22 replies to this topic

[Darian DelFord]

Quote

• Jenner
  
  • Center Torso hit mesh area has been decreased on the sides

Someone a bit more knowledgeable about the techno lingo explain this to me?

Harder or easier to hit the CT?

Hit Box Change?

Before I get all in an uproar just trying to figure it out.

[MeiSooHaityu]

Hitbox change. CT harder to hit.

It's a good thing.

[Pariah Devalis]

They made the side torsos bigger so that it is slightly harder for a blind, mentally handicapped rhesus monkey to consistently nail the Jenner's center torso.

[MeiSooHaityu]

Here is another thread where pilots are giving their feedback on the change.

http://mwomercs.com/...nner-ct-change/

It sounds promissing. I might need to retry my Jenners again.

[Joseph Mallan]

MeiSooHaityu, on 18 June 2015 - 05:06 AM, said:

Hitbox change. CT harder to hit.

It's a good thing.

But this is such a big CT compared to the side torsos...?

[stratagos]

Pariah Devalis, on 18 June 2015 - 05:06 AM, said:

They made the side torsos bigger so that it is slightly harder for a blind, mentally handicapped rhesus monkey to consistently nail the Jenner's center torso.

As a blind, mentally handicapped rhesus monkey, I resent this change

[MeiSooHaityu]

Joseph Mallan, on 18 June 2015 - 05:11 AM, said:

But this is such a big CT compared to the side torsos...?

It depends on how you define side torsos.

A side torso could be the small bits the arms attach to (like you're implying), or it could be that plus the armor sides flanking the center strut from the main body to the cockpit. I'm guessing it is now more of the latter.

Besides, it would have to be really. Originally those bits of torsos the arms mount to wasn't really there. The arms mounted right to the legs. Look at the original design, it looks like a CT with legs and arms. Even by TT rules, a side torso has to be in there somewhere. Now it's the sides of the cockpit main strut.

Seems fine to me.

[Joseph Mallan]

MeiSooHaityu, on 18 June 2015 - 05:21 AM, said:

It depends on how you define side torsos.

A side torso could be the small bits the arms attach to (like you're implying), or it could be that plus the armor sides flanking the center strut from the main body to the cockpit. I'm guessing it is now more of the latter.

Besides, it would have to be really. Originally those bits of torsos the arms mount to wasn't really there. The arms mounted right to the legs. Look at the original design, it looks like a CT with legs and arms. Even by TT rules, a side torso has to be in there somewhere. Now it's the sides of the cockpit main strut.

Seems fine to me.

So the side torso can be a 2 side faces of the CT is what we have come to? We are getting really close to splitting atoms I think.

Also wouldn't the Cockpit Strut be... I don't know... the Neck? And when did my neck become part of my left/right rib cage?

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 18 June 2015 - 05:29 AM.

[Cyborne Elemental]

Side torso hitbox now extends on the flat sides of the CT, from shoulder to nose.

Go check in testing grounds.

Makes running Xl a little more dangerous, but you can twist out alot more damage, and Standard engine builds can get pretty tanky.

Something like this which might just be useable?
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...5d932a0cb96840a

Edited by Mister D, 18 June 2015 - 06:09 AM.

[MeiSooHaityu]

Joseph Mallan, on 18 June 2015 - 05:28 AM, said:

So the side torso can be a 2 side faces of the CT is what we have come to? We are getting really close to splitting atoms I think.

Also wouldn't the Cockpit Strut be... I don't know... the Neck? And when did my neck become part of my left/right rib cage?

Comparing humanoid anatomy to a non-humanoid mech does not apply. It has a "torso" or call it a hull if you want. It is split into thirds. A left side, a center, and a right. Now the left and right extend farther forward a long the center. It makes sense and I don't see any controversy in this.

Besides, how is the new torso hitbox config any different to a Catapult for instance? The Catapult's side torsos extend forward a long the CT almost to the very tip of the CT. Instead, should the side torsos only be that little out cropping the arms attach too? Should the whole rest of the torso be CT? I know it feels like that now, but it isn't the case.

Just because the CT is narrower than most aircraft fuselage style torso doesn't mean it should be treated any different.

So no, we aren't splitting atoms, just adjusting hitboxes a long the same lines we have been with other mechs of similar layout.

[Greenjulius]

I dusted off and ran my Jenner-F around for a few matches and still found my CT eating most of the incoming damage. It's improved, but don't expect it to compete with Firestarters. Why they are still quirked higher than Jenners is beyond me.

[Lorian Sunrider]

As someone who started off with Jenners and still plays them fairly frequently, the change is appreciated. That being said, the Jenner taught me how to truly play light mechs. Since the CT is such a big issue, you learn real fast to not put yourself in a position to be shot at easily. All other light mechs came easy after that.

[Light-Speed]

Mister D, on 18 June 2015 - 05:35 AM, said:

Side torso hitbox now extends on the flat sides of the CT, from shoulder to nose.

Go check in testing grounds.

Makes running Xl a little more dangerous, but you can twist out alot more damage, and Standard engine builds can get pretty tanky.

Something like this which might just be useable?
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...5d932a0cb96840a

I wouldn't suggest it...
The speed is the most important part of the somewhat fragile lights. Would you like to be survive a bit longer under fire or just not being fired at at all?
Besides, if you are in front of a heavier mech and they can kill you before you can kill them or before one of you retreats, you are doing something wrong. Not that I never make that mistake, but that is still the worst position for a light.
Plus the small laser forces you to get in close to get the full firepower on. Speed is really important for that. Choose a specific range, either med or close. Don't be a jack of some trades.

[xe N on]

Now, they just miss to add the 20% energy cooldown and 20% energy heat quirk to the Jenner to make it viable again.

But neverthless, got a 952 damage and 7 kills game in my JR7-F (Nevertheless, my team lost )

Edited by xe N on, 18 June 2015 - 10:53 AM.

[Almond Brown]

Nightingale27, on 18 June 2015 - 10:40 AM, said:

I wouldn't suggest it...
The speed is the most important part of the somewhat fragile lights. Would you like to be survive a bit longer under fire or just not being fired at at all?
Besides, if you are in front of a heavier mech and they can kill you before you can kill them or before one of you retreats, you are doing something wrong. Not that I never make that mistake, but that is still the worst position for a light.
Plus the small laser forces you to get in close to get the full firepower on. Speed is really important for that. Choose a specific range, either med or close. Don't be a jack of some trades.

Agreed. Drop the 2 SL's for another ML. You lose 1 pt of damage but get a set optimal range out to 320m, with Quirk, also shorten the CD to 2.64s, add Arty a UAV and then run like hell. Pew Pew...

Edited by Almond Brown, 18 June 2015 - 10:54 AM.

[Greenjulius]

xe N on, on 18 June 2015 - 10:45 AM, said:

Now, they just miss to add the 20% energy cooldown and 20% energy heat quirk to the Jenner to make it viable again.

But neverthless, got a 952 damage and 7 kills game in my JR7-F

To this day, the Jenner-F is the only mech I've managed to get Ace of Spades in. I've gotten 7 kills on many occasions, but never been able to match that magical 8 kill match. I blame it on clams.

Anyway, why does the Firestarter-S get 20% heat reduction for MPLs, (10% Energy +10% MPL) while the Jenner-F only gets a piddly 7.5% range increase? And the FS9-S has an extra energy hardpoint, and dual AMS capability! The Firestarters are just straight up superior to Jenners with where the quirks currently are. There is a reason more than 50% of all lights played are now FS9s.

Edited by Greenjulius, 18 June 2015 - 10:55 AM.

[Almond Brown]

Greenjulius, on 18 June 2015 - 10:53 AM, said:

To this day, the Jenner-F is the only mech I've managed to get Ace of Spades in. I've gotten 7 kills on many occasions, but never been able to match that magical 8 kill match. I blame it on clams.

Anyway, why does the Firestarter-S get 20% heat reduction for MPLs, (10% Energy +10% MPL) while the Jenner-F only gets a piddly 7.5% range increase? And the FS9-S has an extra energy hardpoint, and dual AMS capability! The Firestarters are just straight up superior to Jenners with where the quirks currently are. There is a reason more than 50% of all lights played are now FS9s.

And sadly the K has the MPL CD quirk (7.5%) with Energy CD (7.5%) and Heat Gen. reduction (-10%) but has only 4 slots and 4 MPL's (24 pt. Alpha) requires an XL275 and some slight armor stripping. Got run fast is the word... ;(

Edited by Almond Brown, 18 June 2015 - 11:08 AM.

[Light-Speed]

Greenjulius, on 18 June 2015 - 10:53 AM, said:

To this day, the Jenner-F is the only mech I've managed to get Ace of Spades in. I've gotten 7 kills on many occasions, but never been able to match that magical 8 kill match. I blame it on clams.

Anyway, why does the Firestarter-S get 20% heat reduction for MPLs, (10% Energy +10% MPL) while the Jenner-F only gets a piddly 7.5% range increase? And the FS9-S has an extra energy hardpoint, and dual AMS capability! The Firestarters are just straight up superior to Jenners with where the quirks currently are. There is a reason more than 50% of all lights played are now FS9s.

Maybe because Jenners don't need them? I mean, I feel it's fine where it is now. The rest is just a matter of focus.

p.s. Jenners are shorter. Convenient for stealth.

[Juodas Varnas]

Nightingale27, on 18 June 2015 - 12:02 PM, said:

Maybe because Jenners don't need them? I mean, I feel it's fine where it is now. The rest is just a matter of focus.

p.s. Jenners are shorter. Convenient for stealth.

Jenners are fine. Its the firestarters that are out of line.
They should REMOVE all quirks from it. ALL OF THEM.
It doesn't need them.
It already has a lot of hardpoints, a lot of jump jets, great engine cap AND borderline-broken hitboxes.

Quirks were supposed to be for underperforming mechs to bump them up a little, not for already god-like mechs to make them even better.

Edited by Juodas Varnas, 18 June 2015 - 12:11 PM.

[xe N on]

Jenner are not fine. Just compare their quirks to Ravens or even quirked medium mechs.

Jenner all need at least +10 armor or structure to legs and CT. Some range and heat quirks would be necessary too, like 20% each. Then they would be in line.

Edited by xe N on, 23 June 2015 - 09:47 AM.