74 replies to this topic

[Shinikaru]

It's been quite some time since LRM's were a thing that was disproportinate to the other weapon options, but we have all noticed that people are boating them again, and boating them in large numbers.

With the ahem "balancing" of just about every other mechanic lately (lasers, heat, ballistics (ac, lbx get no love), mostly to the softer side, LRM's are once again begging to become that thing that is more OP than the rest, as they stand out more then the rest.

Too many people going too much LRM all the time, over other weapons, due mostly to the other options getting softened. This has hit the brawling side adversely, as some of us simply won't jump on the bandwagon; we only pay the price while the numbers tally.
I say that from both sides. Too many of my mates unwilling to actually engage a front line because they're LRM boating....Too many of my mates also unable to push in because were facing face-pummeling numbers of incoming missles.

I think part of it is LRMS are such an easy thing for new players to gravitate too, high reward low risk.
It deserves a discussion, in relation to the constantly unbalanced-triad of missles/lazers/ballistics.


Think on it.

edit for my amazing spelling.

Edited by Shinikaru, 22 June 2015 - 08:23 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Remove yourself from the Underhive, and you will find the prevalence of LRMs to evaporate like a morning dew under the summer sun.

[bad arcade kitty]

>Too many people going too much LRM all the time, over other weapons, due mostly to the other options getting softened, has hit the brawling side adversely, as some of us simply won't jump on the bandwagon, we only pay the price while the numbers tally.

i dunno, i brawl like all my games didn't see any problems with lrms

[Shinikaru]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 June 2015 - 08:22 PM, said:

Remove yourself from the Underhive, and you will find the prevalence of LRMs to evaporate like a morning dew under the summer sun.

you have to look at it from not just the higher elo perspective. i'm quite aware that in higher tier games, range fighting is quite less common, Not all of us drop in constant premades, sometimes pugging Is the game.

I really need to find a decent company. That's beside my point.

[FupDup]

Lurms are a feast-or-famine type weapon that are either pretty good or totally trash, depending upon whether or not the stars align in your favor.

That's the part that should be redesigned...they should actually be reliable, consistent primary weapons that don't have a gazillion counter-items.

[bad arcade kitty]

use radar deprivation module, hide when you have *missiles incoming!*, if you still have problems use ams and ecm

[El Bandito]

Shinikaru, on 22 June 2015 - 08:20 PM, said:

It's been quite some time since LRM's were a thing that was disproportinate to the other weapon options, but we have all noticed that people are boating them again, and boating them in large numbers.

With the ahem "balancing" of just about every other mechanic lately (lasers, heat, ballistics (ac, lbx get no love), mostly to the softer side, LRM's are once again begging to become that thing that is more OP than the rest, as they stand out more then the rest.

Too many people going too much LRM all the time, over other weapons, due mostly to the other options getting softened. This has hit the brawling side adversely, as some of us simply won't jump on the bandwagon; we only pay the price while the numbers tally.

What LRMs? I am too busy getting 55 damage worth of alpha on my mech thanks to laser vomits running around. Other options getting softened? Thanks to the prevalence of ECMs, getting lock is now harder than ever. More so, when the Scat arrives.

Shinikaru, on 22 June 2015 - 08:27 PM, said:

you have to look at it from not just the higher elo perspective. i'm quite aware that in higher tier games, range fighting is quite less common, Not all of us drop in constant premades, sometimes pugging Is the game.

I really need to find a decent company. That's beside my point.

I pug 100% of the time. PPFLDs and laser vomit are worse than LRMs. Period.


Fact of the matter is, LRMs do need rework, as well as ECM, because LRMs are not worth their weight ATM, and require ridiculous amount of side options to function. And make the damn TAG visible through heat-vision only.
TAG laser is supposed to be infrared, not a giant "hit me" sign.

Edited by El Bandito, 22 June 2015 - 09:37 PM.

[EmeraldSongbird]

You're suggesting they are overpowered? As it's been stated previously, they either work well or not at all, as there as counters such as ECM, AMS, and just basic cover that can render LRMs ineffective or outright useless. When they do hit, the damage spread is awful. You see the entire enemy mech flash colors with no particular part taking a ton of damage in most cases. If getting whacked with LRMs is a consistent problem, try flanking, stick with an ECM buddy, try to get your lights to flank them, or just get out of the way and in cover before they reach you. If anything I find them to be crap auxiliary/support weapons. They do need a rework, that is for sure.

[Davegt27]

wow that did not take long

I only put my LRM TW together a few days ago

I put together a LRM Huginn today

Edited by Davegt27, 22 June 2015 - 09:13 PM.

[Roadkill]

LRMs are still bad. If PGI is going to change them, they need to make them better. Doing that would require completely re-working ECM and all other systems that interact with LRMs, though, so I really don't see it happening any time soon.

The real issue with LRMs is that they're Bads Detectors. LRMs depend far more on the skill of the target than on the skill of the firer. At some subconscious level, most people understand that, which is why they get all bent out of shape when they get killed by LRMs all the time. Getting killed by LRMs all the time means you're bad.

I've even stopped using Radar Derp. LRMs are simply too easy to avoid... and that's if they can even get a solid lock due to all the ECM.

The flip side of all of this is that I'm a regular user of LRMs. My standard c-bill farming ride is a Stormcrow with 4 x LRM-5 and 2 x CERLL. It earns more c-bills for me than a laser vomit build or an SRM build. But I'm pretty good with LRMs and I feel no shame in preying on bads to grind my c-bills.

But for serious combat? LRMs go bye-bye. They're not worth the tonnage, even in the PUG queues on the high side of average.

[Pjwned]

I'm guessing the reason you don't have a single actual idea on how to "fix" LRMs is because you're full of crap.

[Elizander]

Give me a dumbfire mode toggle where they just fire straight ahead like SRMs/LBX. LRMs fixed.

[Cyborne Elemental]

When you can put 60-70 alpha into sombody's face right now and where you want it, why use any tonnage at all in a weapon system that is situational, shotguns damage everywhere, and takes 5 seconds to reach its target and is pretty easily dodged and avoided by either terrain or the Radar deprivation module while being surrounded by multiple ECM?

[Matthew Ace]

Fixes to LRM probably should start as small adjustments to other stuff holding them back.

My opinion:

Spoiler

For starters, LRMs without Artemis needs their spread looked at; LRM5 already has a good cooldown rate, no need to give it the best spread as well, despite multiples of them costing more hardpoint then a single larger rack. I'd standardise spread of all regular LRMs to that of LRM10, giving LRM15 and 20 some saving grace.

With Artemis, it might be fine if 4xALRM5 has slightly tighter spread than 1xALRM20 as they take up more slots and weight as well. This is also in consideration that Artemis affects only LRM fired with LOS.

Might add more later, scope (with more aggressive changes) enclosed within this spoiler.

Spoiler

Wider spread on indirect fire?

Artemis and LRM lock decoupled from SSRM, then have ECM only nullify Artemis?

Slower cooldown and ammo count reduced, but increased velocity and damage?

Edited by Matthew Ace, 22 June 2015 - 09:43 PM.

[Xetelian]

With so much ECM around it is hard to even consider a LRM based setup.

I don't run LRMs, I have tried it but it didn't suit me, I prefer brawling above all else and I die to LRMs very rarely.

[bad arcade kitty]

Elizander, on 22 June 2015 - 09:32 PM, said:

Give me a dumbfire mode toggle where they just fire straight ahead like SRMs/LBX. LRMs fixed.

they already fire to any point where you point them

[thesleepyslam]

it's literally just an Elo problem.

[Novakaine]

ROFL!
Man lurms are the weakest weapon in the game.
With the most counters of any weapon.
However what makes them deadly is this - sheer noobery.
And how did this happen?
No one bothered to shoot at the lone Hunchie behind them until the end of the match.
Not a single mech turned to say.
"Er der's a Hunchie behind us sumbody go shooty at him."
If just one mech had challenged me he would have died, but the next mech would have probably have gotten me.
Just one.
Oh on a side note it was 5 lurm Kills and 2 Laser kills.
Novakaine loves him some Lurms.

Edited by Novakaine, 22 June 2015 - 09:54 PM.

[Novakaine]

Oh and every anti-lurm post deserves this.
When in doubt!

[Elizander]

bad arcade kitty, on 22 June 2015 - 09:47 PM, said:

they already fire to any point where you point them

That requires you pointing at the ground/non-moving mech and the arc makes it travel a long time if you're leading a shot. Firing straight ahead is easier in most cases.