40 replies to this topic

[Yokaiko]

lordtzar, on 06 June 2015 - 09:51 PM, said:

WTB Hunchback IIc

Yeah dual UAC20s.......om nom nom.

Bishop Steiner, on 06 June 2015 - 09:54 PM, said:

barely enough, unless you got a lot of dues who hold still or don't twist. If it works for you, go for it, but I'll pass

Its surprisingly lethal. That loadout hasn't changed in a long time, its a pure money making damage ho.

[Nightshade24]

Bishop Steiner, on 06 June 2015 - 09:21 PM, said:

so less easy to spread damage is a nerf...and you'd pack 10-12 ton guns to shake things? Seems....inefficient.

Twas just an observation ,and most AC2-5 builds often have there strength from screenshake.

Anyway, was just an observation, was comparing the clan ballistics to the IS ones, Clans still spread damage; however less spread. Clan ballistics kinda had the same niche as flamers in some way...

[Ovion]

Bishop Steiner, on 06 June 2015 - 09:26 PM, said:

can't pack enough ammo for me to trust it. But it sure does seem vicious until it runs out.

I use a quad LBX10 build, using the industry standard 3T per Gun minimum:
DWF-B
This things great.

I'm currently trying an alt version DWF-B, Which sacrifices 4T ammo (only 2T per) for S torso's (JumpJets) - partially because it lets me keep my Hex-LBX2 Prime going at the same time, without having to buy 4 more omnipods.
It's doing OK, but I'm not sure I like the ammo levels...

[Gattsus]

Bishop Steiner, on 06 June 2015 - 09:54 PM, said:

barely enough, unless you got a lot of dues who hold still or don't twist. If it works for you, go for it, but I'll pass

I use 2.5-3.0 tons per weapon and I almost never run dry.

[Bishop Steiner]

Gattsus, on 07 June 2015 - 05:05 AM, said:

I use 2.5-3.0 tons per weapon and I almost never run dry.

then you are the exception, not the rule.

[Andi Nagasia]

i like the new C-UACs but i wouldnt call them OP,
if anything they may need a velocity buff,

i think PGI should take the time to fully Re-Balance Tech Weapons Systems,
(IS Lasers Vs Clan Lasers)(IS Missiles Vs Clan Missiles)(IS Ballistics Vs Clan Ballistics)
Edit-

Edited by Andi Nagasia, 07 June 2015 - 08:00 AM.

[Gyrok]

Bishop Steiner, on 06 June 2015 - 09:54 PM, said:

barely enough, unless you got a lot of dues who hold still or don't twist. If it works for you, go for it, but I'll pass

Trick is...you run 10 tons and swap the ERMLs for ERSLs.

[Bishop Steiner]

Gyrok, on 07 June 2015 - 09:35 AM, said:

Trick is...you run 10 tons and swap the ERMLs for ERSLs.

all or nothing. drop the lasers for ammo. do it. I dare you.

[Gyrok]

Bishop Steiner, on 07 June 2015 - 09:36 AM, said:

all or nothing. drop the lasers for ammo. do it. I dare you.

Started off that way...but honestly...the 20 pts up close is better for finishing targets than 2 additional tons of ammo. Though, if I were to ever take it in CW, I might consider it...

[Ghogiel]

Ace Selin, on 06 June 2015 - 08:53 PM, said:

than they ever were prior

Clans when released were OP as **** and have had at least half a dozen nerfs. also buffs to IS mech quirks to even the playing field. This buff is so miniscule compare to other balance changes.

[Fleeb the Mad]

Keep in mind the buff to clan autocannons favored the big guns over the small guns.

The UAC/2 and UAC/5 see comparatively tiny bonuses. The buff to the UAC/10 and UAC/20 particularly is huge though, and they were very maligned weapons.

More autocannon builds move battles into closer range. In addition to IS mechs being stronger in brawls than Clan ones due to weapon heat, it actually gives Clan mechs a reason to get closer than 400m. So it gives the Clans and the IS both something they want. Brawl options and entiticing clan mechs to actually get closer.

[Pariah Devalis]

Ghogiel, on 07 June 2015 - 09:40 AM, said:

Clans when released were OP as **** and have had at least half a dozen nerfs. also buffs to IS mech quirks to even the playing field. This buff is so miniscule compare to other balance changes.

Fleeb the Mad, on 07 June 2015 - 10:28 AM, said:

Keep in mind the buff to clan autocannons favored the big guns over the small guns.

The UAC/2 and UAC/5 see comparatively tiny bonuses. The buff to the UAC/10 and UAC/20 particularly is huge though, and they were very maligned weapons.

More autocannon builds move battles into closer range. In addition to IS mechs being stronger in brawls than Clan ones due to weapon heat, it actually gives Clan mechs a reason to get closer than 400m. So it gives the Clans and the IS both something they want. Brawl options and entiticing clan mechs to actually get closer.

Also figure that Clan UAC just have not been used outside of lolz builds. Clans more OP because of a weapon system that, quite frankly, wasn't used was improved to a better state of semi-suck? Seriously?

[MilesTeg1982]

Fleeb the Mad, on 07 June 2015 - 10:28 AM, said:

More autocannon builds move battles into closer range. In addition to IS mechs being stronger in brawls than Clan ones due to weapon heat, it actually gives Clan mechs a reason to get closer than 400m. So it gives the Clans and the IS both something they want. Brawl options and entiticing clan mechs to actually get closer.

CUACs are still useless - at least for me - I still have massive problems with hit registration (my ping is around 100-120) - and being forced to move very close to enemies which still have better weapons for brawling (IS-lasers, IS-ACs) just for the chance to use the CUAC? Thats just not an option

[Roadkill]

lordtzar, on 06 June 2015 - 08:56 PM, said:

You know the dps didn't change, right?

The patch seems to have had a positive effect on hit registration for Clan autocannons, so while technically the dps didn't change in reality it went up considerably.

I'm seeing 50%-80% higher damage totals in matches from my Mechs that are dependent on Clan autocannons. Mechs that used to produce 300-500 damage in a normal match now produce 500-800.

Bishop Steiner, on 07 June 2015 - 05:06 AM, said:

then you are the exception, not the rule.

Then I'm also the exception. Depends on the weapon, but 2-3 tons is generally sufficient for me. I'll occasionally run dry, but I'll also occasionally end a match without having heard the 25% warning.

[Chuck Jager]

I have found that cuacs are in the same boat as lrms. Your build better be really good, and you really need to know how your play affects the battle, not your damage and kills.

I have run dual cuac10s on my warhawks and Twolves and noticed instantly that I got lower total damage, but I was getting more wins. The most fun was when I and a lrm dog jumped into a trench hoping to hit the weak side and I had made an obvious mistake. 2 of us backed 4-5 of their players back and we won. Without the screen shake we both would have been dead asap and they would have gained the better position.

I set the cuac10 on a macro so the second one starts 50ms behind the first. When done correctly the double tap on both finishes before the cooldown. When I do not physically double tap I have fewer jams. I also usually only jam 1 at a time. I treat jams the same way I treat heat - time to move.

I think the multiple uacs work better on Twolves and Warhawks because of their mobility and ability to break apart a firing line while disrupting damage on the team. I really love the balancing heat factor on uac 20s because 2 of these things on a macro are devastating.

Like lrm build, these things are not so good if the player is not aware of how to play aggressively to help the team. Also the return for the team drops considerably after 2.

After a lot of testing, clan uacs 10s and 5s are getting better results for me than IS models, because of the ability to strap on cermlas and srms at the lower weights without an XL death tax. The dragon is good at getting damage against a loosing team, but it does not make or break a battle compared to clan uac builds (hbr) if the enemy is aggressive or your team is poking.

clan (extended screen shake) + (clan laser weight/range) > IS( (u)ac5/10 pin point damage) + (lower secondary damage) + (XL survivability tax)

The speed of the Dwhale does not allow it to use the screen shake as effectively for the team, and its ability to boat gauss with erppc/lasers is the best for making something die. For pug play it is all a toss.

I do wonder about the effect of the screen shake stun with multiple uacs on a macro. The "stun" effect seems to be cumulative with each hit and the server clock. This would seem to be based around the assumption that the hits came from different directions with each enemy paying a tax in tonnage for the effect. Clan uacs without a macro are not fun but manageable, but with one and now the shorter burst time this may become a greater issue. I will be honest, I am aware of this and am treating it as "intended" and "legal". I do have a problem with a weapon ability that may not be as accessible to all, or is "OK" as long as everyone is not using it.

[Bishop Steiner]

Roadkill, on 07 June 2015 - 01:56 PM, said:

The patch seems to have had a positive effect on hit registration for Clan autocannons, so while technically the dps didn't change in reality it went up considerably.

I'm seeing 50%-80% higher damage totals in matches from my Mechs that are dependent on Clan autocannons. Mechs that used to produce 300-500 damage in a normal match now produce 500-800.


Then I'm also the exception. Depends on the weapon, but 2-3 tons is generally sufficient for me. I'll occasionally run dry, but I'll also occasionally end a match without having heard the 25% warning.

3 tons is pretty much norm on ac10s save for the crazy quirked LB-Xs on CN9-D and ON1-Ms.

[Pjwned]

I would be fine with reducing the impulse on C-UACs because 1 or 2 ballistics suppressing you so much that you can't even fight back due to all the cockpit shake is stupid as hell.

[Fleeb the Mad]

Pariah Devalis, on 07 June 2015 - 11:13 AM, said:

Also figure that Clan UAC just have not been used outside of lolz builds. Clans more OP because of a weapon system that, quite frankly, wasn't used was improved to a better state of semi-suck? Seriously?

I'm all over the dakka personally because I don't like gauss rifles. I'd much rather have a AC-10 or AC-20 if I have room in my build for a ballistic. But no, they've never been spectacular. They are still difficult to use at any kind of distance, particularly if you're trying to lead a moving target. Then you get a spray that only lands significant damage if they don't jink while moving.

MilesTeg1982, on 07 June 2015 - 01:48 PM, said:

CUACs are still useless - at least for me - I still have massive problems with hit registration (my ping is around 100-120) - and being forced to move very close to enemies which still have better weapons for brawling (IS-lasers, IS-ACs) just for the chance to use the CUAC? Thats just not an option

Well, uh. Not much to say there. That's unfortunate, but not particularly relevant to weapon balance though.

[Nightmare1]

I can't say that I've noticed a difference with regard to the Clan Mechs in general. I still kill them about as easily as I did before; maybe even more so now since I started targeting only the legs on Stormcrows...

[LordMelvin]

I slapped 4 CUAC2s on my HBR-B along with 4 tons of ammo and 3 CML. It's actually a huge amount of fun, and I'm pulling 400-500 damage a match if I use all of my ammo. People hear the dakka and think I'm a dire wolf so they turn around and run away, and the sustained fire eats through light mechs and internals so nicely.

I never thought the "laservomit" FOTM was as big of an issue as a lot of people did, but anything that inspires build diversity is an A+ in my book.