757 replies to this topic

[Lunaya]

I know they make no promises but I feel like I should just get a refund on my Wave III before it even comes out, I am fine with Nerfs but I would rather see bad mechs gets better positive quirks, and the good mechs stay unquirked. And if a mech with quirks becomes to powerful just tone the quirks down a bit.

[crustydog]

I have a very bad feeling at the moment.

I won't know for sure until I get these mechs back on the battlefield what exactly the impact is going to be.

However, I get the feeling that my Clan drop deck, which took me MONTHS to build, has just been very badly nerfed.

I sincerely hope that my $100+ million C-Bill investment didn't just get chucked out the window.

I am not very happy at the moment - of that I am quite sure.

[Naduk]

Domenoth, on 16 May 2015 - 01:05 PM, said:

[/i]


Stakler 4N Missile cooldown is red but it looks like a buff from the previous value. Wrong color? Or did the 4N have a negative quirk before that just got negativer?

+ to a cool down is bad, you want - so its faster

i cannot wait to hear to cries of despair from the timbercrutch players
its going to be a good week

[Templar Dane]

Texas Merc, on 16 May 2015 - 09:40 PM, said:

Yes it does.

4x dragons. That's the lineup I'd use if I were inner sphere.

Now, seeing things from the clan perspective you have three good mechs. Crow, timberwolf, whale.

Whale is 100 tons. Because it's 100 tons and the clan lights are all trash, that mech is straight out. 240 tons to work with, you'd be insane to use anything but a combination of timberwolves and stormcrows.

[xe N on]

I play my SCR quite exclusively and I have to say the nerf was necessary. The SCR outperform all other 55 ton IS mediums by far.

IS mediums need to choose either high damage or high range. Using weapons with longer range they loose firepower because of the weight limit - e.g. the current meta of 3 large laser take up 15 ton.

The SCR is able to mount medium to long range laser weapons (e.g. 4xCERML + 2 CERLL) with sufficient cooling that does high damage (42-52 alpha depending on weapon set). It runs hot, yes, but that is no problem if you stay on range and cool down. It also is superior in team play where multiple player assist on one target. Because you have so much space and free tons the amount of heat sinks the SCR can mount is by a good amount higher then the average IS medium.

Beside lazor vomit builds that e.g. rely on C-SSRMs, C-SRMs or LRMs are not affected.

My current favorite SCR build is the "Grifcrow", usiing 4 CERML and 4 CSRM4+A which is quite superior to the Grifin-1N or 3M.

Edited by xe N on, 16 May 2015 - 10:06 PM.

[xe N on]

lordtzar, on 16 May 2015 - 09:56 PM, said:

4x dragons. That's the lineup I'd use if I were inner sphere.

Now, seeing things from the clan perspective you have three good mechs. Crow, timberwolf, whale.

Whale is 100 tons. Because it's 100 tons and the clan lights are all trash, that mech is straight out. 240 tons to work with, you'd be insane to use anything but a combination of timberwolves and stormcrows.

Dragons are a threat for people that cant aim for it's right arm. One alpha of a average clan mech and the arm is almost gone and with it all it's quirked AC5s.

For WVR-6R and DRG-1N I almost aim every time on the right arm. It's like you should always aim for the legs of a light and not for it's CT.

Edited by xe N on, 16 May 2015 - 10:08 PM.

[Templar Dane]

xe N on, on 16 May 2015 - 10:04 PM, said:

Dragons are a threat for people that cant aim for it's right arm. One alpha of a average clan mech and the arm is almost gone and with it all it's quirked AC5s.

For WVR-6R and DRG-1N I almost aim every time on the right arm. It's like you should always aim for the legs of a light and not for it's CT.

That arm isn't that easy to hit, what with the equivalent of 6 AC5 shells slamming into you in rapid succession.

[The Mechromancer]

lordtzar, on 16 May 2015 - 09:56 PM, said:

4x dragons. That's the lineup I'd use if I were inner sphere.

Now, seeing things from the clan perspective you have three good mechs. Crow, timberwolf, whale.

Whale is 100 tons. Because it's 100 tons and the clan lights are all trash, that mech is straight out. 240 tons to work with, you'd be insane to use anything but a combination of timberwolves and stormcrows.

something alot of nerf babies just dont seem to be able to accept.

LIGHT:
Kit Fox (slow)
Adder (slow)
Myst Lynx (bad)

MEDIUM:
Storm Crow (great!)
Ice Ferret (trash)
Nova (bad)

Heavy:
Timber Wolf (great!)
Hellbringer (great!)
Mad Dog (good!)
Summoner (trash)

Assault:
Direwolf (too big, heavy, slow)
Warhawk (oversized, undergunned, reliant on LRMs [LoL!])
Mr. Gargles (trash)

any sane pilot would stick in the heavy-medium range.. THAT is why you never see "anything but" storm crows and Timbers. Clans do not have the options or quirks to deck out under performing mechs (summoner) due to locked equipment.

[Telmasa]

Repasy, on 16 May 2015 - 07:37 PM, said:

... dude, SPL/SRM what? Why would you downgrade a GAR like that? I'm talking STOCK LOADOUT. You don't have to change a single thing on them.......

Gargoyle Prime stock SUCKs. The other stock loadouts are mediocre at best.


Anyway, I wish people would be less...negative.

This isn't the quirk changes we're looking for, clearly...as I said before, mixed reaction. Just no need to be spilled-milk-doom-and-gloomy

[xe N on]

lordtzar, on 16 May 2015 - 10:12 PM, said:

That arm isn't that easy to hit, what with the equivalent of 6 AC5 shells slamming into you in rapid succession.

The DRG or WVR can only shoot 1 mech a 1 time, however there are 11 remaining mechs that can act without any screen shake. If you are shot go cover by moving horizontal to it's position while twisting - that increase the difficulty to hit you and spread incoming damage. If you are not shot aim for it's right arm.

To make damage the DRG/WVR is necessary to hold line of sight and cannot twist therefore. If it doesn't move it is even more vulnerable.

If there is a puish you should aim anyways always tor the DPSer aka Jaegermech, Cataphract, Wolverine and Dragon. Those mech can do insame damage over time if you let them. Lazorbuilds will overheat quite fast.

[Peiper]

I have nothing nice to say about these nerfs.

Clan mechs are already hot enough.

Stormcrows and Timberwolves are taken partly because they have a nice hardpoint layout and pod space/tonnage availablity. Nerfing them doesn't make them other clan mechs more attractive, it makes ALL clan mechs less attractive. Clan mechs are already way too hot to brawl with IS, making their lasers shoot longer and increasing the CD doesn't balance out clan mechs. It's another one of those: these mechs are imbalanced, so to balance them out, we have to rebalance others to deal with the imbalances we made previously instead of dealing with the problem directly.

Sized hardpoints, I can't stress it enough. THAT is the solution to the meta/alpha strike build game. It's also makes so many more mechs viable. Back in the days when we had 8 or less mechs, having hardpoints of any size made sense, because we were testing everything out. It's out of BETA, we KNOW being able to boat many LARGE weapons hurts the game, but never once have they thought: oh, wait, maybe we should restrict hard points to weapons that actually FIT in the weapon mounts. Instead we have gauss rifles where machine guns are, Ultra 5's where Ultra 2's are (Dire Wolf dakka), Large lasers where mediums are (stalkers), PPC's where medium and small lasers are (all lights except the Panther, which SHOULD have a PPC), LRM20's where SRM2's should be, etc....

End the madness, PAUL. Give sized hardpoints a shot! think of all the mechs that would become interesting and useful with them. Some of the clan mechs people don't use would become attractive if others couldn't boat better, and some of the IS mechs would also be more used - like the Awesome, the only mech that should have more than 2 PPC's, etc...

[Telmasa]

xe N on, on 16 May 2015 - 09:59 PM, said:

My current favorite SCR build is the "Grifcrow", usiing 4 CERML and 4 CSRM4+A which is quite superior to the Grifin-1N or 3M.

You pay for that with massive heat though. It's not easy at all to manage that much of a heat spike, even with various multiple weapon groups and whatnot.

4 ML and 2SRM4A/SRM6A on a Griffin is far less heat and much easier to manage, plus the Griffin can customize its engine size to maximize the possible amount of heatsinks together with its loadout...and the Griffin can jump.

There's tradeoffs here, most people just don't acknowledge it...alpha power isn't everything.

xe N on, on 16 May 2015 - 10:24 PM, said:

To make damage the DRG/WVR is necessary to hold line of sight and cannot twist therefore. If it doesn't move it is even more vulnerable.

So just don't stand still. It's not hard to keep moving side to side, or to charge a flank, or (what most people do) simply charge at the enemy across uneven terrain & at a slight angle, relying on your ridiculously quirked DPS to overwhelm them before they can really do anything to you.

Edited by Telmasa, 16 May 2015 - 10:31 PM.

[Jess Hazen]

[xe N on]

Telmasa, on 16 May 2015 - 10:30 PM, said:

You pay for that with massive heat though. It's not easy at all to manage that much of a heat spike, even with various multiple weapon groups and whatnot.

No problem in heat management if you not alpha all the time. For range and initial alpha I use the 4 ERMLL. As standalone they are quite heat manageable and do damage like 3 IS-LL.

In close combat I focus on using SRMs.

In contrast to a GRF that is dammed to do nothing as long there is long range engagement, the SCR can do quite well with it's 400+ m and 28 damage lasers.

Find it more balanced than the close range limited GRFs. It' like an unquirked m ix of Wolverine and Griffin ... the "Grifferine"

Edited by xe N on, 16 May 2015 - 10:47 PM.

[BattleGnome]

Honestly, the laser nerfs for the God tier clan mechs wouldn't have bothered me as much if they didn't throw around the added laser duration quirk so much on all the pods. Perhaps if they were 1:2 ratio with the cooldown nerfs instead of the current 1:1 ratio that could make things okay.

If you want to stop laser spam so much, buff clanner ACs like Russ mentioned in the last Townhall (quicker burst RoF or one less bullet per burst, etc.). People work with incentives better than penalties which is one of the reasons why players here tend to react poorly to these kind of changes. Because right now in terms of meta, laser vomit is all the clans have which isn't really that fun for either side.

Otherwise, the clan nerfs strike me as kind of lazy.

Edited by BattleGnome, 16 May 2015 - 10:44 PM.

[Blunt_Object]

On Clans..
I'll have to agree with what has been said here a lot. The need to quirk the clan mechs was there yes. The size and brutality of the quick is what has upset people.
PGI and Russ I think said in the last town hall they would make small incremental changes to mechs and the quirks so they do over do it with either a positive or a negative quick. Sadly today is an over shoot. i would have thought a 3-7% penalty on heat might be enough the duration for someone like myself that plays from Australia (the long lost and ignored player base) I have a ping of 240 which means when i peek you've already seen and fired at me.. if I have to then hold a clan weapon on target even longer i'm dead.. as it is i die to quick due to ping and hit reg. Small changes not large leaps is what you said this is like jumping of a building.
On IS.
The size of the changes to the IS mechs is what you should have done to the Clan mechs. personally I think the Firestarters need a 5% drop same as the Stalkers. As for thunderbolts.. HAHAHA talk about OP. I have a similar build on a hell bringer oddly enough it's useless because if the duration, heat, and cool down. that also needs a 5% change.
small steps not big ones. I'm hoping that there is a review on these in light or the comments on here or quickly after.

[MechaBattler]

If anything the cooldown nerfs will just make it easier on Clan pilots without trigger discipline. The real nerf is the duration. But you still have good mobility, tonnage, overall damage, and range.

[Sable]

KursedVixen, on 16 May 2015 - 09:07 PM, said:

I think the timberwolf is the only clan mech that needs no quirks.

I agree with this guy, if every other mech got quirks and the timbewolf didn't it would have been balanced. But adding in negative quirks is just bad. PGI should really reconsider heat quirks for clan mechs. They already run hot making them hotter doesn't improve gameplay it makes everyone go back to gauss spam.

[Jess Hazen]

BattleGnome, on 16 May 2015 - 10:43 PM, said:

Honestly, the laser nerfs for the God tier clan mechs wouldn't have bothered me as much if they didn't throw around the added laser duration quirk so much on all the pods. Perhaps if they were 1:2 ratio with the cooldown nerfs instead of the current 1:1 ratio that could make things okay.

If you want to stop laser spam so much, buff clanner ACs like Russ mentioned in the last Townhall (quicker burst RoF or one less bullet per burst, etc.). People work with incentives better than penalties which is one of the reasons why players here tend to react poorly to these kind of changes. Because right now in terms of meta, laser vomit is all the clans have which isn't really that fun for either side.

Otherwise, the clan nerfs strike me as kind of lazy.

Don't buff clan ac's overhaul them. Clans never had rotary ac's in cannon ffs.

[KursedVixen]

Jess Hazen, on 16 May 2015 - 11:03 PM, said:

Don't buff clan ac's overhaul them. Clans never had rotary ac's in cannon ffs.

umm actually they do.
http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Rotary_AC/2


*points to clan diamond sharks*

Edit:wrong link D'oh!


Also a good mech does not a good pilot make.

Edited by KursedVixen, 16 May 2015 - 11:16 PM.