17 replies to this topic

[Snardo]

So, I'm fairly new to this game, but am loving it!

After finishing the cadet missions, I bought a first mech - a HBK-4J and made a few slight mods to it. LRM-10, LRM-5, 5 MLs and a slightly uprated engine.

I feel like I'm starting to get the hang of things and am starting to improve a bit but I think I have some ideas for my mech that would further improve performance.

At the same time, it might be fun to experiment with something different as well. The problem is that I'm not earning very much money right now, so I can either make significant mods to what I have (to the tune of 2+M c-bills, about half my current balance) or continue saving for another mech. If I mod the current one, it will set me back quite a way from getting that second mech, so I'm conflicted. New stuff is always fun.

Any suggestions?

[Anunknownlurker]

This is a tricky one to answer and, in my opinion a big negative in the game; in order to fully master (i.e. get the mech into its best possible state) you need to have 3 of the same chassis e.g. in your case an HBK-4L a -4H and a 4P. Once you have used experience to learn the basic skills on each mech you unlock elite skills - this makes a HUGE difference to how the mech plays and is a big "have to" but it comes at a massive cost in terms of having to buy 3 chassis (NOT the same model, be careful with that one!) and using 3 mech bays.

So, to get the best out of you HBK you will need to spend your C-bills on another 2 of them...(the one good thing with the HBK, probably more so than any other IS chassis is that all of them play differently and give you a great chance to learn the basics of different weapon types, so each one you buy is a "new and shiny" toy to play with.

However, having said all that, if you are having fun and doing well in a basic chassis, then buy something different (a Raven 3L maybe or a Firestarter?) to give you a different perspective. Be aware however that all IS mechs will cost about double their purchase price to upgrade to a competitive level.

Hope that helps and good luck!

[AdamBaines]

Well you can go a couple of Routes:

1) Get A Huch 4S or/and 4SP And elite out the Hunchbacks. Elited Hunbacks are a good solid platform.

2) Go up or down in a weight class , but dont jump to Assaults. I feel its better to get comfortable with Heavies before moving to Assaults.

3) If you go lights, A lot of people have fun with the Ravens, Firestarters or Spiders, but Id recommend a Jenner. Again its very balanced and does everything well. Only issues there is no ballistics (if you like ballistics). Id stay away from Clan lights for now.

4) If you Stay medium, The next logical step is for the Clans a StormCrow or for the IS a Shadow Hawk. The "Doom" crow is currently one of the perceived kings of the battlefield. Cant go wrong.

5) Heavy you should go with the Thunderbolt for the IS or the MadCat for Clans. Yes the MC was "nerfed" but its still badass. I have a strong love for Dragons......but thats a tough road to hoe.

6) If you REEEEALY want to go the Assault route, Stalkers and their Lazer vomit are very effective. On the Clan side Dire Wolfs are effective. Stay away from Atli and Awesomeness as those requite more refined skill to really make effective.

As for build check out the Builds section and you will find great ones you can copy or use as a jump off point for your own design.

[mailin]

You mentioned that you were thinking about making significant mods to the Hunchy you currently own. Because we don't know what sort of mods you're thinking about, I just want to make sure that the first thing you do on your hunchy, and the vast majority of mechs for that matter, is get double heat sinks. This will eat up 1.5 mill if you haven't already done so.

This part of the grind that players grumble about. Either way you will eventually want to buy two more hunchback variants, so before buying any other mechs I'd get those first.

[Rogue Jedi]

ultimately you will get the best out of a Hunchback by upgrading it and eliting the line, if you have Basic skills nearly complete on the 4J I would advise getting another HBK, if you are less than half way through Basics then upgrading should be a big help in completing basics faster.
for a HBK I would usualy upgrade with Endo Steel and Double Heat Sinks, then put in a 250 standard engine, and upgrade any Small Lasers to Medium or Med Pulse Lasers, then use any spare weight for ether ammo or heatsinks whatever looks more useful to you, if after doing that you have more than 15 spare slots consider adding Fero Fibrus armor for an extra ton of free weight

If money is an issue I would advise against Lights, they look cheep but are really expensive to upgrade, basic rule of thumb to make a light combat effective will general cost a total of about 4 times its initial purchase cost.

I advise designing your Mech here:
http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/mechlab
before you purchase anything so you know the rough cost, and when designing a loadout consider the quirks which you can find here:
http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/
look under the Mech Quirks menu,

some Mechs (like the Hunchbacks) have great weapon focused quirks which makes it highly advantageous to take the quirked weapons (which in the HBKs case are the stock main weapon),

all quirks are additive so if e.g. you have a quirk for ballistic weapons and another for AC20 and you take an AC20 it gets both bonuses whereas e.g. an AC5 or Gauss Rifle would just get the ballistic bonuses,

if a quirk name (or module name) mentions a specific weapon it only applies to the specific named weapon so e.g. Medium Pulse Laser quirks (or Modules) will not apply to Clan Medium Pulse Lasers, regular Medium Lasers or ER Medium Lasers.

edit: I need to be more careful with spellcheck

Edited by Rogue Jedi, 06 June 2015 - 12:25 PM.

[dragnier1]

One thing about the hunchback (if others haven't mentioned it yet) is that the main weapon(s) are usually found on the hunch. As you play through the hunchbacks you'll gradually get a feel of how important protecting the hunch is. Other players know that as well.

The hunch is housed on the right side of the hunchback for the 4G, H and P variants. Should you use these variants practice using all other parts of the mech to protect that hunch (torso-twist to do that).

[Levi Porphyrogenitus]

1 - If you don't have Double Heat Sinks installed, spend the c-bills on it.

2 - Consider if your build is suitable for Endo Steel.

HBK-4J might be a decent goal for your 4J's end state.

3 - In order to Elite your Hunchbacks, you'll need 3 different variants. Note, that is different, unique, variants. No 4P and 4P(c), as they're the same variant.

4 - I suggest the 4G, 4P, and 4SP, but since you already have a 4J you can skip the 4SP.

As for spending priority, I find that I get better earnings when I run a mech that's tailored exactly how I like it. You'll probably end up earning enough to get your other two variants faster by means of tricking out the one you already own than you will by sticking with a partially built ride.

[jaxjace]

Mod your mechs to the core. As a general rule though not 100% always endo and max XL engine. obviously always DHS

dont have 3? get 3.

[Ace Selin]

Levi Porphyrogenitus, on 05 June 2015 - 07:21 PM, said:

1 - If you don't have Double Heat Sinks installed, spend the c-bills on it.

2 - Consider if your build is suitable for Endo Steel.

HBK-4J might be a decent goal for your 4J's end state.

3 - In order to Elite your Hunchbacks, you'll need 3 different variants. Note, that is different, unique, variants. No 4P and 4P(c), as they're the same variant.

4 - I suggest the 4G, 4P, and 4SP, but since you already have a 4J you can skip the 4SP.

As for spending priority, I find that I get better earnings when I run a mech that's tailored exactly how I like it. You'll probably end up earning enough to get your other two variants faster by means of tricking out the one you already own than you will by sticking with a partially built ride.

I use the Hunch 4J for LRMing also and the build mentioned is quite good, but i would add TAG to the head slot instead of a laser. TAG breaks ECM on one selected mech and allows quicker lock times, all helpful in the current game but being head mounted means less exposure over obstacles to get the lock and fire. I have 3 mediums and TAG on my 4J

Edited by Ace Selin, 05 June 2015 - 08:31 PM.

[Rogue Jedi]

jaxjace, on 05 June 2015 - 07:38 PM, said:

Mod your mechs to the core. As a general rule though not 100% always endo and max XL engine. obviously always DHS

dont have 3? get 3.

an XL engine is often not a good idea, if you mount an IS XL engine you will die to the loss of a side torso.
the vast majority of Lights will benefit from an XL, as will most mediums ^{(but I would advise against taking one on the HBK, or a CN9 both are usualy better with a standard engine)}, on some heavies it is worth using an XL, but heavies is where the durability vs weight saving trade off starts to become a major consideration, most assaults will not benefit from an XL because you can still have a lot of firepower with one side gone

[Spheroid]

Do the following: Upgrade your 4J with endo and DHS. The armament should be 2x LRM10 + 4x mlas + TAG. Put the original 200 STD back in there. It really isn't that bad when you unlock speed tweak.

Then when you have enough money buy two remaining Hunchbacks and elite them. The standard 4G generally keeps the stock engine. The 4SP and 4P work well with 250-260 engines. I don't recommend the SP for new players at this time however. If you have a slightly upgraded engine you could probably put that in a 4H. I have a 225 STD in my AC-10 build.

I don't know what a slightly upgraded engine is but 205-220 are highly niche in this game. Multiples of 25 are generally the best especially with how heatsinks work on engines common to the mediums class.

Edited by Spheroid, 06 June 2015 - 09:14 AM.

[TheCaptainJZ]

Mod first. Feel free to experiment. Dont be afraid to go against the grain by trying weapons not lining up exactly with quirks. It may not be optimal but you should feel comfortable trying it out anyway. Engines cost too much to change so be careful with those. Upgrade to double heatsinks then endosteel. Some heavier mechs may not be able to use endo. Only put ferro fibrous on if it fits after everything else. Only lights have enough slots and not enough equipment.

[Void Angel]

Snardo, on 05 June 2015 - 04:10 AM, said:

So, I'm fairly new to this game, but am loving it!

After finishing the cadet missions, I bought a first mech - a HBK-4J and made a few slight mods to it. LRM-10, LRM-5, 5 MLs and a slightly uprated engine.

I feel like I'm starting to get the hang of things and am starting to improve a bit but I think I have some ideas for my mech that would further improve performance.

At the same time, it might be fun to experiment with something different as well. The problem is that I'm not earning very much money right now, so I can either make significant mods to what I have (to the tune of 2+M c-bills, about half my current balance) or continue saving for another mech. If I mod the current one, it will set me back quite a way from getting that second mech, so I'm conflicted. New stuff is always fun.

Any suggestions?

You need to get three variants before you really get the most out of any chassis, because the Pilot Skills are very important - particularly Speed Tweak, and the doubled Basic Skill bonuses from purchasing all of the second tier skills.

Buy two other hunchbacks - I'd recommend the 4G and the 4P - and get them skilled out. Make minimal modifications in order to get them semi-optimized (in order to efficiently skill them up,) then work on whichever one you enjoy the most. At the beginner level, that HunchBack 4J can be an insane c-bill earner, so I'd recommend going with 2 LRM10s, a TAG laser, and perhaps two medium lasers (or even Smalls) for close defense - focus on the LRMs. Be aware that LRMs are not terribly good weapons at higher skill levels, for complicated reasons, but at a beginner Elo ranking you should do fine.

Edited by Void Angel, 06 June 2015 - 11:01 AM.

[sycocys]

My personal recommendation is to start with Commandos, then get Hunchbacks.

Avoid the COM-1D as it is by far the worst of the Commando variants, and it's hard to go wrong with any of the HBK's.

If you hate lights skip the commandos, but the reason I recommend them starting out is that getting 1 XL covers all but the 2D, and they are by far the best (AND CHEAPEST) mech to learn how to play the game on. If you can master twisting, cover and brawling in the commando series you're skills will transfer upwards and you'll be extremely well off for the effort.

The Hunchies would be the next place to go/start - you can run them all with standard engines (Mine are all 235), they can similar to the commando tank/spread a lot of damage as long as you take the time to learn good practices and not get face loaded with huge alpha strikes. You can also earn a fair amount of c-bills per match in the hunches.

From there on, my next picks would stay with brawlers because that's where you are going to get kills and c-bills. The Quickdraw has been performing well for me, Thunderbolts are a great choice, or go up into assaults for faster matches with Zues or Battlemaster - if you spring for the Hellslinger you can rake in c-bills faster than about any other mech unless you order Invasion variants of clan mechs.

[jaxjace]

Rogue Jedi, on 05 June 2015 - 11:45 PM, said:

an XL engine is often not a good idea, if you mount an IS XL engine you will die to the loss of a side torso.
the vast majority of Lights will benefit from an XL, as will most mediums ^{(but I would advise against taking one on the HBK, or a CN9 both are usualy better with a standard engine)}, on some heavies it is worth using an XL, but heavies is where the durability vs weight saving trade off starts to become a major consideration, most assaults will not benefit from an XL because you can still have a lot of firepower with one side gone

Wrong, XL engines are always better than standard except on stalkers. In the hands of two top skilled players, the one with the XL loadout will generally always win

Edited by jaxjace, 06 June 2015 - 03:02 PM.

[Rogue Jedi]

jaxjace, on 06 June 2015 - 03:02 PM, said:

Wrong, XL engines are always better than standard except on stalkers. In the hands of two top skilled players, the one with the XL loadout will generally always win

we clearly have different viewpoints on the subject and that is fine, but understand that from discussing this with other players and forum posts I have read, the general consensus among players seems to be that in about half of cases a Standard engine is better than an XL

there are several Mechs where an XL engine is a definite advantage (most lights, the Dragon and Catapult) and several where most players would not risk an XL (Atlas, King Crab, Stalker, Thunderbolt, Hunchback).

Most Mechs fall into the category of Mechs where you must chose between firepower, speed and durability, e.g. my best builds for the Griffin use a standard engine, and if a Mech is capable of mounting the vast majority of its weapons on one side and sacrificing the other as a shield then a Standard will probably be better.
the Centurion is so durable with a standard engine that it is a serious consideration, there are 2 Cents where I would take an XL, both can mount an AC20 and need the extra weight an XL offers. even the Firestarter is tanky enough with a standard to make it worth considering using a standard if you do not usualy die as a result of being legged.

I use a standard engine in about half my builds, when playing a Mech I take note of what components I loose first, if after the first 10 or so games I find I am regularly loosing a side torso I will usualy decide on a standard engine unless I am unable to think of an effective looking build without an XL, if I am not usualy loosing a side I go XL unless I need the slots in the side torso (e.g. I want to use a side torso AC20).

Edited by Rogue Jedi, 07 June 2015 - 04:02 AM.

[jaxjace]

Rogue Jedi, on 06 June 2015 - 11:19 PM, said:

we clearly have different viewpoints on the subject and that is fine, but understand that from discussing this with other players and forum posts I have read general consensus among players seems to be that in about half of cases a Standard engine is better than an XL

there are several Mechs where an XL engine is a definite advantage (most lights, the Dragon and Catapult) and several where most players would not risk an XL (Atlas, King Crab, Stalker, Thunderbolt, Hunchback).

Most Mechs fall into the category of Mechs where you must chose between firepower, speed and durability, e.g. my best builds for the Griffin use a standard engine, and if a Mech is capable of mounting the vast majority of its weapons on one side and sacrificing the other as a shield then a Standard will probably be better.
the Centurion is so durable with a standard engine that it is a serious consideration, there are 2 Cents where I would take an XL, both can mount an AC20 and need the extra weight an XL offers. even the Firestarter is tanky enough with a standard to make it worth considering using a standard if you do not usualy die as a result of being legged.

I use a standard engine in about half my builds, when playing a Mech I take note of what components I loose first, if after the first 10 or so games I find I am regularly loosing a side torso I will usualy decide on a standard engine unless I am unable to think of an effective looking build without an XL, if I am not usualy loosing a side I go XL unless I need the slots in the side torso (e.g. I want to use a side torso AC20).

Yup, I always will take more speed and firepower over anything. the more rapid torso twist of a fat XL allows me to tank more than a slow Standard ever could. Also more often than not XL allows for more firepower, out of the 108 mechs I own, all of which be kitted with engines there are only a handful that take Standards for me.

Stalkers all take standard
Locust 1E
CTF1X

so thats 5...

Lemme tell you how expensive XLs are...

[DivineEvil]

jaxjace, on 07 June 2015 - 01:05 AM, said:

Yup, I always will take more speed and firepower over anything. the more rapid torso twist of a fat XL allows me to tank more than a slow Standard ever could. Also more often than not XL allows for more firepower, out of the 108 mechs I own, all of which be kitted with engines there are only a handful that take Standards for me.

Stalkers all take standard
Locust 1E
CTF1X

so thats 5...

Lemme tell you how expensive XLs are...

You have no idea what real tanking is. The further you go up the tonnage rating, the less reasonable it is to use XLs. Having larger engine not necessary counteracts your durability cut in half, and stuffing extreme amounts of weapons not necessary means that you can use them to the considerable benefit. Running XL on the Assault is a complete waste of all the armor they can carry.

All of my 9 Light mechs run XLs, all of my 15 Mediums runs XLs but HBK-4G, out of my 14 Heavies, half is run on XLs, but out of 10 Assaults only one KGB is run on XL.

Snardo, on 05 June 2015 - 04:10 AM, said:

Any suggestions?

Never jump on another chassis until you have your current ones mastered and completely outfitted. Having one competetive, play-making mech is always better, than several underperforming ones.