65 replies to this topic

[Joseph Mallan]

pyrocomp, on 14 July 2015 - 04:28 AM, said:

This looks to be one half to one third of weidht of what it should have been in properly crude steel of it's time. plus, no frenzy hits, some evasion and bloking also included. You didn't actualy fence with that log, did you?

Fence? Dude I just swing it at trees and stuff I don't mind breaking!

[Bishop Steiner]

Summon3r, on 13 July 2015 - 10:07 PM, said:

should a stock mech in the game not be able to alpha once from zero heat and not shut down?

for example a WHK-PRIME minus its lrm10 cannot alpha its 4 erppc, does that not seem wrong?

Depends on the mech, the build and the number of heat sinks.

A stock AWS 8Q, doing a pull alpha at flank speed, generates 33 heat. It has 28 heat sinks to dissipate that. Thus, it accrues a mere 5 pts of waste heat, barely a blip on the scale.

The issue is?

I alpha my stock Summoner Prime....I make... 22 heat? And have the 14 DHS, for 25.6 heat dissipation. Why should this shut me down?

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 14 July 2015 - 06:12 AM.

[Throat Punch]

Man, I used to love throwing an alpha strike (minus the useless flamer, so i guess not a true alpha) out in my Warhawk C. 2 large pulse, 2 erppc, AND a targeting computer?!. Played it in conjunction with Mechwarrior RPG so you had a good pilot with low rolls in it. Plus the sucker was almost heat neutral. You could basically fire all 4 major weapons every round without worry. God, sometimes I wish you could do that cheese in MWO. Pew pew pew pew. "Die, stravag freebirth scum, die!" So much fun.

Anyone want to play megamek? I so miss TT now....

[Khobai]

Quote

also tt has twice as less armor levels..

TT also had random hit locations though. so even though it had half as much armor mechs could still take much more of a beating because arms/legs absorbed half the hits. you only had a 20% chance of getting hit in the CT in tabletop where in MWO people always aim for center torso.

double armor actually wasnt enough to fully cancel out the damage amplification caused by pinpoint convergence and aiming. wed need at least double armor and triple structure to cancel it out probably.

triple structure would also help solve the problem of critical hits not mattering very much because of how fast internal structure gets destroyed.

Edited by Khobai, 14 July 2015 - 06:40 AM.

[Chuck Jager]

Friends dont let friends play stock mechs. They are the source for most of my distaste for people quoting lore as a real tool for balance in the online version of this game. Things that happen in TT should stay in TT.

[Bishop Steiner]

Chuck YeaGurr, on 14 July 2015 - 06:52 AM, said:

Friends dont let friends play stock mechs. They are the source for most of my distaste for people quoting lore as a real tool for balance in the online version of this game. Things that happen in TT should stay in TT.

you should try them more often. Not always good, in fact, often bad. Makes a nice challenge. Yes, I can get 1000 dmg and 5 kills in my minmax MetaTimby....but it's much more satisfying to get 500 dmg and 2 -3 kills in my SMN-Prime, stock.

Because I actually have to TRY, to succeed.

[Summon3r]

Bishop Steiner, on 14 July 2015 - 06:11 AM, said:

Depends on the mech, the build and the number of heat sinks.

A stock AWS 8Q, doing a pull alpha at flank speed, generates 33 heat. It has 28 heat sinks to dissipate that. Thus, it accrues a mere 5 pts of waste heat, barely a blip on the scale.

The issue is?

I alpha my stock Summoner Prime....I make... 22 heat? And have the 14 DHS, for 25.6 heat dissipation. Why should this shut me down?

i dont fully understand what you mean, there is no way you can alpha a SMN-PRIME and be even close to shut down? are you reffering to TT? i dont know TT very well just what ive read in b-tech books and the mw games.

regardless it would be nice if we could have a far more immersive heat scale such HUD blurring out mech performance drops and so on as you get closer to max heat thresh hold

[MeiSooHaityu]

Khobai, on 14 July 2015 - 06:32 AM, said:

TT also had random hit locations though...

A Mech Pilot in TT


What are you talking about sir. All my weapons clearly hit all of his center torsos I was aiming at.

Edited by MeiSooHaityu, 14 July 2015 - 07:23 AM.

[Summon3r]

MeiSooHaityu, on 14 July 2015 - 07:22 AM, said:

A Mech Pilot in TT


What are you talking about sir. All my weapons clearly hit all of his center torsos I was aiming at.

i hope you are reffering to current hit reg lol

[MeiSooHaityu]

Summon3r, on 14 July 2015 - 07:31 AM, said:

i hope you are reffering to current hit reg lol

I just meant how TT had weapon hits as random dice rolls. I just thought, how would weapons hit randomly all over the darn place if TT was in real life, so I posted that as a joke .

But yes...yes I could see that being just as accurate for hitreg .

[Wronka]

Who runs a stock mech anyway, whats it matter if it can alpha strike or not. Little to no mechs come with a good build out of the box.

[Summon3r]

Wronka, on 14 July 2015 - 07:42 AM, said:

Who runs a stock mech anyway, whats it matter if it can alpha strike or not. Little to no mechs come with a good build out of the box.

people that are bored of the ultra boring meta-cheese? i guess technically a WHK-PRIME with 4 erppc isnt stock as its missing its lrm10 for more DHS, but as determined in previous posts it was never intended to alpha them all

[Joseph Mallan]

TT Hits:
3+5 = 8 2+2 = 4 3+1 = 4 1+6 = 7 1+6 = 7 2+4 = 6 1+6 = 7 6+2 = 8 6+1 = 7 6+1 = 7 2+1 = 3 2+5 = 7 6+5 = 11 1+2 = 3 4+5 = 9 3+6 = 9 3+1 = 4 6+1 = 7 6+3 = 9 2+3 = 5 5+2 = 7 6+1 = 7 2+5 = 7 4+1 = 5 5+2 = 7 4+2 = 6 4+6 = 10 2+4 = 6 3+3 = 6

17 of 29 (59%) into 3 torso locations(37.5% of possible for front) using a very random number generator.

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 14 July 2015 - 08:01 AM.

[Lightfoot]

Actually no. Canon is that it could not fire all four at once, but could fire all four by pairing them or single firing.

MWO's DHS 1.4 holds the Warhawk back because even with the mech mastered the non-engine heatsinks are only providing 1.6 DHS after the 16th or 17th heatsink. Plus the heatsinks are not refreshing at 2x normal speed like all the other weapons especially the cool running ballistics which refresh at 2x and are cooled in almost any situation/loadout by 12 DHS.

[Bishop Steiner]

Summon3r, on 14 July 2015 - 07:13 AM, said:

i dont fully understand what you mean, there is no way you can alpha a SMN-PRIME and be even close to shut down? are you reffering to TT? i dont know TT very well just what ive read in b-tech books and the mw games.

regardless it would be nice if we could have a far more immersive heat scale such HUD blurring out mech performance drops and so on as you get closer to max heat thresh hold

I'm simply pointing out not all "Alpha Strikes" are created equal. An alpha strike simply refers to firing your entire armament at once.

[Joseph Mallan]

Lightfoot, on 14 July 2015 - 08:12 AM, said:

Actually no. Canon is that it could not fire all four at once without building up a lot of heat., but could fire all four by pairing them or single firing.

MWO's DHS 1.4 holds the Warhawk back because even with the mech mastered the non-engine heatsinks are only providing 1.6 DHS after the 16th or 17th heatsink. Plus the heatsinks are not refreshing at 2x normal speed like all the other weapons especially the cool running ballistics which refresh at 2x and are cooled in almost any situation/loadout by 12 DHS.

FTFY

[Paigan]

Joseph Mallan, on 14 July 2015 - 08:21 AM, said:

FTFY

Please stop editing other people's posts with what you MEAN they should have meant.
You did that with my post somewhere else and it is (objectively) very arrogant and rude.

Write what you mean in your post, not in some hardly noticeable editing of someone else's.

[One Medic Army]

Joseph Mallan, on 14 July 2015 - 01:08 AM, said:

No. The whole turn was 10 seconds One. You and your enemy had 10 seconds to Run, find a target, shoot, AND cool down. Also don't tell me how I fired my Weapons. I distinctly said I am firing all "this". Then threw the dice. I didn't say, I will fire this, then this, then this. everything on one trigger.

I stand by what I said.

If you fired all of your weapons within a 10 second period, you "alpha struck" as far as TT was concerned.

[Mister Blastman]

One Medic Army, on 13 July 2015 - 10:10 PM, said:

In TT you alpha'd in a stock war hawk and had a good chance of blowing up your LRM ammo.

Also in TT "alpha striking" was firing all weapons over a period of 10 seconds, not all at once.

Yes. The rate of fire in this game is way too high! Maximum heat needs to be halved, too.

So what if fights take longer. Longer fights will encourage more movement and less deathball hide and poke.

Edited by Mister Blastman, 14 July 2015 - 08:58 AM.

[Throat Punch]

One Medic Army, on 14 July 2015 - 08:39 AM, said:

I stand by what I said.

If you fired all of your weapons within a 10 second period, you "alpha struck" as far as TT was concerned.

Yep. If all weapons were fired in a turn you alpha struck. That's why i said in my crazy example with the Warhawk C that it wasn't a true alpha because i didn't fire the flamer too. Alpha striking denotes an all out attack using everything you have available, usually out of desperation.

Edited by Mors Draco, 14 July 2015 - 08:47 AM.