103 replies to this topic

[Lyoto Machida]

Sjorpha, on 13 May 2015 - 02:09 AM, said:

The first and foremost thing that is missing in CW is the actual simulation of war.

Owning planets need to give significant advantages, both in terms of resources of some kind and for the purpose of strategic progress. And for the unit as well as the faction.

And there needs to be a macro scale end game, a way to actually win the war, in which the aquiring of planets is a means of progression not limited to colouring the blips.

PGI seems afraid of the prospect that a faction could actually beat another, but that is the whole point of war. If taking over more and more planets does not convey an increasing advantage but instead, as now, actually punishes you for success, then there is no point. Resets or the galactic map should ultimately be driven by the extermination or otherwise determined victory of one side in the conflict.

A good start would be to reverse the system of reward adjusments to reward success rather than failure, the more planets you take the more your faction should pay you, because the will have more money to do so with. This could be balanced by dividing payouts by population, so that players of overpopulated factions gets paid less, which makes sense does it not? This way the number of planets owned by a faction determines indirectly the limits of that factions population.

Rewarding success should also go for individual success in terms of rank and loyalty. Simply pay a player more per match the higher rank he has within a faction, this way you encourage faction loyalty continuously as well as through specific rewards.

Last but not least the tools for organisation and strategic impact of units must be vastly increased and improved. Loyalist players (permanent contracts) might for example be able to elect leaders for their factions, who can then issue merc contracts to be taken by units. This right to vote for leadership or otherwise faction related issues could be the defining difference between loyalists and mercenaries.

Also allow units to do something with their money, why not upgrade defences on planets they control, or even buy mechs owned by the unit to be borrowed in dropdecks of unit members, with appropriate downsides as compared to owning private mechs for balance sake. Perhaps attach a maintenace cost for dropping in them, cut them out of the skill tree and so forth, but still a way to gear up your unit members for a given mission. Why not allow units to upgrade their dropships to be more lethal etc. Perhaps access to airstrike consumables in CW could be determined by if and how many aircraft bombers the unit has bought. Perhaps UAV, or why not all modules, is usable only if the unit has invested in the appropriate technology, and perhaps there is a maintenance cost to include that technology in a given drop. Bottom line is that units and their resources must be given real impact.

That's great and all but how is PGI going to be able to monetize all that and sell more mech packs?

Benjamin Davion, on 14 May 2015 - 06:34 PM, said:

Planets need to be worth something. Frankly it doesn't really matter to me what color the dots are anymore. Yeah, I find it amusing that Smoke Jaguar has been effectively destroyed. Beyond that? Whatever. I play CW to have good fights, make loads of cbills, and have fun. CW matches are simply more fun than pug matches. Make taking a planet actually matter for something, even if it's a one-time deposit. Say 1CR takes a planet. We should get a bulk deposit into our unit coffer of some very significant amount of Cbills as well as a cut to each of our members. Additionally, every time cycle that we hold that planet, the unit should earn cbills and each member of the unit earns cbills.

As for 'I don't make money in CW', I'm sorry, what? I make ridiculous amounts of money in CW. If I make less than 500,000 cbills in a CW match, it's been a very bad match. I typically make 750,000, 800,000 or more in an average CW match. If you aren't, either you're a pug pugging with other terrible pugs (in which case, join a unit for Christ's sake, CW is meant for units) or your performance is simply bad. Either you're not a very good pilot or you're running trash mechs in CW. Stop bringing Urbanmechs and other trash. Learn the state of the game and drive what works. Meta is not a curse word, it's simply how the game is played if you want to achieve anything.

Well, I guess that's great for you and the 99 other people that play CW. If you ever slum it in the pug queues again, you may notice lots of players with unit tags by their names. Maybe they haven't heard of CW yet or something.

Also, I'm not sure what you'd do with those deposits into the unit coffers...accumulate virtual interest on the c-bills?

[anonymous161]

Hmmmm nothing can fix it. This isn't really a gaming developer. Not for a real full game anyways just the beta part of it why it's done so well

[Apnu]

Darth Bane001, on 14 May 2015 - 03:52 PM, said:

No this is second time you pushed this idea not enough population to separate anything.

leave regular matching alone its fine.


cw is too boring get very little out of it boring maps that are all lifeless

This isn't the second time, I talk about this all the time.

Your points don't make sense. If there's little population, you want to keep things more seperate?

You seem to dislike CW, I don't blame you its been very frustrating for me also. Wouldn't you like your Public Queue matches (be they solo or group) to count towards your faction in some way? Wouldn't you also like to earn LP in those games? I would.

And that's my point. Make those public queue games mean something to the faction and the IS map. The more time players spend working on the map, the better this game will be.

Leaving CW as it is now, is a path to closing this game down.

[Lyoto Machida]

Apnu, on 14 May 2015 - 07:08 PM, said:

This isn't the second time, I talk about this all the time.

Your points don't make sense. If there's little population, you want to keep things more seperate?

You seem to dislike CW, I don't blame you its been very frustrating for me also. Wouldn't you like your Public Queue matches (be they solo or group) to count towards your faction in some way? Wouldn't you also like to earn LP in those games? I would.

And that's my point. Make those public queue games mean something to the faction and the IS map. The more time players spend working on the map, the better this game will be.

Leaving CW as it is now, is a path to closing this game down.

Is PGI a publicly traded company? If so, they may be shorting their own stock for personal gain.

[Benjamin Davion]

Lyoto Machida, on 14 May 2015 - 06:42 PM, said:

That's great and all but how is PGI going to be able to monetize all that and sell more mech packs?





Well, I guess that's great for you and the 99 other people that play CW. If you ever slum it in the pug queues again, you may notice lots of players with unit tags by their names. Maybe they haven't heard of CW yet or something.

Also, I'm not sure what you'd do with those deposits into the unit coffers...accumulate virtual interest on the c-bills?

If planets start to be worth something, the unit coffers can be worth something. Planet is worth Cbills, spend C-bills on its defense. Increase the number of zones on a planet by spending unit cbills on it. Spend unit c-bills to customize dropships, ie, dropship swoops in painted in unit colors. Or... dropship comes in faster. Spend cbills to aint your unit crest on the gates of the map so even when you're not the one defending, everyone knows this is your planet. Spend unit cbills on one-time bonuses like free strikes for a match, extra tonnage for a match, etc.. Anything to add to the depth of CW.

[Lyoto Machida]

Benjamin Davion, on 14 May 2015 - 07:17 PM, said:

If planets start to be worth something, the unit coffers can be worth something. Planet is worth Cbills, spend C-bills on its defense. Increase the number of zones on a planet by spending unit cbills on it. Spend unit c-bills to customize dropships, ie, dropship swoops in painted in unit colors. Or... dropship comes in faster. Spend cbills to aint your unit crest on the gates of the map so even when you're not the one defending, everyone knows this is your planet. Spend unit cbills on one-time bonuses like free strikes for a match, extra tonnage for a match, etc.. Anything to add to the depth of CW.

While I agree with you, this is all on PGI. At the moment, all that unit coffer money is worthless. I don't blame the players for not wanting to play CW...it's PGI's job to make it attractive for them to do so. All we have is a nice star map with worthless planets and no sense of any long term progression, immersion or accomplishment.

A Solaris mode (server costs aside) would have probably been a better (ie: more used) addition to the game than CW in its current state.

I really wish they would have started CW back in the 4th Succession Wars era and took their time to balance 3025 tech. Let the 5 Great Houses battle each other for awhile while they figured out how to bring in Clans, but alas...that ship has long since sailed.

[Benjamin Davion]

Lyoto Machida, on 14 May 2015 - 08:24 PM, said:

While I agree with you, this is all on PGI. At the moment, all that unit coffer money is worthless. I don't blame the players for not wanting to play CW...it's PGI's job to make it attractive for them to do so. All we have is a nice star map with worthless planets and no sense of any long term progression, immersion or accomplishment.

A Solaris mode (server costs aside) would have probably been a better (ie: more used) addition to the game than CW in its current state.

I really wish they would have started CW back in the 4th Succession Wars era and took their time to balance 3025 tech. Let the 5 Great Houses battle each other for awhile while they figured out how to bring in Clans, but alas...that ship has long since sailed.

Not to split hairs, but the one use of the coffer right now is breaking contracts.

[Will9761]

I can think of a few things:

More enticing rewards:
MC, Cockpit Items, and Mechbays are fine, but they should throw in some new items based on the progress of your faction. Maybe some mechs based on your affiliation, premium time, or free Camospecs.
Example:
Clan Jade Falcon Star Colonel 3 Rewards:
900 MC
Jade Falcon Clan Camo
Jade Falcon Colors
30 days Premium Time
Mad Dog MDD-B

More Game Modes:
The four game modes of Attack, Defend, Counterattack are fine, but they get pretty boring after a while. Perhaps game modes like a King of the Hill-styled S.O.S game mode to capture control points to contact your dropship for extraction, or a Capture the Flag-like game mode where you have to capture injured mechwarriors for subjugation(attackers) or rescue(defender). Even a Free-For-All Solaris mode or Clan Trial equivalent game mode would help break the monotony.

Use for Coffers:
The only thing we can pay for is dropping out of a contract, but it would be nice to pay for turrets, Naval Assets, or other protection to help you with defending your planet. The next time you run into a ghost drop, at least you can deal with armor crews, infantry, and/or aerospace fighters to give yourself a challenge.

Voice Actors and NPCs:
I have nothing against Betty, but I would like to see more voice actors for CW. In the field, it would be nice to hear a tactical officer warn you about an objective, commend your victory, berate your defeat, anything. Even if Duncan Fisher was here for a tutorial, I would like it. As for NPCs, I would love to see people, whether they are 3D-models or Live-Action actors. You get a different employer of your respective faction but as you progress further, you begin to take orders from notable personalities like Theodore Kurita or Ulric Kerensky. It would also be amusing to have some humor in CW even if you have to go along the lines of the Civ 2 advisers like having faction employers bickering among each other.

An Eye for an Eye:
Every faction has its feud: Davion vs Kurita, Marik vs Steiner, Wolf vs Jade Falcon, those sort of feuds. If you join that faction, you will have enemies. For example, if your are in a Davion Unit and you keep messing with Kurita worlds, then that faction will say, "This Davion unit abbreviated [FEDS] has meddled in our affairs for far too long! We will increase the [insert reward here] to any Kurita unit who can hunt them down." and place a "bounty" on your unit. The bounty could vary for example like a 10% Loyalty Boost, or a 20% C-bill boost just for killing member(s) of that Davion unit.

More Factions:
I have respect for the Houses and Clans, but their should be more factions. Clans Nova Cat, Steel Viper, Diamond Shark (and possibly Clan Goliath Scorpion) could give a new rise to the Clan factions. As for the Inner Sphere they could have there Periphery counterparts like the Taurian Concordat, Magistracy of Canopus, Outworlds Alliance, and the Marian Hegemony. As for the generic factions, the regular Merc Corps and Clan Loyalist should make a return for Community Warfare. For those who want to go toward a darker path they could have the option to become Pirates or part of the Clan Bandit Caste. In the future, the Clan Loyalist faction could be experimented for the Home Clans and their conflicts.

Edited by Will9761, 18 May 2015 - 08:37 AM.

[Benjamin Davion]

Will9761, on 15 May 2015 - 12:23 AM, said:

I can think of a few things:

More enticing rewards:
MC, Cockpit Items, and Mechbays are fine, but they should throw in some new items based on the progress of your faction. Maybe some mechs based on your affiliation, premium time, or free Camospecs.
Example:
Clan Jade Falcon Star Colonel 3 Rewards:
900 MC
Jade Falcon Clan Camo
Jade Falcon Colors
30 days Premium Time
Mad Dog MDD-B

More Game Modes:
The four game modes of Attack, Defend, Counterattack are fine, but they get pretty boring after a while. Perhaps game modes like a King of the Hill-styled S.O.S game mode to capture control points to contact your dropship for extraction, or a Capture the Flag-like game mode where you have to capture injured mechwarriors for subjugation(attackers) or rescue(defender). Even a Free-For-All Solaris mode or Clan Trial equivalent game mode would help break the monotony.

Use for Coffers:
The only thing we can pay for is dropping out of a contract, but it would be nice to pay for turrets, Naval Assets, or other protection to help you with defending your planet. The next time you run into a ghost drop, at least you can deal with armor crews, infantry, and/or aerospace fighters to give yourself a challenge.

Voice Actors and NPCs:
I have nothing against Betty, but I would like to see more voice actors for CW. In the field, it would be nice to hear a tactical officer warn you about an objective, commend your victory, berate your defeat, anything. Even if Duncan Fisher was here for a tutorial, I would like it. As for NPCs, I would love to see people, whether they are 3D-models or Live-Action actors. You get a different employer of your respective faction but as you progress further, you begin to take orders from notable personalities like Theodore Kurita or Ulric Kerensky. It would also be amusing to have some humor in CW even if you have to go along the lines of the Civ 2 advisers like having faction employers bickering among themselves.

Any Eye for an Eye:
Every faction has its feud: Davion vs Kurita, Marik vs Steiner, Wolf vs Jade Falcon, those sort of feuds. If you join that faction, you will have enemies. For example, if your are in a Davion Unit and you keep messing with Kurita worlds, then that faction will say, "This Davion unit abbreviated [FEDS] has meddled in our affairs for far too long! We will increase the [insert reward here] to any Kurita unit who can hunt them down." and place a "bounty" on your unit. The bounty could vary for example like a 10% Loyalty Boost, or a 20% C-bill boost just for killing member(s) of that Davion unit.

More Factions:
I have respect for the Houses and Clans, but their should be more factions. Clans Nova Cat, Steel Viper, Diamond Shark (and possibly Clan Goliath Scorpion) could give a new rise to the Clan factions. As for the Inner Sphere they could have there Periphery counterparts like the Taurian Concordat, Magistracy of Canopus, Outworlds Alliance, and the Marian Hegemony. As for the generic factions, the regular Merc Corps and Clan Loyalist should make a return for Community Warfare. For those who want to go toward darker path they could have the option to become Pirates or part of the Clan Bandit Caste. In the future, the Clan Loyalist faction could be experimented for the Home Clans and their conflict.

I agree with everything except the last part. I would LOVE to see that happen later down the road, but that will have to wait until AFTER the population rises. Increasing the number of factions would further dilute the existing pool of players, which would be counterproductive.

[Triordinant]

Lyoto Machida, on 14 May 2015 - 08:24 PM, said:

While I agree with you, this is all on PGI. At the moment, all that unit coffer money is worthless. I don't blame the players for not wanting to play CW...it's PGI's job to make it attractive for them to do so. All we have is a nice star map with worthless planets and no sense of any long term progression, immersion or accomplishment.

A Solaris mode (server costs aside) would have probably been a better (ie: more used) addition to the game than CW in its current state.

I really wish they would have started CW back in the 4th Succession Wars era and took their time to balance 3025 tech. Let the 5 Great Houses battle each other for awhile while they figured out how to bring in Clans, but alas...that ship has long since sailed.

So true. This is how it could have been.

[Apnu]

Lyoto Machida, on 14 May 2015 - 07:16 PM, said:

Is PGI a publicly traded company? If so, they may be shorting their own stock for personal gain.

[Lyoto Machida]

Apnu, on 15 May 2015 - 08:34 AM, said:

That was sarcasm.

Seriously though...anything is possible these days. The last three US presidents and the greatest Olympian of all time have used drugs in the past (or maybe still do).

That would have been unthinkable 50 years ago.

[Apnu]

Lyoto Machida, on 15 May 2015 - 09:21 AM, said:

That was sarcasm.

Seriously though...anything is possible these days. The last three US presidents and the greatest Olympian of all time have used drugs in the past (or maybe still do).

That would have been unthinkable 50 years ago.

Of course it was, hence the silly picture.

[Lyoto Machida]

Apnu, on 15 May 2015 - 11:36 AM, said:

Of course it was, hence the silly picture.

I guess my follow up point is that PGI needs more drug users on their payroll...maybe they'd shoot a little higher, instead of slanging this minimum viable product to their users.

[DebaucheryNShenanigans]

Apnu, on 12 May 2015 - 11:05 AM, said:

>>The seperation only drives players away from CW. Look at CW right now, its a ghost town.

>>As for newbie curb stomping, that solution is also very simple. All cadets play cadets. When you get your cadet bonus fully unlocked, you get to leave the kiddie pool for the adult pool.

>>PGI's decision to keep the PQ and CW games separated is dead wrong and its killing the game's population.

APNU, your attitude stinks.


>>1>> yup, I frigging hate CW as it stands. I only play when REQUESTED to.

>>2>> Its like you think we all grow up, aging = mandatory, but leaving the kiddie pool is an option.
I know some older /ping challenged and lazy player who couldn't give 1 shi7 about your meta demands or in-game orders.
its like your asking players to front up in CW and troll you with bad builds regardless..???

>>3>> NOPE, if PGI forces peeps to play CW it'll KILL the game dead flat, with nothing but META-losers playing.
HAPPENED before in rainbow Six..? all the brawlers got sick of being sniped, so they left, only snipers left, they got bored and left too. servers shutdown...!

MAKE adult decisions, FORCE smaller units, INCREASE reward for simply showing up into a CW match.
STOP STOMPING people into their deployment zone like emasculated bicep kissing neanderthals who need to E-flex to prove how utterly shameless you are, I bet if you did this IN RL.... you'd NOT, for fear of having 1. your face punched in, 2. having to beg for people show up next time, so you can eventually play.

no one loves a stomp.... no wonder people are not returning.

[DebaucheryNShenanigans]

Lord Scarlett Johan, on 13 May 2015 - 02:05 PM, said:

If I had my way, I'd have designed it like this:

• Each planet has 15 wedges.
  
• There are five drops.
  
• First drop of each five set is an attack on the giant gauss rifle (Attack/Defend).
  
• Second drop is an attack on a city/base/strategic location. Take and hold the bridges/mountain pass/enemy garrison (King of the Hill in short).
  
• Third drop is a series of OBJs that need to be held a la true Conquest, just like in the BF series. There is ticket system where each side is allotted X number of tickets and there are 3-6 strategic locations on the map such as bridges, LZs, mech hangars, docks, city crossroads, railyards, etc (stuff that's important in real world strategy). Owning the majority of strategic locations causes a steady drain on the enemies tickets. Death of an assault drops the ticket count by 4, a heavy by 3, a medium by 2, and a light by 1. You no longer are limited to just 4 lives. You can spawn from any LZ or hangar you own (attackers start with LZs and defenders with hangars) and you can pick from you 4, which means if your medium gets killed, you can drop in it again. (Yes, I shamelessly stole this from BF2)

I'd be thinking.. tickets yes, but it allows 15 on the map at any time per team, it grabs the NEXT lance from QUEUE and drops them together for your ABOVE game modes(KotH - Awesome) as a LANCE when the team drops to 11 remaining.... bumping that number up to 15.... on a rotating SYSTEM.... meaning wait times are LOW, and your rewarded more for medium and light use, than HVY / ASS..

means youll want to perform better to stay in the game LONGER, it breaks up MEGA-UNITS to 4man groups, allows mega-units to foster commraderie within a faction.

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

Fluero, on 16 May 2015 - 07:11 AM, said:

I'd be thinking.. tickets yes, but it allows 15 on the map at any time per team, it grabs the NEXT lance from QUEUE and drops them together for your ABOVE game modes(KotH - Awesome) as a LANCE when the team drops to 11 remaining.... bumping that number up to 15.... on a rotating SYSTEM.... meaning wait times are LOW, and your rewarded more for medium and light use, than HVY / ASS..

means youll want to perform better to stay in the game LONGER, it breaks up MEGA-UNITS to 4man groups, allows mega-units to foster commraderie within a faction.

Eh... I prefer to play with QQ, if I wanted to play with random Schmuckatellis I'd do LFG or solo. I don't like the idea of breaking up my group to throw someone else in their place.

[Mystere]

Bigbacon, on 12 May 2015 - 09:23 AM, said:

bad maps don't help.

There are really no such things as bad maps, only players unable to adjust their tactics to them.

[Chagatay]

Mystere, on 16 May 2015 - 08:43 AM, said:

There are really no such things as bad maps, only players unable to adjust their tactics to them.

Emerald Taiga.....

[Stealth Fox]

Mantle, on 12 May 2015 - 11:10 PM, said:

To fix CW you need PGI to stop trying to think they know how to make a game like this and sell it to someone that does. This game has always been broken and will always be broken until PGI has nothing to do with it.