407 replies to this topic

[Gas Guzzler]

Spadejack, on 12 May 2015 - 11:00 AM, said:

Clan inst the meta, but the only competitive build that can be put on a Timber is a laser vomit build. That said, what other clan mechs you see as meta? And beleive me, timbers arent quirked for lasers like...i dont know... the thunderbolt? The Stalker? The firestarter?
Teamplay wins games. Even agaisnt your meta mechs!

That is because the Timber Wolf doesn't need quirks to be competitive. Quirks are in the game because of the Timber Wolf lol.

Oh you forgot the ER ML Gauss build, that one is very good.

[Adamski]

Spadejack, on 12 May 2015 - 10:57 AM, said:

And if you look at the statistics, youll see that, besides clan winning more, the IS killed more enemy mechs and did the most damage. How did the clans won? Simple, teamplay... and also 3 of the most competitive teams joined.
So, what makes one win in this game? Teamplay!!! Now that tukayid is over, they went back to IS. Why? Because their meta mechs are IS!
Listen, competitive teams only go for the meta, of any game! Dont care about my opinion nor yours, they care about winning and fighting against other comp teams. So they use what is meta, and that is IS mechs. As simple as that

ARE YOU ******* SERIOUS?!?!

Huge competitive event, and all the competitive teams go Clan for best chances of winning and improving their stats.

After the event, they go back to IS for a break from the Clans.

[Dragomir Kies]

Lol 18 pages of whining, Awesome, in just few hours Respect

[Molossian Dog]

Newsflash, PGI.

This is not the problem.
Nor is it a solution.

It is just stupid. You are fooling yourselves if you think this will make a difference.

[CrushLibs]

Adamski, on 12 May 2015 - 11:01 AM, said:

Pull up Smurfy mechlab, and build an IS Meta Mech
Pull up the quirk list
Apply the listed quirks to the chassis DPS stats
You now have the quirked DPS
Apply the listed quirks to the weapon base range
You now have the quirked range

Now build a Clan Meta Mech
You now have a mech that can match the IS Meta Mech

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...fc18ce10e999aeb

Heat Generation 9.15

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...5028a0f2434393a

Heat Generation 9.88 - 20% = 7.904

So 9.15 = 7.904 ???? don't think so TIM

[CrushLibs]

Gas Guzzler, on 12 May 2015 - 11:03 AM, said:

That is because the Timber Wolf doesn't need quirks to be competitive. Quirks are in the game because of the Timber Wolf lol.

Oh you forgot the ER ML Gauss build, that one is very good.

Jesus you are noob or think like one hard to tell.

So the DW is competitive in CW ,, OK

Now the KC needs 25% more armor due to the TW??
The Locust needs 50% more armor due to the TW??
The DRG 1N needs 67% faster cooldown due to TW ??

I can't believe one mech made PGI do 100s of quirks wow I would think they would nerf the TW oh wait they DID.

[Adamski]

CrushLibs, on 12 May 2015 - 11:17 AM, said:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...fc18ce10e999aeb

Heat Generation 9.15

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...5028a0f2434393a

Heat Generation 9.88 - 20% = 7.904

So 9.15 = 7.904 ???? don't think so TIM

How ******* dumb are you? The WHK generates 15% more heat, but has 28 DHS compared to the STK 20, which is a 40% increase in dissipation.

[Earlito]

Oh thanks a bunch! Good thing that some players bought mechs for the 250 dropdeck and are getting kicked in the b*tt right now...
Thanks a bunch PGI.

[Jack Spade Ward]

Juodas Varnas, on 12 May 2015 - 11:02 AM, said:

You should stop licking the lead based paint you paint your mechs. It's affecting your brains, or whatever left of them.
Timbers are still the top mechs in-game even when compared to quirked IS mechs

I guess youre a cry baby IS fan boy to answer me like that...
In case you dont know, clan tech is suposed to be better, much better!

[Gas Guzzler]

CrushLibs, on 12 May 2015 - 11:22 AM, said:

Jesus you are noob or think like one hard to tell.

So the DW is competitive in CW ,, OK

Now the KC needs 25% more armor due to the TW??
The Locust needs 50% more armor due to the TW??
The DRG 1N needs 67% faster cooldown due to TW ??

I can't believe one mech made PGI do 100s of quirks wow I would think they would nerf the TW oh wait they DID.

I was addressing the Timber Wolf because that is what he said.

Are you really resorting to personal insults now?

I never said DW is competitive in CW. Nice reading comprehension.

Quirks are here to balance inferior mechs with superior Mechs LIKE the Timber Wolf. This was in response to someone crying about the TBR not getting quirks.

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 12 May 2015 - 11:36 AM.

[Adamski]

Spadejack, on 12 May 2015 - 11:32 AM, said:

I guess youre a cry baby IS fan boy to answer me like that...
In case you dont know, clan tech is suposed to be better, much better!

And IS is supposed to outnumber the clans 4 to 1

[CrushLibs]

Adamski, on 12 May 2015 - 11:27 AM, said:

How ******* dumb are you? The WHK generates 15% more heat, but has 28 DHS compared to the STK 20, which is a 40% increase in dissipation.

There is a 24% not 40% increase in heat dissipation 3.91 vs 5.20 heat/s DHS is 1.4 not 2.0 Duh

Gas Guzzler, on 12 May 2015 - 11:34 AM, said:

I was addressing the Timber Wolf because that is what he said.

Are you really resorting to personal insults now?

I never said DW is competitive in CW. Nice reading comprehension.

Quirks are here to balance inferior mechs with superior Mechs LIKE the Timber Wolf. This was in response to someone crying about the TBR not getting quirks.

AWWWW nope the TBR was Nerfed when they locked JJs and increased heat on clan weapons.

Just sounded noobish which according to your friends you are an experienced player sorry was just teasing you didn't mean anything personal sorry if it came off poorly this is the internet.

[Adamski]

CrushLibs, on 12 May 2015 - 11:43 AM, said:

There is a 24% not 40% increase in heat dissipation 3.91 vs 5.20 heat/s DHS is 1.4 not 2.0 Duh

5.2 / 3.91 is 33% which is still twice as much increased dissipation compared to the 15% increased heat generation.

Overall proving my point that the WHK is EQUAL TO THE STK

Edited by Adamski, 12 May 2015 - 11:47 AM.

[Void Angel]

Pariah Devalis, on 11 May 2015 - 03:53 PM, said:

They also do equal to, or less, damage per second than IS weapons, and generate more heat. C'mon, man! Look at more than just one value. There are multiple aspects to the balance state involved here. :\


The only point of dubious imbalance is the clan XLE.

I agree with your conclusion, but actually, Clan weapons generate equal or greater DPS. The only exception is the non-ultra placeholder ACs that were implemented because ammo switching for C-LBX series ACs wasn't (and isn't) functional. The primary difference in Clan weapons is efficiency and stare times. For example, the C-ERLL does more dps and is only slightly more inefficient (dps per heat) than the Inner Sphere ERLL. While Clan laser models does suffer from longer beam duration, they are well-compensated with range, lighter tonnage, and weapon space - particularly once smaller DHS are considered.

HOWEVER, these strengths come at a price, and the Clans' short-range lasers - while still doing more dps - are massively inefficient compared to the Inner Sphere's. Look at Smurfy's Awesome Spreadsheet and divide hps by dps for the Clan and Inner Sphere LPLs sometime. Clan Autocannons are similarly disadvantaged at close range, and nobody who vaccinates their dang mechs with AMS fears Clan LRMs. So the only debatable balance issue is the massive mobility for negligible cost enjoyed by most Clan Omnimechs - particularly the Unholy Trinity of Hellbringer, Stormcrow, and Timber Wolf. Of course the Clans do not have any truly fast Lights, but relative force compositions are changing, and beyond the scope of this point in any case.

So while I do agree that the Clans are overall pretty balanced, I did want to stress the important point in comparing Clan v. Inner Sphere weapons - this is the reason that most successful Inner Sphere engagements with the Clans involve close range.

[Void Angel]

InnerSphereNews, on 11 May 2015 - 02:25 PM, said:

Greetings MechWarriors,



Following their loss to the Clans in the First Battle of Tukayyid, Inner Sphere forces have been meeting the Second Clan Invasion with greater strength and ferocity than ever.



Many territories have been won by the Inner Sphere forces since the borders were reset at the end of the battle, and such gains come at a cost: Inner Sphere supply lines and infrastructure in the outer territories, already being stressed by extended Clan occupation, have experienced even greater turmoil in the wake of immense losses experienced at the Battle of Tukayyid.
In their noble efforts to prevent such a defeat again, the Inner Sphere forces have stretched their supply lines too thin.



Effective from 3PM PDT today, Inner Sphere DropDeck tonnage limits have been reduced from 250 tonnes to 240 tonnes.

Neat flavor text and all, but... how come? I'm not sharpening a pitchfork or anything, but an explanation would give the many, many stupid totally not at all unreasonably upset people in this thread less room to spin their hair-brained conspiracy theories completely not self-serving and biased explanations.

[CyclonerM]

Adamski, on 12 May 2015 - 11:39 AM, said:

And IS is supposed to outnumber the clans 4 to 1

You are right, i suppose. Were it for me, i would gladly try something like 5 OmniMechs with locked armor but un-nerfed weapons vs 12 3025-tech IS 'Mechs (no Gauss/ERPPC etc, SHSs only, no endo-steel..), all with stock loadouts and BT armor values

[Jack Spade Ward]

Adamski, on 12 May 2015 - 11:39 AM, said:

And IS is supposed to outnumber the clans 4 to 1

yep, and they do... IS outnumbers clan 10 to 1, while clan tech is so nerfed that cant compete with the IS meta mechs

So yes, cry me a river with all the whining you IS fan boys are used to do

[Adamski]

CyclonerM, on 12 May 2015 - 12:02 PM, said:

You are right, i suppose. Were it for me, i would gladly try something like 5 OmniMechs with locked armor but un-nerfed weapons vs 12 3025-tech IS 'Mechs (no Gauss/ERPPC etc, SHSs only, no endo-steel..), all with stock loadouts and BT armor values

Umm.. thats not quite right, Battle of Tukayyid was 4 ComGuard Star League era tech battlemechs for each Clan Omnimech.

Spadejack, on 12 May 2015 - 12:03 PM, said:

yep, and they do... IS outnumbers clan 10 to 1, while clan tech is so nerfed that cant compete with the IS meta mechs

So yes, cry me a river with all the whining you IS fan boys are used to do

Matches are limited to 12 pilots vs 12 pilots, population imbalance simply means the over populated side has to wait longer for a match now. And I've already proven that the IS Meta Mechs are simply competitive with the nerfed clan tech.

[Void Angel]

Spadejack, on 12 May 2015 - 11:32 AM, said:

I guess youre a cry baby IS fan boy to answer me like that...
In case you dont know, clan tech is suposed to be better, much better!

No they're not. In MWO Clan 'mechs are supposed to be equal to Inner Sphere 'mechs, for very good reasons that were explained well prior to the launch of the Clan Invasion. Before you even start, simply making the Clans balanced against the Inner Sphere doesn't wreck or damage this game, because this game is not a combat module for your fantasy MechWarrior LARP, nor a means to re-live the tabletop experience from your childhood.

Put the rulebook from the other game down, and stop hitting.

PS: Your argument just above is laughable. You can't compare the Inner Sphere's numerical advantage in-game (and you're making up numbers, by the way) to actual numbers on the battlefield, even if your silly assertion that Clans are "supposed to be" canon is accepted. In MWO, the Inner Sphere simply cannot make use of the advantage you suppose in many situations. The current push against the Adjective Animals is because of organizations, not numbers.

Adamski, on 12 May 2015 - 12:10 PM, said:

And I've already proven that the IS Meta Mechs are simply competitive with the nerfed clan tech.

Actually, I'm pretty sure the Battle of Tukayyid just proved that. =)

[AnimeFreak40K]

The amount of rage and hate going on about this particular change is amusing to me…

…actually, the rage and hate that comes from any changes in this game are hilarious now that I think about it.

I honestly and truly have to wonder if there were some subtleties about this game that people have generally and completely missed and they completely and utterly lose any possibility of coherent thought and simply roll their faces over their keyboards as they spout their vicious hatred that is formed out of their ignorance (admittedly, the fact that this is the internet and people always have to rage about something is also likely a factor as well, but that lies outside my point).

What subtleties am I talking about?

For starters, this game is inspired by the lore of BattleTech… I am well aware that some folks are aware of this fact and this particular bullet-point is not for you, so moving on: this inspiration begins and ends with the background, equipment, names and locations. Anything above and beyond that is simply window dressing at best and PGI has taken the efforts to point out that the Lore and such are merely guidelines at best.
The rage and lamentations about certain aspects of the tabletop game, books and other lore (people changing factions at a whim, people playing both sides, Clans hiring mercenaries, etc., etc., etc.) are absolutely meaningless. The sooner you realize this, more likely the happier you will be. If this is not a viable solution, then I would suggest you start getting to work on the game that *you* want to play.

Following up is pretty much anything that changes in this game, though the crux of this observation is usually centered around various quirks and such. The fact of the matter, and this is something that I am pretty well convinced most of the people playing this game cannot wrap their heads around is that at its baseline, MechWarrior: Online is an MMO. In MMOs things change. They change a lot. Some MMOs are only PvE, others are strictly PvP but most of them have a mixture of the two. In games that have PvP elements, a Metagame is developed, that can be roughly translated to best practices that make the most out of what the game’s mechanic.
Players that develop this meta do so with the expectation that their way of doing things will out-perform other players. Strategies and tactics, equipment, etc. are built up (some more quickly than others). This is common, this is expected.

Equally common and expected by those who play MMOs like Guild Wars 2 or World of Warcraft are things that shift and change the established meta. Some of these changes are minor and hardly noticeable by the majority of the population while others can completely tear the current asunder leaving nothing but ruin and ash in its place. These changes are done on purpose. This disruption is completely and totally intentional and it is NOT because the developers ‘hate the community’, ‘can’t balance anything’ or ‘have no clue what they’re doing’.

These changes, these intentional disruptions have the sole purpose of creating and maintaining an in-game dynamic. They do it to keep things interesting and competitive. They do it to prevent boredom and encourage people to do and try new and different things. This, my fellow MechWarriors, is the most important reason why things can, will and should change. Because once things get locked in to a certain meta, things will quickly get boring. And (most) players won’t stick around for ‘boring’.

The fact that PGI has announced that they intend to release this game through Steam at some point in the near-ish future, the fundamental fact of the matter is that there will be changes. And if PGI wants to increase and grow its player base, it NEEDS to keep things interesting for everybody…or at least as many people as possible.
TL;DR:

• Complaining about stuff regarding lore is stupid and pointless. Don’t like it, make a game that is closer to the lore or what you want to play
  
• Complaining about any given changes in the game is stupid and pointless. As an MMO-style game with a strong base in PvP, you can expect changes that will disrupt the meta and cause people to establish new metas. Get used to it.