32 replies to this topic

[TheCharlatan]

Hello Mechwarriors,

I've recently heard about the fabled Splatcat (6xSRM6 Catapult A1), a true terror of the old days.

I love SRM only builds, and since Catapults are next on my "to buy list" (i already have the Jester, which for me is a good, yet fragile mech) i wanted to know if someone is still taking the Splatcat out, with what builds (Artemis or not? SRM4s o SRM6s?), and if they find it viable in the era of clan mechs and quirks.

[Beastbear]

they're a lil fragile for mwo now, but if the streakcrow can do it why the heck not.

Just be aware ghost heat gimped them a fair bit as well.

[Juodas Varnas]

TheCharlatan, on 10 May 2015 - 02:28 AM, said:

Hello Mechwarriors,

I've recently heard about the fabled Splatcat (6xSRM6 Catapult A1), a true terror of the old days.

I love SRM only builds, and since Catapults are next on my "to buy list" (i already have the Jester, which for me is a good, yet fragile mech) i wanted to know if someone is still taking the Splatcat out, with what builds (Artemis or not? SRM4s o SRM6s?), and if they find it viable in the era of clan mechs and quirks.

You're better off making SplatCrows (SRM Stormcrows or "Ryoken") or SplatDogs (SRM Mad Dogs, "Vultures", if you're more keen on IS names for Clan mechs, like me).
They're also capable of having some backup weapons, unlike the SplatCats.
And they're also better Hitbox wise.

[bad arcade kitty]

Beastbear, on 10 May 2015 - 02:35 AM, said:

they're a lil fragile for mwo now, but if the streakcrow can do it why the heck not.

Just be aware ghost heat gimped them a fair bit as well.

well, that's srm, not streak
way more scary if well aimed (it's impossible to aim streaks after all, i recall one game where enemy had a pretty good streakcrow who did several kills and like 900 damage, basically tore apart our team, eventually that person met my streakcrow, he was somehow damaged while i wasn't since i ran round capping points on hpg manifold and it was an open space so nowhere to hide.. no way to him to show his skill.. so we simply shot streaks till he died since he was more damaged) but way harder to use and generally worse vs lights and better vs heavies/assaults

Edited by bad arcade kitty, 10 May 2015 - 03:04 AM.

[Lightfoot]

I want the old SSRMs back. The fuzzy dice 14% chance to hit any mech section is to ARCADE-like for me. MechWarrior 3 had the best and most balanced SSRMs of any MechWarrior game. They gave them a wide turning arc so mechs could dodge them, but that meant that pilots could also learn to fire them better with practice. Very enjoyable skill to practice. MWO SSRMs are the very worst emulation possible.

SRMs are ok. Inner Sphere SRMs are more accurate so a Splat-Cat could be quite competitive with the Clan mechs.

[stjobe]

TheCharlatan, on 10 May 2015 - 02:28 AM, said:

if they find it viable in the era of clan mechs and quirks.

It's not viable any more, for a couple of reasons:
* Ghost Heat - fire more than three SRM launchers and you get hit by the heat bat.
* Bad hitboxes - those ears are really, really easy to hit.
* Bad scaling - it's bigger than a Stalker.
* Variable geometry - two SRM launcher in the ears, four tacked on to the ears. It's hideous.
* No backup weaponry - once the ammo is gone, that's it.
* No long-range weaponry - can't engage targets much farther than 270 m.

Other than that though, it's fine :/

[bad arcade kitty]

>Ghost Heat - fire more than three SRM launchers and you get hit by the heat bat.

in practice you can alpha several times and then use chain fire, way cooler than lasers etc stuff

>No backup weaponry - once the ammo is gone, that's it

you can take enough for the whole game easy, especially on a heavy mech

[Apnu]

stjobe, on 10 May 2015 - 05:59 AM, said:

It's not viable any more, for a couple of reasons:
* Ghost Heat - fire more than three SRM launchers and you get hit by the heat bat.
* Bad hitboxes - those ears are really, really easy to hit.
* Bad scaling - it's bigger than a Stalker.
* Variable geometry - two SRM launcher in the ears, four tacked on to the ears. It's hideous.
* No backup weaponry - once the ammo is gone, that's it.
* No long-range weaponry - can't engage targets much farther than 270 m.

Other than that though, it's fine :/

Agreed on the first 4 points, though ghost heat can be mitigated by alternating 3xSRM6 and only doing all 6 when you know you've got the kill.

As for the last 2 this is true of any min-maxed build, pure non-laser builds and any brawler build. I loathe min-maxed builds, they've got no operational flexibility, all eggs in one basket. Tip that basket over and they are done. Whenever I see min-maxed builds, its a good day for me, I know immediatly how to beat them and move to do so.

LRMs, closr to point blank, even clans, they do less damage the closer I am.

Ballistic, flank. Its dodgey, but focus on the gun locations, ususally arms, and remove them. Making an AC40 Jager a stick is a great match.

Lasers... Close and push the heat scale, especially clans, they're easy to panick and push.

[lsp]

Not with those ears, plus other mechs can do it better now.

[Lord Perversor]

stjobe, on 10 May 2015 - 05:59 AM, said:

It's not viable any more, for a couple of reasons:
* Ghost Heat - fire more than three SRM launchers and you get hit by the heat bat.
* Bad hitboxes - those ears are really, really easy to hit.
* Bad scaling - it's bigger than a Stalker.
* Variable geometry - two SRM launcher in the ears, four tacked on to the ears. It's hideous.
* No backup weaponry - once the ammo is gone, that's it.
* No long-range weaponry - can't engage targets much farther than 270 m.

Other than that though, it's fine :/

Forgot to add the
*PGI fixed the AOE damage impact allowing to double or even triple the damage by hitting several sections.

[Khobai]

IS-SRMs are really really bad. Twice the weight of C-SRMs.

IS-SRMs need their damage increased to at least 2.5 per missile.

They also need a 50% ammo increase like ballistics got.

[bad arcade kitty]

Khobai, on 10 May 2015 - 06:52 AM, said:

IS-SRMs are really really bad. Twice the weight of C-SRMs.

IS-SRMs need their damage increased to at least 2.5 per missile.

They also need a 50% ammo increase like ballistics got.

phew

it was already mentioned they are more accurate and you want to make them more damaging too

[TheCharlatan]

Khobai, on 10 May 2015 - 06:52 AM, said:

IS-SRMs are really really bad. Twice the weight of C-SRMs.

IS-SRMs need their damage increased to at least 2.5 per missile.

They also need a 50% ammo increase like ballistics got.

Don't know about that. My IS SRM brawlers do just fine, and they have better shield arms than their clan counterparts, meaning that they will almost always win a 1v1 (pilot skill apart).

However, the Catapult A1 dosen't have shield arms, so it might not work as well...

[Mcgral18]

Lord Perversor, on 10 May 2015 - 06:35 AM, said:

Forgot to add the
*PGI fixed the AOE damage impact allowing to double or even triple the damage by hitting several sections.

Up to 15 damage per SRM against small mechs, such as Commandos.

Splash was simply a circle that did equal damage to the source to any hitbox it touches.


As such, 90 damage per SRM 6 against the Commando, theoretically. Likewise, LRMs (at 1.8 damage per missile) destroyed light legs. I seem to remember a picture where everything but the cockpit was removed on the death screen, because of that.

[Khobai]

Quote

it was already mentioned they are more accurate and you want to make them more damaging too

They weigh TWICE as much. Of course they should be more damaging.

Quote

it was already mentioned they are more accurate

1) IS-SRMs without artemis are NOT more accurate than C-SRMs with artemis. And C-SRMs+artemis still weigh less than IS-SRMs without artemis.

2) IS-SRMs with artemis are slightly more accurate but have absurd weight/downsides for the paltry amount of damage they do. When you have to add artemis on top of the already heavy IS-SRMs its just not worth it anymore.



The damage on IS-SRMs and IS-SSRMs needs to be bumped back upto 2.5/missile.

Artemis needs a buff: both for SRMs and direct LRMs, because artemis is simply not worth its tonnage. One possibility is for artemis to give increased missile crit chance.

The ammo on both IS and C SRMs/SSRMs needs to be increased by 50% per ton. Ballistics and LRMs both got this 50% ammo increase but SRMs/SSRMs never did for some reason.


This laser crap has gotta stop its time to buff other weapons.

Edited by Khobai, 10 May 2015 - 07:41 AM.

[Mister Raven]

I've used many SRM boats before, mad dog catapult storm crow kintaro and i swear theres some serious hit registration issues when you fire 70+ damage worth of rockets into a mech and it shows very little damage done.


I some times suspect there is an artificial damage limit in the game but its most likely hit registration.


Also i highly recommend not using srm 6 ever again and sticking to SRM4+artemis.

Edited by Mister Raven, 10 May 2015 - 07:18 AM.

[bad arcade kitty]

Khobai, on 10 May 2015 - 07:15 AM, said:

They weigh TWICE as much. Of course they should be more damaging.

i don't see how 'of course' got there

[Elizander]

Splattercats work fine if you know how to brawl. You can't fight a group though. Whoever isn't pressured is gonna shoot your ears off but they might not live long enough to do so if you catch someone alone. Definitely never a frontline mech. More of a hit and run cause you gotta protect your stupid ears.

[Khobai]

Quote

i don't see how 'of course' got there

Because PGI's design goal was to make IS and clan mechs equal. Clan tech is not supposed to be superior. Thats why we have 12v12 and not 12v10.

So when you have C-SRMs that are outright better than IS-SRMs it goes against the design goal of clan tech being "equal but different".

Clan SRMs should weigh less, do less damage, but be more compact and streamlined.

IS SRMs should weigh more, have better accuracy, and do more damage. Right now IS SRMs are a tiny bit more accurate and do a tiny bit more damage but thats not enough to balance out weighing twice as much. They need a bigger damage bonus so theres actually a reason to use them over lasers.

Also if you hadnt exactly noticed... SRMs arnt used very often anymore. Were in the middle of a laser-centric meta. So buffs to non-laser weapons should be welcomed. IS-SRMs as well as Clan ACs both need buffs to help encourage more weapon diversity.

Quote

Splattercats work fine if you know how to brawl.

Really? Then why doesnt anyone use them?

Oh right because laser mechs can do close to the same damage, but with two to three times the range, and no ammo constraints.

In a healthy meta both SRMs and lasers would be equally viable choices. But we have a lopsided meta that heavily favors ranged energy weapons over everything else.

Edited by Khobai, 10 May 2015 - 08:04 AM.

[bad arcade kitty]

no, you don't want them to be equal, you want is srm to be superior because damage it's their most important stat