36 replies to this topic

[Dettmam]

In the last year I had observed the development line of this game and I have hit some conclusions that may or may not be right but it is how I feel it.

I have seen the anounce of several mech packs (and I got all off them).
CW was created.
After heavy complaining and a lot of time, the interface was (barely) improved.
We had the new river city.

Observing it, I have the feeling the eforts were much bigger in macking new mechs than in improving the game itself. I say it because the CW is not what most of people was hopping (it is not bad, but is not good as well), the interface still is poor (but now we can streep cockpit items, a big thanks for that) and, since I started last year, I have not seen big changes but CW. I have heard about AI, single player campain and Steam.

In the other hand, the new mech packs are very good, realy buyable stuff in my point of view. As I said, I have all of them and the wave III and resistance 2 and now the origins (Im an Orion die hard, what can I do?). I have several heroes and collors and cammos. I have spent good money in this game and Im ok with this because I had good fun so far with a community that is way different of most online games.

I even understant the focus on new mechs once PGI is a business and no one buy new maps. But I start to feel boried with the game and there is so much that can be done.

What I am going to do now is stand by the credit card to see what is new... no more expences until I see what comes next... I realy hope it is good!

Please, forgive my english, it is not my first language...

Edited by Dettmam, 09 July 2015 - 11:12 PM.

[Dettmam]

n time, River city is awesome right now! ;-)
I believe that just complain is not fair, so what I realy believe that could be a very good improvement without been a huge technical challenge like AI is new weaponry like inferno missiles and light gauss.
There is a lot o energy weapons that could be added too and it could make old stuff gain a new life!

http://www.sarna.net...Equipment_Lists

Edited by Dettmam, 09 July 2015 - 10:41 PM.

[Arjohan]

Quite agree with you. I'm here since October CBT 2012. I can safely say that the game got better (better isn't great... We have the SAME gamemodes since then...) but at the same time worse. The good thing is the diversification in builds, but the bad things are one of the pillars that make a great game: gameplay.
It's repetitive and quite of forces you to play a single way to win. There are no real objectives. There are no adrenaline boost. It's too simple to just hold a gameplay style to just win and make it feel like a duty.
At least there can be 'mech builds variety, but it isn't enough. The community already asked for Solaris, more gamemodes (objective focused) and stock 'mech loadout matches.
Making a dynamic campaign would be really nice as AI compined with Co-Op would bring lots of fun. Adding more variety, such pilotable vehicles and suport AI, would bring a new perspective for huge and CW maps. The potential of unique game is PGIs hands... I still dream with a great up-to-date MW game.

[Paigan]

Well, Mechs mean a (the only) way of direct income for PGI.
And Mechs are created by different resources (people) than game features, which usually require heavy coding, proper people for that, etc.

If we payed directly for new maps (say ingame MC crowdfunding or whatever), I'm sure there would be tons of additional maps by now.

[Vellron2005]

The MWO development focus is basically the same as PGI budget focus.

The Developers will focus on what is most profitable, and what effects the most players. Maps don't pay bills. Mech Packs do.

That is why PGI was focusing heavily on mech packs, becouse they needed to fund all the "cool free fun stuff" like maps, CW and balance changes, and they wanted to keep the old, original paying players interested. As you said, you bought every mech pack. In the eyes of PGI, you are prime realestate, and they will do everything to keep you happy. Not me, who have bought 12$ worth of MC..

And people like you get bored with the same old mechs, and want new ones.

The problem I think is that PGI needs to realise that yeah, mech packs will keep old players playing, but it will make new players say, wait, this game gets boring real fast, there is very little content outside of the mechbay..

So, I sincerely hope PGI starts to invest about 70% of their design capacity into CW, immersion, and overall game balance, rather into new mechs. The new mechs must keep the cash flowing, but in my opinion, if they need more money, this community has proven more than willing to crowdfund them.

Personally, I would be much more inclined to "donate" a few bucks to make the game better with game modes, planet value and overall immersion, than to buy "the next OP mech, out now, available on a computer near you".

PGI also needs to invest heavily into marketing.

I cannot stress this enough. I don't know what its like in the American countries, or China, or Japan, but here in Croatia, All the banners I see invite me to play EVE online, Travian and World of Tanks.

Not many people have even heard of MWO, and it's been free to play for years..

PGI needs to advertise, and get new paying customers... not just keep the current ones happy.

Also, they must know that just doing a steam release will not get this job done. They need to go to E3, they need to appear on gaming TV shows and magazines, do some press releases, teaser trailers on youtube, and alike..

THAT will get them the resources to make MWO great..

[Moldur]

Free content makes no money :^)

[Arjohan]

That's true, but keep up with the same thing for 3 years isn't ideal... As for resources, wouldn't redirect it for more gameplay wise features instead of more and more 'mechs be better? Yeah, they need money... But to make it look like a "one-time-payment" for a F2P game isn't even close for ideal...

[Dettmam]

Free contents makes money in indirect ways I believe and, in the worst case, avoid people that pay to go spend their money in other place. PGI must have it in mind. I pay and I'm boried...

[Dettmam]

Vellron2005, on 10 July 2015 - 12:19 AM, said:

The MWO development focus is basically the same as PGI budget focus.

The Developers will focus on what is most profitable, and what effects the most players. Maps don't pay bills. Mech Packs do.

That is why PGI was focusing heavily on mech packs, becouse they needed to fund all the "cool free fun stuff" like maps, CW and balance changes, and they wanted to keep the old, original paying players interested. As you said, you bought every mech pack. In the eyes of PGI, you are prime realestate, and they will do everything to keep you happy. Not me, who have bought 12$ worth of MC..

And people like you get bored with the same old mechs, and want new ones.

The problem I think is that PGI needs to realise that yeah, mech packs will keep old players playing, but it will make new players say, wait, this game gets boring real fast, there is very little content outside of the mechbay..

So, I sincerely hope PGI starts to invest about 70% of their design capacity into CW, immersion, and overall game balance, rather into new mechs. The new mechs must keep the cash flowing, but in my opinion, if they need more money, this community has proven more than willing to crowdfund them.

Personally, I would be much more inclined to "donate" a few bucks to make the game better with game modes, planet value and overall immersion, than to buy "the next OP mech, out now, available on a computer near you".

PGI also needs to invest heavily into marketing.

I cannot stress this enough. I don't know what its like in the American countries, or China, or Japan, but here in Croatia, All the banners I see invite me to play EVE online, Travian and World of Tanks.

Not many people have even heard of MWO, and it's been free to play for years..

PGI needs to advertise, and get new paying customers... not just keep the current ones happy.

Also, they must know that just doing a steam release will not get this job done. They need to go to E3, they need to appear on gaming TV shows and magazines, do some press releases, teaser trailers on youtube, and alike..

THAT will get them the resources to make MWO great..

Agreed! But what I expect are not new mechs, but new gameplay. Inovation actually...
Sorry, but I realy did 't like the "players like you" stuff... my first owned mech was the Orion-VA and it is the one I play the most until now a days... I will never get boried of that old piece of juck... not as long as I keep making timber wolves in pieces with it... ;-)

But you are right... PGI must be more agressivd as a company in the market! Then, the good money will come and they will have resorces!

Edited by Dettmam, 10 July 2015 - 12:50 AM.

[Dettmam]

Anyways,
I believe more and more people will start to think like me and hide their credit cards if nothing new comes... (and I don't mean mechs)!

Edited by Dettmam, 10 July 2015 - 01:04 AM.

[Robot Kenshiro]

I don't normally post comments and such but I do understand where you all are coming from. There are alot of us that have spent a lot of money in this game. I for one have spent over $2000 on mechs. And I'm sure alot of other people have too. I understand developers need to get paid too and that without them there would be no MWO. I for one like most most want that single player game mode. Co op campaign modes etc etc. For it would be such a great experience to play through with a group of team mates to actually get some objectives done. All the game modes are running like a skirmish mode, I don't really mind as I am a die hard mechwarrior fan. I do miss the campaigns that were done so many years ago such memories from the old mech games still haunt my hopes of something that can be applied to MWO.
I don't normally complain much if at all. Mech balances never bothered me as I never play CW. I believe CW is rubbish. Planets do what exactly? Hold them for what cause? Do they give you bonuses? Do they increase your salvage potential? Do they increase you earnings in cbills or xp? To me CW is for those who want that COD feeling. I played a few good games of CW. And the wait time is a no go for me. Get a unit most ppl say. Why should I get one? If I did it goes back to that worth of owning those planets and what they do.
Advertising this game. For one they can get rid of ALL the videos they have on the tutorials page. Why? Cos the game doesn't look that anymore. The weapon and collision effects and particle effects are totally different now, which in my personal opinion they looked better back than. AC shots looked better. Gauss looks better. Lasers looked better. Ppcs looked better. Missiles looked better. Changed cos it wasn't simulating the real thing or some BS like that? Please. Your simulating mech warfare. I think the simulation of that is enough to justify the word "simulation". So why take away awesome Sci fi special effects? I rather have them back. I'm sure alot of us would too.
Why do I make such a big point on graphical content. Cos of that word Cryengine. I may not be a graphic artist. Designer. Modeler or whatever. I respect all hard work and designs that go into the mechs and level design. But why isn't the full potential of the engine utilized?
This game looked amazing years ago. But I play cos I do love the game. I love the mechs and their back stories. My continual support will be here.
MWO gamers are a different bunch. They are quite helpful. Some aren't but you get those type of ppl everywhere you go.
Anyways I'm getting carried away here. But I read lots of forum posts and read all the drama and also read the good and funny stuff ppl put on here. And I must say without these ppl giving these feedbacks MWO wouldn't know where to begin to improve. Obviously there are rage posts and complaints about all sorts of things. But at least it's feedback whether good or bad.
My very first super long winded post. Woo!!! See yas all out the battlefield.

[Dettmam]

Robot Kenshiro, on 10 July 2015 - 01:16 AM, said:

I don't normally post comments and such but I do understand where you all are coming from. There are alot of us that have spent a lot of money in this game. I for one have spent over $2000 on mechs. And I'm sure alot of other people have too. I understand developers need to get paid too and that without them there would be no MWO. I for one like most most want that single player game mode. Co op campaign modes etc etc. For it would be such a great experience to play through with a group of team mates to actually get some objectives done. All the game modes are running like a skirmish mode, I don't really mind as I am a die hard mechwarrior fan. I do miss the campaigns that were done so many years ago such memories from the old mech games still haunt my hopes of something that can be applied to MWO.
I don't normally complain much if at all. Mech balances never bothered me as I never play CW. I believe CW is rubbish. Planets do what exactly? Hold them for what cause? Do they give you bonuses? Do they increase your salvage potential? Do they increase you earnings in cbills or xp? To me CW is for those who want that COD feeling. I played a few good games of CW. And the wait time is a no go for me. Get a unit most ppl say. Why should I get one? If I did it goes back to that worth of owning those planets and what they do.
Advertising this game. For one they can get rid of ALL the videos they have on the tutorials page. Why? Cos the game doesn't look that anymore. The weapon and collision effects and particle effects are totally different now, which in my personal opinion they looked better back than. AC shots looked better. Gauss looks better. Lasers looked better. Ppcs looked better. Missiles looked better. Changed cos it wasn't simulating the real thing or some BS like that? Please. Your simulating mech warfare. I think the simulation of that is enough to justify the word "simulation". So why take away awesome Sci fi special effects? I rather have them back. I'm sure alot of us would too.
Why do I make such a big point on graphical content. Cos of that word Cryengine. I may not be a graphic artist. Designer. Modeler or whatever. I respect all hard work and designs that go into the mechs and level design. But why isn't the full potential of the engine utilized?
This game looked amazing years ago. But I play cos I do love the game. I love the mechs and their back stories. My continual support will be here.
MWO gamers are a different bunch. They are quite helpful. Some aren't but you get those type of ppl everywhere you go.
Anyways I'm getting carried away here. But I read lots of forum posts and read all the drama and also read the good and funny stuff ppl put on here. And I must say without these ppl giving these feedbacks MWO wouldn't know where to begin to improve. Obviously there are rage posts and complaints about all sorts of things. But at least it's feedback whether good or bad.
My very first super long winded post. Woo!!! See yas all out the battlefield.

Agreed

[Kiiyor]

Robot Kenshiro, on 10 July 2015 - 01:16 AM, said:

Cos the game doesn't look that anymore. The weapon and collision effects and particle effects are totally different now, which in my personal opinion they looked better back than. AC shots looked better. Gauss looks better. Lasers looked better. Ppcs looked better. Missiles looked better. Changed cos it wasn't simulating the real thing or some BS like that? Please. Your simulating mech warfare. I think the simulation of that is enough to justify the word "simulation". So why take away awesome Sci fi special effects? I rather have them back. I'm sure alot of us would too.
Why do I make such a big point on graphical content. Cos of that word Cryengine. I may not be a graphic artist. Designer. Modeler or whatever. I respect all hard work and designs that go into the mechs and level design. But why isn't the full potential of the engine utilized?
This game looked amazing years ago. But I play cos I do love the game.

Many, many sacrifices were made to get 12vs12 up and running. Every item sacrificed in the name of performance can be laid at the feet of that particular implementation.

I prefer having 12 mechs to 8, but I would like to see some of the polish return eventually.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Development Focus? You cannot know how badly I wish it was on a PVE campaign even as good as Armored Warfare has right now, and they have it in closed beta and it was just loads of fun, even if repetitive, it was fun.

Doing that in Mechs......it would just be a blast. I would have reason to get a AWS, Shadow Cat, Highlander, put my AS7S and CN-AH back together. Nab up my VTR9 again and maybe dork with an Orion, as well as a DIre Wolf.

[Robot Kenshiro]

I only started playing last year. So never experienced the 8 man. But I I Would Rather 12 over the 8. And yes that polished look would be great. Even if it was an option to have on or off but I guess that would require a lot of work to implement. The new graphics overhaul for river city looks good. The grass looks alot better than other maps. And the map is fantastic. Alot of room and cover. I don't log into the game much now but had a chance to play the game today so I liked what I saw. More of that is most welcome.

[Anarcho]

I feel the pain from OP. You know what they could do? Open the game development to the comunity! There is a bunch of talented kids who would have FUN maiing maps, skins and other cool stuff for free. Let then submit their creations to PGI, run the user created content on the test server for a while, and if the comunity likes it, bring it to the game!
Doom 4 is coming with amazing tools to enable the community create maps and game modes, something like that takes the workload from PGIs back and let the fans go wild!

[Odanan]

As someone said, "New mechs make money, new maps and game modes don't."

PGI needs to release new mechs to keep the development active. That constant flow of money is what pays servers and the salary of the programmers, artists, PGI employees and even the rent of the office.

If you think PGI is increasing the number of the released mechs now, you are mistaken. I'm here since the beginning, and there was a time we had a new mech every month. The only difference now is that the mechs are coming grouped in packs and sold in pre-order. I have no problem with that.

But I understand your feelings. Playing the same game modes over and over gets boring. I also bought at least one mech of almost every pack (only skipped the Project Phoenix, and this is because of two certain PR fiascos that happened that time) and even with my new shinny mechs Executioner and Ebon Jaguar good to go, I mostly return to the game not because of the game itself, but because of the friends I made here, who I enjoy playing with.

Yes, MWO needs new, fresh game modes. CW needs to really reward players with something (I mean, really something, like exclusive faction paintjobs and mech variants), otherwise people won't play it (and less people playing = long waiting times = even less people playing = even longer waiting times).

The new River City is terrific, but new or remade maps, alone, won't keep players in MWO for years.

We need Steam (and consequently a lot of new players), yes, but before that we need some good in-game tutorials (missions) that teach not only to pilot, but to use all of the mech's commands and to fight. No point in getting a lot of new players if they don't stay. So, we desperately need AI.

Singleplayer (or even better, co-op) missions would be great for introducing new players, because starting against veterans is brutal. MWO is no casual game and many newbies will feel frustrated after being stomped in all their first matches. Well, even old players need sometime to just launch a game to "relax" punching some AI, instead of facing the lottery of a public match.

PGI, it's time to get your AI up and running. In my humble opinion, AI is more important now for MWO than CW phase X or even Solaris.

Give us some simple random mission generator, with PvE missions like "destroy the enemy base", "destroy all enemies", "capture all control points", "defend the base", etc. and it will revitalize the game. You don't need to make new maps for this: you can use the current maps. Heck, even a "simulator" like the existing in MW2, MW3 and MW4 would be great (choose the map, your mech, the enemies and go). Sure, for stimulating people to still play "real" multiplayer, you could give smaller C-Bills and XP rewards for PvE.

A full campaign would be amazing (Russ said something is planned for 2016), but that will take time. Could you give us something simpler now, still in 2015?

Edited by Odanan, 10 July 2015 - 09:23 AM.

[Alistair Winter]

There are too many unknown variables for most of us to say anything about MWO's business strategy, I think. Even if you have intimate knowledge of the F2P business - which, let's face it, most of us don't - there's a lot of information we don't have, which makes it hard to be bombastic about PGI's choices. You may have read about F2P games on some blog, you may have played some F2P games, but it doesn't make you an expert. Running a gaming company with 50 employees is a big deal.

To be specific, we just don't know too much about how many people are playing, how many of those are paying customers, what group of players bring in the biggest income and we know close to zero about PGI's expenditures. We don't know how many people are working on the different areas of the game and we don't know how expensive it is to make new mechs at this point. They've been making mechs for 3 years. The process is probably pretty streamlined and efficient by now, from the concept stage to the finished product. But whenever they tackle a new problem, like PVE or Solaris, it's going to be less cost-effective simply because they haven't done it before and new and unknown problems and challenges pop up as they go along. Which makes it harder to plan and harder to estimate costs.

I criticize PGI a lot for the game mechanics, such as the game modes, the skill tree, the lack of role warfare, etc. But I wouldn't presume to tell them about what kind of business model they should be using or what kind of content should be a priority. I'm not an economist, I'm not the president of a huge gaming company and I have no idea how massive multiplayer games like MWO are actually made behind the scenes, with all the coding involved.

I can just speak for myself as a consumer. As a consumer, I do agree that my will to pay for more mechs is falling sharply because of the slow rate that new content is being delivered. I never even really considered buying any Origin mechs and I don't own any Resistance mechs either. But for all I know, PGI's current path may be the least of all evils, and the rate of new mechs being sold may be the only thing that allows them to keep investing heavily in the game. Who knows?

TL;DR - I may boldly say that MGs should do more damage or that the new dynamic geometry sucks, but I wouldn't presume to say much about PGI's business strategy. The number of people in my employ is exactly zero, as it has always been. I can barely do my taxes, let alone run a huge independent gaming company.

[Dettmam]

Anarcho, on 10 July 2015 - 03:07 AM, said:

I feel the pain from OP. You know what they could do? Open the game development to the comunity! There is a bunch of talented kids who would have FUN maiing maps, skins and other cool stuff for free. Let then submit their creations to PGI, run the user created content on the test server for a while, and if the comunity likes it, bring it to the game!
Doom 4 is coming with amazing tools to enable the community create maps and game modes, something like that takes the workload from PGIs back and let the fans go wild!

Agreed, Anarcho... PGI is missing a lot of very good free man power!

[Dettmam]

Odanan, on 10 July 2015 - 09:13 AM, said:

As someone said, "New mechs make money, new maps and game modes don't."

PGI needs to release new mechs to keep the development active. That constant flow of money is what pays servers and the salary of the programmers, artists, PGI employees and even the rent of the office.

If you think PGI is increasing the number of the released mechs now, you are mistaken. I'm here since the beginning, and there was a time we had a new mech every month. The only difference now is that the mechs are coming grouped in packs and sold in pre-order. I have no problem with that.

But I understand your feelings. Playing the same game modes over and over gets boring. I also bought at least one mech of almost every pack (only skipped the Project Phoenix, and this is because of two certain PR fiascos that happened that time) and even with my new shinny mechs Executioner and Ebon Jaguar good to go, I mostly return to the game not because of the game itself, but because of the friends I made here, who I enjoy playing with.

Yes, MWO needs new, fresh game modes. CW needs to really reward players with something (I mean, really something, like exclusive faction paintjobs and mech variants), otherwise people won't play it (and less people playing = long waiting times = even less people playing = even longer waiting times).

The new River City is terrific, but new or remade maps, alone, won't keep players in MWO for years.

We need Steam (and consequently a lot of new players), yes, but before that we need some good in-game tutorials (missions) that teach not only to pilot, but to use all of the mech's commands and to fight. No point in getting a lot of new players if they don't stay. So, we desperately need AI.

Singleplayer (or even better, co-op) missions would be great for introducing new players, because starting against veterans is brutal. MWO is no casual game and many newbies will feel frustrated after being stomped in all their first matches. Well, even old players need sometime to just launch a game to "relax" punching some AI, instead of facing the lottery of a public match.

PGI, it's time to get your AI up and running. In my humble opinion, AI is more important now for MWO than CW phase X or even Solaris.

Give us some simple random mission generator, with PvE missions like "destroy the enemy base", "destroy all enemies", "capture all control points", "defend the base", etc. and it will revitalize the game. You don't need to make new maps for this: you can use the current maps. Heck, even a "simulator" like the existing in MW2, MW3 and MW4 would be great (choose the map, your mech, the enemies and go). Sure, for stimulating people to still play "real" multiplayer, you could give smaller C-Bills and XP rewards for PvE.

A full campaign would be amazing (Russ said something is planned for 2016), but that will take time. Could you give us something simpler now, still in 2015?

Odanan, I think you realy got my meaning!