587 replies to this topic

[SnagaDance]

IraqiWalker, on 12 May 2015 - 02:37 AM, said:

It could be that a lot of it is irrelevant to us. Such as for example how often player X wobbles his turret.

I wobble my turret every chance I get. It just makes me feel good.

[Skarlock]

Morang, on 12 May 2015 - 04:35 AM, said:

What counts as cheating and what doesn't? What "third-party tools" are you talking about? Teamspeak could be described as 3rd party tool that gave a great advantage to players before the introduction of built-in voice comms. There were protests on forums against the use of gaming mouse macros because "it gives unfair advantage to people with better hardware" (as if better FPS because of better CPU and GPU doesn't, LOL). SweetFX and custom user.cfg can improve visibility and contrast for better aiming (user.cfg though isn't "3rd party", just legit game settings). Every mechwarrior and his surat uses something from the list above.

So please specify what are you fighting? Are there really aimbots/wallhacks or manipulations with lag/sync? Or what?

I'm not sure if you're allowed to talk in depth about it on the forums, but let me just say that the "high level" player they are talking about that was banned, was banned for cheating. It would be self evident then that if a player is banned for cheating, that there is/are some ways to cheat in the game, and more than likely it would be through either modifying the game client or using third party software.

Just use some common sense. Plenty of streamers use mouse macros or firing macros and are not banned, and if PGI banned everyone for using team speak to talk with each other in game, probably 90% of the player base, including Phil and the entire NGNGtv group, would be banned. On the other hand, you don't see anyone using software to teleport around the map or run at 10x speed, so it should be safe to assume attempting that will result in a ban. Yes I am aware that the game engine might make these feats literally impossible, I'm just giving them as random examples of hacks/cheats that have been used in other games. If you aren't sure about what constitutes cheating, open a ticket with support and ask about it.

Edited by Skarlock, 12 May 2015 - 04:55 AM.

[DAEDALOS513]

Somebody needs to start a list showing these banned cheaters. They have no honor and deserve no mercy or dignity.

[Lily from animove]

Morang, on 12 May 2015 - 04:35 AM, said:

What counts as cheating and what doesn't? What "third-party tools" are you talking about? Teamspeak could be described as 3rd party tool that gave a great advantage to players before the introduction of built-in voice comms. There were protests on forums against the use of gaming mouse macros because "it gives unfair advantage to people with better hardware" (as if better FPS because of better CPU and GPU doesn't, LOL). SweetFX and custom user.cfg can improve visibility and contrast for better aiming (user.cfg though isn't "3rd party", just legit game settings). Every mechwarrior and his surat uses something from the list above.

So please specify what are you fighting? Are there really aimbots/wallhacks or manipulations with lag/sync? Or what?

anything that automates thins you as a human should do, and gets you more information or peformance than the game would provide you with.

Aim assitants, in whatever way, macros, and wallhacks. Speed, ammo and healthhacks and whatever. Most of them is prevented by the server managing health and damage but client sides stuff still stays. Communication is not one of this because its a basic human way of interaction. Hardware does not belong to this, Sry when someone is not able to run the game properly he is putting himself on a disadvantage. But saying that someone is getting an unfair advantage by having better hardware is the wrong way to look at this.
Configs, well yes they are as long as the devs do not tell you which adjustments are allowed. because actually, everything past the options menu should not be altered by players.

But the client sided hacks, like wallhacks, and aimbots, they drag information right out of the dll's And those are not in interaction with any of the packets send via network. Hacking the server itself, giving you further additional informations is extremely unlikely nad way too much effort, And the way how hitreg works would really need basically hacking and rewriting the games code on the server to be efficient.

[PFC Carsten]

I think everyone should be able to google the obvious keywords MWO cheat banned - and find out who it is, that was giving other players a hard time and whose name is now protected under the PGI rules.

[Skarlock]

Nik Reaper, on 12 May 2015 - 01:42 AM, said:

This mostly stems, at least for me, from the fact that pgi is trying to be double faced, as I see it, they seem like they want to cozy up to the players as the small in house friendly types that in fact can not survive in a competitive enviroment by there talents and efforts alone ( double that developer count and more testers and quality assurance people! ) but like to pull the corporate face any time they find it convenient to fight criticism.

I literally have no idea what this means. Maybe you've never worked a job in customer service? Let me explain to you then. When you run a BUSINESS, you are trying to convince people to use/buy your products/services for money. You're not a charity, you're not some random guys personal hobby, you are a business. This means you have to be nice to your customers, because no one wants to give their hard earned money to a bunch of jerks. However, if there are people that are threatening your business, and could hurt your income, the nice face comes off and the corporate face goes on. This is how *every* business works in the real world, period. You have the nice face on as long as people are nice, the corporate face goes on the moment your business is threatened, and that's life. This is pretty much how people in general work. They are nice and cozy as long as you are nice and cozy, and very defensive and sometimes aggressive if you are threatening them. It's almost like you're some kind of alien who doesn't understand basic human behavior. It's unfathomable.

[Desintegrator]

Great !
We have to wait 3 years for this now, but its never to late to act.

[Morang]

Skarlock, on 12 May 2015 - 04:48 AM, said:

If you aren't sure about what constitutes cheating, open a ticket with support and ask about it.

Lily from animove, on 12 May 2015 - 04:53 AM, said:

Aim assitants, in whatever way, macros, and wallhacks.

NVM, I've already googled it. Just wasn't deep enough into competitive play and haven't played much recently to encounter it myself probably.

[Skarlock]

Lily from animove, on 12 May 2015 - 04:53 AM, said:

Aim assitants, in whatever way, macros, and wallhacks.

I'm not going to name names, but I've seen several high level players using firing macros, typically in joke builds featuring LB2-X or AC/2s. I don't think firing macros are a bannable offense. If PGI has said this is not allowed please cite the source. Also consider that some people in the MWO player base may have special needs. Are you really going to tell a guy who say, is missing a few fingers due to an accident, or has nerve damage, that he can't use macros to make the game more playable? They give us a form of in game macros in the way of chain firing, so how are macros supposed to be a bannable offense?

On the other hand, setting up a macro to join games while a user is AFK for the purpose of farming cbills would definitely be bannable because that's non-participating in games. I've seen some people on the forums claim that this is not allowed, but the specifics and the source are elusive...

[Morang]

IMO quick-firing macros are just fixing chain-fire functionality that isn't working properly. 3 - 4 AC/2s in a weapon group set for chain fire should of course be firing like they do with a macro, fully utilizing their rate of fire. They don't just because of clumsy chain fire implementation.

[DAEDALOS513]

TLBFestus, on 11 May 2015 - 06:09 PM, said:

How do you know that a cheat is detectable?

Not actually expecting an answer of course, just saying that some cheats are/could be undetected at this point and you don't know.

Other than that...this is good news. It cleared up the conjecture, proving a cheater has been caught and banned.
IMHO one of the best things you can do it promote the fact you caught a cheater every time you catch one. It impresses the vast majority of honest players and dispirits the hackers.

Buddy, they need to out this scum with impunity. They deserve no less and we need to see how effective they are in detecting these cheats. I as a paying customer should not have to 'hunt-down' players names to see if they are cheating. There needs to be a centralized list. Remember this is just a video game, hardly a situation where human-rights are involved.

[Tom Sawyer]

Reddit on fire

B33f under fire

People you can easily do some reddit searching and find out the player in question. Then you can join the conspiracy theory witch hunt

In the end the only person who knows the WHOLE truth is the banned player

If PGI chooses not to post a list of banned cheaters then someone will create a web page elsewhere that does so

If you cheat you are only tainting the game for the rest of us

[DAEDALOS513]

MadWOPR, on 11 May 2015 - 06:51 PM, said:

With a company with a record of banning people who spoke out on unrelated forums and a rocky history with the truth/promises, I would think they should err on the side of being as transparent as possible and say how they could figure it out. Without that, and again considering someone got a LIFETIME ban for insulting a dev (which isn't exactly evidence of sane, evenhanded moderating), why would anyone with a skeptical bone in their body believe that PGI wouldn't do something as petty as smear someone over a chargeback?

When they insulted the dev, was it against policy where banning was a possible outcome?

Triordinant, on 11 May 2015 - 06:54 PM, said:

Does anyone else notice that all 3 people questioning the ban are all from the same Unit?

JUST TOO FUNNY

[Lily from animove]

Morang, on 12 May 2015 - 05:23 AM, said:

IMO quick-firing macros are just fixing chain-fire functionality that isn't working properly. 3 - 4 AC/2s in a weapon group set for chain fire should of course be firing like they do with a macro, fully utilizing their rate of fire. They don't just because of clumsy chain fire implementation.

Skarlock, on 12 May 2015 - 05:16 AM, said:

I'm not going to name names, but I've seen several high level players using firing macros, typically in joke builds featuring LB2-X or AC/2s. I don't think firing macros are a bannable offense. If PGI has said this is not allowed please cite the source. Also consider that some people in the MWO player base may have special needs. Are you really going to tell a guy who say, is missing a few fingers due to an accident, or has nerve damage, that he can't use macros to make the game more playable? They give us a form of in game macros in the way of chain firing, so how are macros supposed to be a bannable offense?

On the other hand, setting up a macro to join games while a user is AFK for the purpose of farming cbills would definitely be bannable because that's non-participating in games. I've seen some people on the forums claim that this is not allowed, but the specifics and the source are elusive...

Well careful, just because you think its a fix, doe snot make it legit. And most times macros are not penalsied because with hardware today having macroability it is hard to impossible to proerly check this. But then the server can recognise "perfect" repeated pattern

And be careful with the "missing finger guy" example. That may be sad, but thats how it is, sry. Because cheaters, better hack marketing is using similar "psychology" by trying to tell their customers, their cheating is actually not cheating. they tell them, its just bringing odds in a line, because the cheat equals out the no life time a pro can spend to train, while you can't. or that you just cover your inabilities to be on the same level as pro's. So very very carefully here, this is exactly the bait many hackers throw at innocent souls to hook them up. They try to explain you how everythign you do is fine, and try to make those borders look fishy. Too bad I cna not find that statement, it would make you wonder what nosnense they talk, yet what people do still believe to hack and still feel like they don't do anything wrong.

You have the ingame chainfire and single fire category, those are the by game allowed tools, and you should not extend them with external 3rd party use. So basically anything than replacing hardware shortcuts to other mousebuttons and such, should not be done.

Edited by Lily from animove, 12 May 2015 - 05:45 AM.

[IraqiWalker]

DAEDALOS513, on 12 May 2015 - 05:39 AM, said:

When they insulted the dev, was it against policy where banning was a possible outcome?

"Insulting" is basically the understatement of the century here. There was too much profanity, crossed several lines back and forth.

[GadoGado]

would you like to announce or list any cheaters to this forum, put it on "hall of shame" thread may be?

[DAEDALOS513]

S204STi, on 11 May 2015 - 07:26 PM, said:

Hey while we're at it, did you guys see that documentary on how the CIA set up that whole 9/11 thing?

Keep eating GMO corn approved by the USDA... it's GOOD for you.

Edited by DAEDALOS513, 12 May 2015 - 05:56 AM.

[ShinVector]

Lily from animove, on 12 May 2015 - 04:53 AM, said:

Aim assitants, in whatever way, macros, and wallhacks. Speed, ammo and healthhacks and whatever.

Not that I use macros... Please check your facts..
Unfortunately PGI has gone out of its way to state people can use macros.
Its in one of their posts...

[Nik Reaper]

Skarlock, on 12 May 2015 - 05:03 AM, said:

......

It's almost like you're some kind of alien who doesn't understand basic human behavior. It's unfathomable.

Then prey do tell how many bussiness can keep going with the level of service PGI had delivered for the first ~2 years ( let's say the last 1.5 yeas have been better ) , if they wern't cozying up to the hard fans of the franchise? If you look at EA games, Bioware and other serious bussiness , they are just the corporate face, and that is what everyone takes them for and that makes them totally accountable for every mistake they do, and since they are big those get pubicity and most of the time they need to apologise for them as they are expected to not make them, while here we have PGI where we expect that what ever they do, at first, will be incomplete and not entirely thought through, but we take it as it is the best they can do. That part of it makes them less of a serious bussiness , so it rubs me the wrong way they consider that without the same ability as the other companies they try to have the same corporate face... ( even though they have the legal right to it.. )

Edited by Nik Reaper, 12 May 2015 - 06:18 AM.

[Sergei Pavlov]

Well done, Thank you.