17 replies to this topic

[Tamago Ausf F2]

i see ECM nerf plan. i think ECM-Counter module very easy solve.

[ShadowWolf Kell]

MecatamaMk2, on 18 July 2015 - 10:42 PM, said:

i see ECM nerf plan. i think ECM-Counter module very easy solve.

It's already in game. It's called Beagle Active Probe.

[Escef]

MecatamaMk2, on 18 July 2015 - 10:42 PM, said:

i see ECM nerf plan. i think ECM-Counter module very easy solve.

You can already set your ECM in counter mode either using the J key or the arrow keys (to select ECM from the equipment in your weapons list) and right-control.

[Speedy Plysitkos]

i think, those ECM nerfer, are LURMERS, right ?

[Tamago Ausf F2]

ShadowWolf Kell, on 18 July 2015 - 10:52 PM, said:

It's already in game. It's called Beagle Active Probe.

Not enough. it's mean perfect counter module. is it not in core rule?

[Lightfoot]

In Battle Tech ECCM is called BAP, but PGI has not enabled it or passive sensor modes to do what they are supposed to. BAP has some minor ECM countering ability, but not enough to really count or compare to canon Battle Tech.

[Nathan Foxbane]

It would be nice if they took the counter feature off ECM, it would make the equipment itself less versatile, and then AP could be made a more powerful counter. Granted, it still means the equipment works backwards as ECM is supposed to be the counter for both AP and Artemis.

[Escef]

Lightfoot, on 19 July 2015 - 08:33 PM, said:

In Battle Tech ECCM is called BAP, ...

Why is it every time I see you talking about TT rules you get it wrong?

Total Warfare, pg. 129: "An active probe only affects game play if players are using the Hidden Units rules from the Creating Scenarios section (see p. 256). Otherwise, the active probe has no effect, though its slot can soak up a critical hit (such a critical hit has no effect)."

TRO2750, pg. 10: "A 'Mech equipped with a Beagle Active Probe automatically gives a BattleForce lance an Active
Electronic Probe chit . On the BattleTech map, a 'Mech so equipped will detect any hidden 'Mech or vehicle (not infantry) if it moves within four hexes of the unit's location, and would have a valid LOS to the hex in which the unit is hiding."

So, as we can see, Active Probes do very little counteract the functions of ECM.

ECCM in Battletech is an optional rule that lets you swap your ECM into an ECM-canceling mode. BAP does not cancel ECM

[ice trey]

In Tabletop, BAP is like adding a second, more intense scan to your sensors. It really doesn't serve any job in a normal pick-up game, but in the event that you're using special game rules for hidden units, it becomes very effective, extending how far away you have to be from a hidden unit in order to pick it up on radar. It's one of the few times where scout-mechs are actually able to scout.

For ECCM, it's advanced rules only, but you basically just toggle your ECM to ECCM mode. Of course, I've never used those rules, because if you're pen & papering a larger-scale game, tracking how many plus/minus ECM points on a given mech can bog things down.

I don't think what we need is escalation... what we need is some dialing back.

[Tamago Ausf F2]

ShadowWolf Kell, on 18 July 2015 - 10:52 PM, said:

It's already in game. It's called Beagle Active Probe.

In descript. sensor boost only. Not in descript ECCM function.
'can detect shutdown mech' is it ECM same shutdown mech?

Edited by MecatamaMk2, 22 July 2015 - 03:57 PM.

[Escef]

MecatamaMk2, on 22 July 2015 - 03:55 PM, said:

In descript. sensor boost only. Not in descript ECCM function.
'can detect shutdown mech' is it ECM same shutdown mech?

Google translate is not your friend.

[Lyoto Machida]

Escef, on 22 July 2015 - 04:36 PM, said:

Google translate is not your friend.

Don't be dense...you know what he's saying.

TT rules description says BAP can detect shutdown mechs, not counter ECM. He's asking if ECM mechs count as shutdown mechs by PGI's definition, since BAP counters ECM (which it shouldn't by TT standards).

[Escef]

Lyoto Machida, on 22 July 2015 - 06:17 PM, said:

Don't be dense...

Maybe he should not be dense and ask his question on the section of the boards that's in his language? Or at least in one he's conversant in? We have German, Russian, French, Spanish, Italian, Polish, Portuguese, Japanese, and it looks like one or two others. And most of them with activity within the past 24 hours, so it isn't like they're dead sections of the boards.

[Tamago Ausf F2]

Escef, on 22 July 2015 - 06:27 PM, said:

Maybe he should not be dense and ask his question on the section of the boards that's in his language? Or at least in one he's conversant in? We have German, Russian, French, Spanish, Italian, Polish, Portuguese, Japanese, and it looks like one or two others. And most of them with activity within the past 24 hours, so it isn't like they're dead sections of the boards.

others language. so. u try it. i try this

[DarkonFullPower]

ShadowWolf Kell, on 18 July 2015 - 10:52 PM, said:

It's already in game. It's called Beagle Active Probe.

You do know that ECM is supposed to counter BAP right? But it doesn't matter because
"this is ONLINE, NOT BOARD. for balance. corerule ignore." (sic)

Edited by DarkonFullPower, 09 August 2015 - 04:53 PM.

[Khobai]

Quote

You do know that ECM is supposed to counter BAP right?

BAP should work a lot differently than how it does.

1) BAP should make it easier to detect ECM mechs at long range
2) ECM should counter BAP at short range
3) BAP should give you 360 degree targeting for enemies within 120m and let you detect enemies within 120m through walls/terrain.
4) BAP should let you drop two stationary sensor probes per game (with a 30-45s duration)

Edited by Khobai, 09 August 2015 - 05:01 PM.

[Coralld]

Problem isant that we don't have enough counters to ECM, the problem is that ECM in MWO goes far beyond what it does in lore and is thus to strong.

Current ECM as it is in MWO is like Angel ECM + Null Sig Armor but with out being able to be hidden from thermal as well as the fact there is no drawbacks (Which its suppose to take up 12 crit slots and reducing your heat efficiency while active).

How ECM should be in MWO is to increase missile lock on time, increase LRM spread, counters Artemis, and prevent info sharing between enemy team mates. However, as long as you have LOS on an ECM mech you should be able to target it and lock it with LRMs... Streaks and LRMs only don't work when the enemy ECM gets to close.

Edited by Coralld, 09 August 2015 - 08:46 PM.

[Weeny Machine]

Lightfoot, on 19 July 2015 - 08:33 PM, said:

In Battle Tech ECCM is called BAP

And "Null Signature System", "Chameleon Light Polarisation Shield", "Angel ECM", "ECM", "Void Signature System" from the TT is called "ECM" in MWO

Edited by Bush Hopper, 10 August 2015 - 02:39 AM.