161 replies to this topic

[Yokaiko]

Though triple range went away back when Dragon Slayers were still a thing.

Oh except guass, lol

Edited by Yokaiko, 27 May 2015 - 11:37 AM.

[JC Daxion]

Drake Morgan, on 26 May 2015 - 07:29 PM, said:

I fail to understand why people are upset that their LIGHT mechs are being taken out by TWO Gauss....

I'm not sure if this was directed to me or not, I say that because it was right after my I got killed in a light post..

I was not upset at all, and said it was my own fault.. But i did talk about the high amount of pin-point damage, and how it could be lessened a bit, and to me make the game a lot more fun. If i wan't to play a shooter with one shot kills, I'll go play counter strike. If i wan't a game with lots of weapon systems, planing and strategy, i'll play mech warrior.

Reducing pin-point is hardly a gauss only problem. But i was pointing out, a light can be killed by them, outside of being head shot, which until my post, was the only way people said you could die, which is flat out wrong.

[bad arcade kitty]

'i was killed by dual gauss, time to adjust dual gauss' thread

[Kutfroat]

edit opening post

[Khobai]

Quote

'i was killed by dual gauss, time to adjust dual gauss' thread

Its more the fact that gauss charge up didnt achieve what it was supposed to. People just macro around it. Gauss chargeup should be removed and Gauss should be nerfed in a way that actually fixes what makes it overpowered.

Gauss chargeup was just another easily circumvented and failed attempt at weapon balance like ghost heat...

Edited by Khobai, 30 May 2015 - 11:37 AM.

[Jaeger Gonzo]

min range for gauss

[Hornviech]

Burktross, on 26 May 2015 - 01:31 PM, said:

Meanwhile, on tabletop.

"Okay, I'm shooting your locust with my Atlas's AC/20."
"Alright, with the modifier that comes out to about 8 to hit."
**Rolls 10**
"Nice, rolling for hit location."
**Rolls 2**
"Critical CT"
"Damn."
"Well, you're dead anyway. Not like it matters."

----------------------
Next Round
---------------------
"Alright, I'm kicking you from hexlevel 1"
"To hit of 6."
"k"
**Rolls 7**
"Alright, lets see: punch table."
**Rolls 12**
"I ******* hate you man."

some years ago on BT TT

first round
Moved custom made scylla into position
enemy in range (21 fields away)
announced attack with Gauss on long range, max range 22
"you went 3 fields +1"
"I walked +1"
"range long +4"
"Gunnery skill 1 so I must have 7 to hit"
"Oh I have Weapon specialist for Gauss on this pilot -2"
"so then on 5"
"first gauss (roll) 8 HIT !!"
"Where ?"
"12 headshot! (laughter)"

few minutes later the third enemy Player arrived and sees the downed mech on the map.
"Oh did he fell?" (smiles)
The other two guys
"NO HE'S DEAD!" (not ammused)


that was quite fun
To explain the weapon specialist.
Ther are rules that say that in certain situations you can give your pilot specialities like weapon specialist, movement ace, or edge (nice ability that you can use only once in a game).
So many years ago we said that after 3 kills a Pilot can lvl up Pilot skill, gunnery skill or speciality.
And the Pilot in the Scylla had many kills in the past and he's my best one and wasn't killed yet.
He has also edge abillity so when he gets a headshot the other team would not be amused when I call "edge! yo can reroll that!"

[LordNothing]

i do not consider gauss op. if you get gaussed you find out from where, seek cover, and figure out how to kill it. 30 point alpha with little or no backup weapons is not that powerful. thats as powerful as a 6 pack of medium lasers. sure if you can aim, you can kill in a shot or two, but thats true with any other pinpoint weapon config.

Edited by LordNothing, 30 May 2015 - 08:04 PM.

[Wildstreak]

Burktross, on 26 May 2015 - 01:31 PM, said:

Meanwhile, on tabletop.

"Okay, I'm shooting your locust with my Atlas's AC/20."
"Alright, with the modifier that comes out to about 8 to hit."
**Rolls 10**
"Nice, rolling for hit location."
**Rolls 2**
"Critical CT"
"Damn."
"Well, you're dead anyway. Not like it matters."

----------------------
Next Round
---------------------
"Alright, I'm kicking you from hexlevel 1"
"To hit of 6."
"k"
**Rolls 7**
"Alright, lets see: punch table."
**Rolls 12**
"I ******* hate you man."

You forgot the part where the Locust moved 8+ hexes and charged right into the Atlas, lived and walked away.
OK, it was an Archer not an Atlas when I did it. Still fun though.

[Bleary]

Gauss does not offer good DPS for the weight. It does not have good reaction time against flanking or fast circling 'Mechs. It makes any location you mount them in significantly more fragile. What it does offer is a high FLD long range poking weapon. Those all seem to be more less "working as intended", given its envisaged role as a dedicated sniper gun.

One can argue this makes them unbalanced on big CW maps, though lasers still seem to be the dominant meta choice for both IS and Clans.

I have a hard time seeing how this makes them unbalanced in the public queue, given the gun's many disadvantages when the match progresses past the poking stage.

Edited by Bleary, 30 May 2015 - 10:17 PM.

[Mudhutwarrior]

I suggest before you get down on dual gauss boats you play one yourself. Being effective in one is no easy task. Most don't get very far as it has to be played very well in positioning to survive. The only thing that makes them a threat is the weak minded that have to use macros and even then if your so lazy to need macros you probably never will spend the time to learn to play them well.

Just make Macros ban worthy instead and leave the nerf hammer home.

[Kristov Kerensky]

Khobai, on 30 May 2015 - 11:37 AM, said:

Its more the fact that gauss charge up didnt achieve what it was supposed to. People just macro around it. Gauss chargeup should be removed and Gauss should be nerfed in a way that actually fixes what makes it overpowered.

Gauss chargeup was just another easily circumvented and failed attempt at weapon balance like ghost heat...

Ok, another tryhard telling us about the gauss macro that makes them magically delicious!

You DO know that the gauss macro simply fires the gauss the moment it hits charge, right? It doesn't shorten that charge up time at all, and it usually causes people using it to MISS a lot of shots. It's a silly and pointless macro that only dumbasses use in other words. Which makes the people who whine about them...well...

Charge up was ONE of the tools used to desync the gauss/ppc combos. A pointless effort to be sure, which is why they slowed ppcs down so much as well.

Now, those of us who use gauss have learned to appreciate the charge up as it lets us save ammo by not taking bad shots. We have to find our target, aim, charge up, KEEP the aim and let fire. If the target moves, we can avoid taking the shot. Using a macro, you don't have that option. My ratio with gauss has gone up since the charge up was added, bet most of the others who use gauss have had the same experience.

[LordNothing]

Mudhutwarrior, on 30 May 2015 - 11:18 PM, said:

I suggest before you get down on dual gauss boats you play one yourself. Being effective in one is no easy task. Most don't get very far as it has to be played very well in positioning to survive. The only thing that makes them a threat is the weak minded that have to use macros and even then if your so lazy to need macros you probably never will spend the time to learn to play them well.

Just make Macros ban worthy instead and leave the nerf hammer home.

if the nerf mechanic is so weak that it can be defeated with a macro then maybe it was a bad idea. frankly the fact you can only fire 2 at a time is nerf enough.

Edited by LordNothing, 31 May 2015 - 12:16 AM.

[Sjorpha]

LordNothing, on 31 May 2015 - 12:16 AM, said:

if the nerf mechanic is so weak that it can be defeated with a macro then maybe it was a bad idea. frankly the fact you can only fire 2 at a time is nerf enough.

Using a macro for gauss does not significantly reduce the drawback, you still have the charge. And the downside of using a macro is that you can no longer choose when to release your shot within the fire window. So all the macro does is allow you to fire the gauss a few milliseconds faster, at the cost of not being able to control your fire as well.

I've tried it, and in my experience macro for gauss isn't worth using. I do much better controlling the charge myself, especially when combined with PPCs because you want to fire the PPCs a fraction before the gauss to sync up the velocities to hit all at once, and since that timing changes with range it can't be controlled through a macro.

TL:DR: Gauss macros do not "defeat" the charge at all, and have significant drawbacks. balance wise they are a non-issue and less effective that learning to control your weapons.

Using a macro to max out the fire rate of Grid Iron is an exception, that can actually be useful sometimes.

[LordNothing]

depends on the macro.

if you have the macro push a button and simultaneously start a timer, then count off the time it takes the gun to go through its charge/ready/discharge cycle, release the button for a frame or two and repeat. then you have another button that will release that first one during the ready part of the cycle. this only lets you fire instantly about half the time. if you fire you then you need to wait one cd period to resume cycling.

if you do a second gun on another timer so that their ready phases alternate, you can then have it so you can always fire a gauss rifle instantly. do it on a four gauss dire whale and you got a murder machine thats worthy of a ban. obviously you need really powerful macro software, you could even do it in hardware if you want. i dont say these things because i do it or i want anyone else to do it, i just want to give pgi the heads up of what is possible just by messing with input so that they take appropriate action.

before you start writing macro scripts i should point out that this kind of thing would be easy to spot. all pgi has to do is audit the weapon fire commands of anyone they suspect of gauss hacking, if it is found that the gauss is cycling for an entire game (the sound of that would drive me bonkers), or even with a rythmic pattern then you are probibly a nail for the ban hammer. though pgi has stated they dont ban for using macros, i have a feeling they would change that policy if people started doing this.

[Chuck Jager]

The macros I have heard about being effective are the 3-4 gauss versions.

My experience as both a light and assault pilot is that they both have a good chance to either die or smash the other if they made a good or bad choice.

Many of my gauss kills on lights happens when they run into a wall and have to turn around. Also against good fast lights, I can only register a slight flicker of damage with lasers in some situations. Both lights and assaults have to be careful about dropping the soap in the enemy's shower.

Now, I will say that I do use gauss in many builds strictly for the low low heat, and this fact is kinda disturbing. This feature sometimes will make a build more useable in a brawl than an ac20 (longer continuous alpha before chainfire) while also dealing out reliable damage before I get there.

[jaxjace]

Direwolf is litterally the only one I can think of with the least downsides, and that comes at the cost of either having ALL the backup weapons and a heat that would make a nova cringe or scimp like a ***** on the backup weapons. or mount tripple or quad guass. at that point your mech is literally made of glass.

Chuck YeaGurr, on 31 May 2015 - 02:17 AM, said:

The macros I have heard about being effective are the 3-4 gauss versions.

My experience as both a light and assault pilot is that they both have a good chance to either die or smash the other if they made a good or bad choice.

Many of my gauss kills on lights happens when they run into a wall and have to turn around. Also against good fast lights, I can only register a slight flicker of damage with lasers in some situations. Both lights and assaults have to be careful about dropping the soap in the enemy's shower.

Now, I will say that I do use gauss in many builds strictly for the low low heat, and this fact is kinda disturbing. This feature sometimes will make a build more useable in a brawl than an ac20 (longer continuous alpha before chainfire) while also dealing out reliable damage before I get there.

agreed the grid iron can tank any timber simply because of its INSANE dps

[LordNothing]

Chuck YeaGurr, on 31 May 2015 - 02:17 AM, said:

The macros I have heard about being effective are the 3-4 gauss versions.

My experience as both a light and assault pilot is that they both have a good chance to either die or smash the other if they made a good or bad choice.

Many of my gauss kills on lights happens when they run into a wall and have to turn around. Also against good fast lights, I can only register a slight flicker of damage with lasers in some situations. Both lights and assaults have to be careful about dropping the soap in the enemy's shower.

Now, I will say that I do use gauss in many builds strictly for the low low heat, and this fact is kinda disturbing. This feature sometimes will make a build more useable in a brawl than an ac20 (longer continuous alpha before chainfire) while also dealing out reliable damage before I get there.

i think gauss is better used as a backup rather than primary weapon. its a great backup to multiple ppcs or lasers. as you can use those until your sinks saturate, and then fall back to the gauss when you are redlining, continuing to deliver respectable damage. my catapult k2 is set up for this.

[Imperius]

I must have headshot this fool out in the open and now he cries nerf bat! Here is an idea how about we take all the weapons out of the game and we can just play nascar or have hugathons, sound good?

[Joseph Mallan]

LordNothing, on 31 May 2015 - 02:38 AM, said:

i think gauss is better used as a backup rather than primary weapon. its a great backup to multiple ppcs or lasers. as you can use those until your sinks saturate, and then fall back to the gauss when you are redlining, continuing to deliver respectable damage. my catapult k2 is set up for this.

This is a sad thought.

A cool running hard hitting weapon with range... used as back up. It hurts me right here.