244 replies to this topic

[Anakha]

As many have said the biggest problem is lack of hard points and mostly lack of tonnage. Just letting us upgrade to Endo Steel would solve most of its problems. If they aren't going to add hard points they need let us upgrade to Endo and then add some internal structure or armor to the arms so that you don't loose half your weapons so easily. It needs the armor/structure treatment across the torsos/arms that many of the IS mechs have received definitely. It could also use some more energy heat dissipation it only has 4% right now which is basically nothing. I can live with the fixed JJ's if they did that. Definitely needs further quirks and Endo to be competitive though.

[Mcgral18]

Swapping Ferro to Endo (I mean...this has to be done at some point, right?) would gain 1 ton.

1 ton of ammo is always nice.

[jaxjace]

Poptarting and urban combat also its fast and jumpy,

[Ursh]

In a CW match today on Emerald Taiga, I think I might have angered a couple of Large Laser stalkers camping the gate, because I kept on jump sniping them with my gauss rifle. Charge it on the way up, release jets just as you clear the building, and let off that high mounted gauss as you're coming back down. It was fun to watch the light show above me each time as 6-9 large lasers passed over my head.

I wish it had a couple of torso energy hard points, and endo, as I think that's a fair trade for not having very good jump jets.

My current loadouts:
Gauss +4xCERML meta-ish I suppose, but it's one of the more effective loadouts with the high mounted ballistic
LB10X + 4xCERML jump-brawler. Can also swap out the lasers for SRMs if you really want to pack a short range punch
LB20X + CLpulse Suppress people and score assists with the large pulse at range. Hammer people with the LB20X when the range draws closer.

Note that none of those loadouts can't be done by a hellbringer or almost any other 55+ ton clan mech. I like the Summoner, but I'd love to have some more hard point options.

[Ultimax]

WM Quicksilver, on 22 May 2015 - 11:34 PM, said:

It is the best 70 ton mech in the game, it just needs a little love in the hardpoint department (cmon SMN-M and future variants) or the ability to run Endo on top of Ferro and it could easily be a better mech. The low weapon mounts wouldn't be as big of a deal if the cockpit wasn't so high up creating weird convergence issues for some loadouts.

Be careful what you wish for.

[Ryokens leap]

Make use of the quirked arms with erppc, lb10x and cool down modules. The rate of fire is pretty ridiculous. Jump jets are locked in tonnage so make use of them as well, see lots of players not utilizing them in game.

[Mister Blastman]

I love the Suckoner™ but PGI, alas, doesn't. *sigh*

[DasaDevil]

The Summoner is a pretty awesome tank. Just takes a lot of thought on how you actually use it. It's one of my favorite mechs, however.

[Koniks]

SRM hardpoints are so widely spread and Clan SRMs spread more than IS even with Artemis and the spread quirks that other mechs are better at the one thing it should do well. There's no reason to run it as a Streak boat.

Gauss+ERPPC poptart is the one unique niche it can fill. But that playstyle is also completely outclassed by everything else right now.

[Bishop Steiner]

Alistair Winter, on 22 May 2015 - 11:21 PM, said:

It's number 1 weapon is the power of nostalgia. It was such an iconic mech in earlier games.

I also like it a lot simply because it's a challenge. Which means I use it for pugging, and I leave it at home when it's time to get serious.

Frankly, I think they should just give it some extra hardpoints. The idea of not adding hardpoints for Clan mechs is a nice rule of thumb, but the idea should be abandoned for mechs that clearly suffer tremendusly from this rule. After all, BT was not made for MWO. I like the locked upgrades making Omnimechs more unique and different, but I don't feel like an extra hardpoint on some of the Summoner's omnipods would ruin my day. Not when PGI adds 0-5 hardpoints on every IS mech component.

If it had endo, the 3.5 tons locked JJs wouldn't matter. Extra hardpoints would be nice, especially a second missile slot in the LT. But the stock armament on the Prime, for example can do surprising amounts of damage...if it had the ammo and armor to use it well.

[Tahribator]

To be honest, it's a great 'Mech if you ignore the lack of free tonnage. Great hitboxes and a general tankiness, very mobile and great air-time with the JJs.

The problem is its low free tonnage limits it to energy-heavy builds and the Summoner lacks good enough hardpoints to take advantage. Even those available are bad because they're exclusively arm-mounted and the arms are the first things that fall off from a SMN. You have to utilize the torso ballistic hardpoint if you want a fall-back weapon and that costs lots of tonnage.

I can see a few desirable solutions to this:

• Unlock JJs. That'd give it 26 tons to work with. So many dual-ballistic possibilities.
  
• Give it nipple energy hardpoints. It can suddenly do the magical 2xLPL(very high mounted)+4xERML(arms) combo.

I don't think they'll throw in an Endo as PGI seems to be reluctant to do loadout changes against BT.

[Averen]

Tahribator, on 23 May 2015 - 07:16 AM, said:

I can see a few desirable solutions to this:

• Unlock JJs. That'd give it 26 tons to work with. So many dual-ballistic possibilities.
  
• Give it nipple energy hardpoints. It can suddenly do the magical 2xLPL(very high mounted)+4xERML(arms) combo.

I don't think they'll throw in an Endo as PGI seems to be reluctant to do loadout changes against BT.

You know that that basically would result in a laserpuke TBR with better hitboxes?

[Bishop Steiner]

Averen, on 23 May 2015 - 07:19 AM, said:

You know that that basically would result in a laserpuke TBR with better hitboxes?

and get it slapped with the TBR laservomit nerfs in short order, probably.

[Koniks]

Worry about that if they nerf the HBR and NVA.

[Averen]

Bishop Steiner, on 23 May 2015 - 07:21 AM, said:

and get it slapped with the TBR laservomit nerfs in short order, probably.

Indeed, and, honestly, it absolutely should if we get to that point.
Somehow feels like every single issue with clan balancing comes back to lasers. Playing clans atm in CW too, and every single build has to somehow rely on lasers to a degree. It's either SRM+laser (which i do like tho) or UAC+laser, or different versions of laserboating.

The tbr/scrow-nerf don't seem to severe, honestly. Most builds still work very well, and I found out that a 6MPL scrow is a beast.

Edited by Averen, 23 May 2015 - 07:30 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Averen, on 23 May 2015 - 07:28 AM, said:

Indeed, and, honestly, it absolutely should if we get to that point.
Somehow feels like every single issue with clan balancing comes back to lasers. Playing clans atm in CW too, and every single build has to somehow rely on lasers to a degree. It's either SRM+laser (which i do like tho) or UAC+laser, or different versions of laserboating.

The tbr/scrow-nerf don't seem to severe, honestly. Most builds still work very well, and I found out that a 6MPL scrow is a beast.

well, that and the mnmax crowd wanting every chassis to become generic carbon copy meta-sticks--

Why can't we focus on making the Summoner better at what it's supposed to be, and leave the SCR and TBR and HBR for the Meta-Fanatics?

[VorpalAnvil]

Mizeur, on 23 May 2015 - 07:26 AM, said:

Worry about that if they nerf the HBR and NVA.

When, not if.

[Deathlike]

Don't get me wrong... I'm using the Summoner-Prime in the event since the Timberwolf-Prime doesn't fit my needs.

The biggest problem it has had in the game is being underwhelming when it comes to tonnage availability due to not using Endo Steel. 3.5 tons is nothing to scoff at.

Also, it becomes a difficult proposition to go full energy or full missiles, but you can't even do both effectively (missiles+energy are shared on the same arm)... and what you have left are ineffective Clan ballistics.

So... it is what it is.

[Averen]

Yep, I think it's viable to unlock jets without breaking the summoner, just because it has comparably few laser hardpoints. Might actually become a really great - and pleasantly different - heavy in that case.

[Summon3r]

they are still iterating the Summoner be calm people ... lol?

shame the iterations to the SMN werent as extreme as the recent iterations to the TBR and SCR........ and the pgi joke mobile carries on.