of a match, the same is true for an Atlas. Right now 1 is making it and the other is taking a 30-pinpoint alpha to the CT and dying. Gauss needs to be fixed, and dual Gauss is ruining Light gameplay right now.

If it's a common occurrence then it sounds like your positioning and map awareness is absolutely atrocious and you keep getting killed for it.

Edited by Pjwned, 06 May 2015 - 11:29 AM.

[Dolph Hoskins]

SaltBeef, on 06 May 2015 - 11:06 AM, said:

Another Elite minded player who because he is comfortable doing something .................. Level the Playing feild make it fun to use for everybody.

But your point and click simplicity is not "fun" for everyone. Imagine that.

If holding and releasing a mouse button is difficult I would recommend that those players avoid activities like walking in crowded places, driving, mowing the lawn, thinking while moving, using cutlery, and generally venturing out your front door.

[Johnny Z]

strikebrch, on 06 May 2015 - 11:19 AM, said:

Here we go again

Is that a threat?

[SaltBeef]

Removing the Charge does not make the elites better it make thier opponents better at fighting back. I sense fear of Equality.

[Johnny Z]

Well since everyone else refuses to say it I will. Leave the Gauss charge up as is, but have the option for it to auto fire when the charge up is complete. This removes the advantage a macro would have and leaves the mechanic in tact.

Those that "say" the machanic is better as is without macro use can keep it that way also.

Oops double post

A toggle like AMS and ECM have would do nicely.

Edited by Johnny Z, 06 May 2015 - 11:29 AM.

[generalazure]

Johnny Z, on 06 May 2015 - 11:24 AM, said:

Well since everyone else refuses to say it I will. Leave the Gauss charge up as is, but have the option for it to auto fire when the charge up is complete. This removes the advantage a macro would have and leaves the mechanic in tact.

That's a way more sensible suggestion imho. I still think firing it that way is actually a severe disadvantage, but as long as it's optional having it available can't hurt I guess.

[Kristov Kerensky]

Johnny, you obviously have no clue how the macro works, even though it's been explained many times in many threads, including multiple times in THIS thread. Using the macro DECREASES your ability to use the Gauss effectively because it charges and fires IMMEDIATELY when the charge is done. That means you waste a lot of ammo because your target isn't there any more. It's really a stupid macro to use.

As far as macro use, I'm against it, but PGI makes the rules and they don't have any problems with it so far, so it's still allowed. If PGI decides they can't be used, great, all for that, but until them, just accept it and move on.

Moldur, on 06 May 2015 - 02:33 AM, said:

Q: What is gauss rifle charge up supposed to do?
Q: Does it do that?

Q: If not, what is an alternative that will work?

Just so there's no confusion about the discussion.

The charge was put on Gauss to desync it firing with other weapons, specifically the PPC/ERPPC, as those were the weapon combos being used by Jump Snipers. First change to deal with them by PGI was the charge up, then they decreases speeds on ballistics on both Gauss and PPCs, then upped ballistics speeds on Gauss, lowered PPC speeds, JJ heat, decreased JJ thrust, required more than 1 JJ to get full thrust, and they kept playing with the JJ and PPCs until they reached the levels they are today.

ALL in an effort to combat 1 tactic used by a small part of the playerbase that was complained about by a very vocal segment of the playerbase in a total overreaction to the tactic in the first place. They fixed Jump Sniping by anything over 65 tons and also made PPCs damn near useless at range, which is exactly what they are meant for, and made JJs on anything over 65 tons a total waste of tonnage for the most part.

The charge had NOTHING to do with Gauss power in and of itself, it was only in relation to being used with PPCs and Jumping, that's it. Simply making it so reticule shake started the moment you hit the JJ and didn't stop until you landed again to combat the Jumping issue NEVER occurred to PGI, despite many of us pointing out that that was ALL that was required to end the problem.

jackal40, on 06 May 2015 - 10:02 AM, said:

I have to agree with OP, I'd like to see this removed.

I'm glad many of you don't have a problem with the charge up mechanism, but try to put yourself in the place of those of us who DO have problems using it.

I don't know if it's my age, too many years in the U.S. Army as a tank crewman, or something else that prevents me from effectively using the Gauss Rifle with the charging mechanism - I just can't hit with it.

I've tried just about everything I can, but I'm not successful.

Why should some players NOT be able to use a weapon?

Why can some people not use an Assault for crap but do great in a Light? Some weapons are harder to use properly, that's just how it goes, and those tend to be the weapons that have the highest damage in a single shot, did you notice that? Gauss, AC20s, PPC/ERPPC, all of those weapons take SKILL to use properly.

ANYONE can learn to use them however, it just takes practice and skill, both of which require the player to devote some time to the game.

Pezzer, on 06 May 2015 - 10:21 AM, said:

Gauss charge up doesn't need to be removed, Gauss ammo should just do less damage to Lights. I think that's the only way to fix the weapon system without turning it into something completely different.

It's just unfair to die in one hit, period. Especially in a game like this. When someone can kill me in 1 hit from the across the map while I'm running at full speed, there's something wrong. Yes, you can try to dodge hits, but lucky hits are going to happen and a lucky hit shouldn't take someone out of the game. Headshots are the only exception to this rule.

Gauss charge exists for a reason, I'm glad that it's there. It needs to stay so that Gauss doesn't become the end-all be-all weapon again. Instead, I think that Gauss should do less damage to Lights, the reason in lore being that Mech armor design combined with extremely fast forward movement makes a good chunk of the slug break off and away at impact. Or something, anything to justify the change. I like the challenge of Light piloting, but since the Clans were added Gauss has been more prevalent, and it does ruin the game experience when you die 30 seconds into the match not because of skill, but because the enemy team got a lucky shot off. I don't play Lights as much any more because it's just that bad now. I hit the Light tab and think about grinding, but then I get a flashback from the last time I played where dual Gauss killed me and I made no money. Again.

P.S. I'm seeing a lot of discussion that Gauss charge isn't working. Yes it is, you just don't understand the purpose of it. It's supposed to make Gauss less effective at instantly hitting everything you see, with the charge it switches from a ******** almost-instant 15 pinpoint ambush weapon, to a defensive/preparatory sniping and snapfiring weapon. Its' intention is to prevent hillhugging nubs from ruining the game with a 30 pt alpha across the map that can hit anyone at any time, and to make it difficult to hit anklebiters. Unfortunately, the charging mechanic does not help prevent the 1-hit kill problem that we can see still happening to lights, whether they're 200m away or 1200m away.

Why exactly should a Mech that has less TOTAL TONNAGE than I carry in weapons on my King Crab be able to walk away from an alpha from those weapons?

Because is NOT a reason by the way, so come up with something actually logical and we can debate that subject.

You choose to run a Light Mech, you should be aware that that means you can be 1 shotted by any Assault and most Heavys, if you make mistakes that allow them to hit you. For that downside, you get the extreme speed and agility that a Light has, making it very difficult to actually get those full alphas on target and 1 shot you, while you run circles around them and tear their back armor off with impunity the majority of the time.

I fear no Dire Wolf in my King Crab, but godsbedamned if my arse doesn't pucker up when I see a Light coming at me.

[TheSilken]

......................................................................................................................................but I like my charge up

[Y E O N N E]

Quaamik, on 06 May 2015 - 04:59 AM, said:

No, its not.

Raising the skill floor for the "best" weapon, or "best" mech just makes it so that when an average or lower player runs across someone who can use it they are that much further outclassed.

Weapons should be tweaked so the top end (expert level) is hard to reach, but the floor (entry level) is accessible to all.

That would be true if there weren't other weapons that are almost as effective but also easier to use. The Goose Waffle's superiority is a fringe benefit that is realized only if you are good enough in the first place, at which point you are going to get slaughtered all the same if this theoretical player were using a pair of large lasers instead.

When you don't raise the skill floor, the good players wipe the floor absolutely with the lesser players because you've made it that much more accessible. The AWP in Counter-Strike is deliberately hard to use for this very reason, and a slip-up with if even by an experienced player will generally get that player killed by an average player using an AK or pretty much any other weapon, and that's how it should be.

[Foxwalker]

Add me to the list. I would love to see the charge-up mechanic go away. While many have mastered it, there are a great many (myself included) that cannot wrap their head around it. I for one just do not use it anymore.

The mechanic was originally introduced as one of several fixes to combat the pop-tart problem. I don't believe getting rid of it would re-ignite that. especially considering how Jump Jets have been nerfed.

It's initial penalties are enough; high weight, low ammo per ton, fair number of crit slots. Oh and don't forget it explodes when damaged.

[Bobzilla]

The Ripper13, on 06 May 2015 - 08:14 AM, said:

I just can't agree with that reasoning.

All I will say is if PGI ever makes the mistake of removing the gauss charge I will make a dual gauss jump sniper so fast, get my laughs and be done with the game.

Sure take 30+ tons that would be useless under 200m on a jj capable mech. That will work out great.


Also to those saying the charge desyncs it, you're wrong. That's velocity, you can still fire all weapons at the same time.

[Sjorpha]

I don't care why the charge was implemented, because I actually like it. It makes the weapon feel special, and I see zero issues with it.

I also don't see any current balance issues with the gauss rifle.

Don't remove the charge, gauss is perfect as it is.

Edited by Sjorpha, 06 May 2015 - 02:28 PM.

[Lyoto Machida]

After reading some of the ridiculous responses in this thread, I think the proper course of action is to remove the chargeup and make Gauss a lock-on weapon like LRMs.

This would truly "level the playing field" for all of the guys that can't use it currently as it. Also, have ECM negate Gauss, as it does to LRMs currently (to be fair).

Or just get better at the game...that works also.

[MysticLink]

I like it the way it is. I like it the way it was before. I like them both. But for balance sake, I want to keep it the way it is now.

[Foxwalker]

Lyoto Machida, on 06 May 2015 - 02:28 PM, said:

After reading some of the ridiculous responses in this thread, I think the proper course of action is to remove the chargeup and make Gauss a lock-on weapon like LRMs.

This would truly "level the playing field" for all of the guys that can't use it currently as it. Also, have ECM negate Gauss, as it does to LRMs currently (to be fair).

Or just get better at the game...that works also.

It's nice that someone likes this comment. It is almost subtly well said so that you can for a second believe he is being helpful, but actually condescending.

The just get better at the game is a good touch too. Much, much better than saying L2P!

I play the game pretty well, but can't use the stupid thing. So you assume that means I can't play (and others with the same issue). The self centered nature of your comment is not lost on me.

I can go the other way. Let's make the game even harder, so less people can play! Why not require charge up on all weapons? Increase lock-ons for lock-on weapons to 60 seconds. There you go.

[process]

Here's an idea I posted in another thread:

Quote

New concept: Gauss cooldown removed, and instead needs to be manually recycled. Once recycled, there's a fairly generous firing window. Outside the firing window, no explosion chance. Inside the firing window, high explosion chance.

Example: Click once to begin charging. Takes 5 seconds to charge. Once charged, 10 second window to fire before the charge is lost. Once fired, the weapon does not automatically reload, and the pilot will need to click again to begin charging. If the rifle is hit while charging or holding the charge, between 5 and 15 seconds, there's a 70% chance of explosion.

I'd also be amenable to removing the charge altogether, but keeping a limit on how many Gauss rifles can fire at the same time, e.g. 1 shot every half second. As Foxwalker said, the Gauss already has plenty of drawbacks.

[VorpalAnvil]

It must say, JohnnyZ has outdone himself this time. 9 pages of posts on a non topic, all because his precious IS light mech isn't immortal. Pro troll is pro. I wonder if NKVA is hiring?

[The Blood God]

i like the idea of being able to use the charge mechanism or switch to an auto fire once fully charged mode as my mouse only allows for 2 buttons to be pressed simultaneously.

in a straight up brawl i could switch to auto fire once fully charged mode and tap the gauss let it do its thang whilst i fire off other weapon groups , i prefer using the charge and release fire mode because it means those pesky commandos/locusts cant run off before the round discharges

bit of advice go into your mouse settings in windows or the mouse program if you have one turn of enhanced pointer precision and acceleration set your dpi to 1000 if poss (most gaming mice can go up to at least 2000 dpi pointless in mwo) and lower mouse acceleration in the mwo settings this should make aiming much easier if it doesn't rest assured you just need practice!!!

i've been there dude didn't use guass for a long time as i used to move my mouse slightly when releasing the button but with these alterations in the settings a leather mouse pad that grips my mouse just enough to prevent little twitches in my hand moving the mouse and most importantly some practice i learned to love it. now i dont use an ac10/20 unless there's a good quirk for it

NB if you see a grid iron spamming gauss he's either very slow, running XL, or not packing much ammo exploit this, if you see an assault mech do not go in front of it scout!!! its what commandos do tear those components off from behind, chasing other lights will generally lead you to a wall of enemies

[Burktross]

Lightfoot, on 05 May 2015 - 07:31 PM, said:

MWO's Gauss Rifle is stupid. Remove the charge up and lower the projectile speed a bit and raise the recharge time a bit. Balance perfect, accessibility for all MWO players. This would be a Battle Tech Gauss Rifle, which is just a Mech-sized Rifle. If you want to bring Duke Nukem's Sniper Rifle into MWO use the apocryphal Railgun for your new mech Sniper Rifle.

The Gauss Rifle does not have a de-syncing charge-up. Read:

"Introduced in 2590 by the Terran Hegemony, the Gauss Rifle utilizes a series of electromagnets to propel slugs of ferrous nickel-iron alloy at extremely high velocities, making it a devastating and lethal long-range weapon. Unlike most traditional ballistic weapons, the Gauss Rifle does not use combustible propellant, so its firing generates very little heat. However, the sheer mass and bulk of the weapon limits its applications.

Since the Gauss Rifle fires solid metal slugs, with neither propellant nor explosive, Gauss Rifle magazines are not susceptible to ammunition explosions. However, if the weapon itself is struck by enemy fire, the capacitors that power the electromagnets will release their stored energy, with an effect similar to an ammo explosion. (In game terms, a critical hit on a Gauss Rifle is equivalent to a 20-point ammo explosion.) Some 'Mechs employ CASE in the section containing the Gauss Rifle to protect internal components in the event the weapon explodes."

In fact the text specifically states that the weapon is in the capacitor charged state or it could not explode. So it does not matter what you or I like, give us back the real Battle Tech Gauss Rifle. It has a pivotal place in the Battlemech arsenal and must not be removed and replaced with Duke Nukem's Sniper Rifle.

Duke Nukem had a sniper rifle?

[Kristov Kerensky]

Foxwalker, on 06 May 2015 - 02:48 PM, said:

It's nice that someone likes this comment. It is almost subtly well said so that you can for a second believe he is being helpful, but actually condescending.

The just get better at the game is a good touch too. Much, much better than saying L2P!

I play the game pretty well, but can't use the stupid thing. So you assume that means I can't play (and others with the same issue). The self centered nature of your comment is not lost on me.

I can go the other way. Let's make the game even harder, so less people can play! Why not require charge up on all weapons? Increase lock-ons for lock-on weapons to 60 seconds. There you go.

Take a Mech with a Gauss, launch the Training Grounds, any map, and go spend some time PRACTICING by yourself until you get your head wrapped around the charge up. If you haven't done that, I think the comment Lyoto Machida made is perfectly aimed for you, and I'm guessing you haven't done that yet otherwise you wouldn't have issues with using the Gauss as it works currently.

There is an onscreen indicator next to your targeting reticule for the gauss charge up as well as an audio cue. Training grounds removes any concerns about others shooting you so you can take your time and figure it out.

Oddly enough, the charge has actually made most of us who use Gauss better shots, we waste less ammo on teammate's backsides and we've learned to anticipate the enemy's movements, especially when playing peek-a-snipe.

Johnny is whining because he got 1 shotted by a dual gauss in a Commando, something that could just as easily be done with a number of other weapon systems in the game right now. Him trying to make it out that ONLY someone using a macro could do that is a total joke and shows exactly how little Johnny knows about this game. Gauss isn't a newb friendly weapon, but it's not a Master level weapon either, it's just something you need to spend a little time getting the hang on.

I know, who in all the hells expects players to spend time learning how something works in a video game, the nerve of those ********!