749 replies to this topic

[Hawk819]

I read that HG filed suit against Hasbro. Due to the fact that Hasbro made a Transformer called Jetfire, that resembled the Super Veritech VF-1S.

[Alan Davion]

Sereglach, on 25 July 2015 - 09:53 AM, said:

I'm surprised it came to such a low-profile ending. However, that also explains why it wasn't plastered all over the news, because it really doesn't create any solid precedents; and it didn't really come to a decisive ending.

The dual dismissal (where both parties agreed to just drop the issue), while squashing Harmony Gold in that instance, still leaves them open to come after Catalyst on the unseen issue; because they never reached a court room. So, unfortunately, the outcome of a Catalyst vs. Harmony Gold suit is still up in the air, if/when anything is filed.

This is unfortunately true.

Still, you wouldn't think CGL would be doing this if they hadn't found some loophole or other precedent that they think could let them skate through, or maybe they just figured it was time to give HG the old what-for and get them to bug out.

Only the coming weeks will tell.

EDIT: Seriously PGI? I can't say "bugger" and "off" in the same sentence?

Edited by Alan Davion, 25 July 2015 - 09:58 AM.

[Sereglach]

Alan Davion, on 25 July 2015 - 09:57 AM, said:

This is unfortunately true.

Still, you wouldn't think CGL would be doing this if they hadn't found some loophole or other precedent that they think could let them skate through, or maybe they just figured it was time to give HG the old what-for and get them to bug out.

Only the coming weeks will tell.

EDIT: Seriously PGI? I can't say "bugger" and "off" in the same sentence?

You'd think so. I seriously hope Catalyst has some ace up their sleeve. Otherwise you're right, and only time will tell.

[stjobe]

Since there's no background to the dual dismissal, it could as well be that Hasbro paid HG enough to make them drop the suit - which of course means they'll go after Catalyst guns blazing.

But it could also be that Hasbro's lawyers showed HG exactly how much trying take a $4 billion yearly revenue multinational to court would cost HG - which would mean HG could still go after Catalyst guns blazing.

Or, and here's what I'm hoping, Hasbro's lawyers looked into HGs claims to Macross, found out that HG hasn't a leg to stand on, and said "drop it, or we'll sue YOU out of existence" - in which case Catalyst might be safe.

[Alan Davion]

stjobe, on 25 July 2015 - 10:15 AM, said:

Since there's no background to the dual dismissal, it could as well be that Hasbro paid HG enough to make them drop the suit - which of course means they'll go after Catalyst guns blazing.

But it could also be that Hasbro's lawyers showed HG exactly how much trying take a $4 billion yearly revenue multinational to court would cost HG - which would mean HG could still go after Catalyst guns blazing.

Or, and here's what I'm hoping, Hasbro's lawyers looked into HGs claims to Macross, found out that HG hasn't a leg to stand on, and said "drop it, or we'll sue YOU out of existence" - in which case Catalyst might be safe.

Good god I hope so. Someone certainly needs to send HG up the river without a paddle.

[Sentinel373]

Glad you guys like the warhammer. I made the 3D model of that for the miniature production.
and i'm contracted to do several more for this project for CGL.

As some of you know i got into battletech mini's back in 2013 when i started making miniatures of the MWO designs. and I was the later scouted by CGL and Ironwind metals. MWO brought me back to battletech so in a way PGI is indirectly responsible for this project.

P.S. I saw some confusion earlier in this thread about who designed the IO covers battlemaster. That was done by Alex Iglesias. The cover for the combat manual merc was done by Anthony Scroggins AKA Shimmering sword. including all the designs on the cover were also done by him. I worked closely with Anthony when he was doing the cover and he used my at the time partially completed Warhammer model for the cover.

Still i hope you guys enjoy and i look forward to making many more of these. Classics are back!

Edited by Sentinel373, 25 July 2015 - 10:21 AM.

[NocturnalBeast]

stjobe, on 25 July 2015 - 10:15 AM, said:

Since there's no background to the dual dismissal, it could as well be that Hasbro paid HG enough to make them drop the suit - which of course means they'll go after Catalyst guns blazing.

But it could also be that Hasbro's lawyers showed HG exactly how much trying take a $4 billion yearly revenue multinational to court would cost HG - which would mean HG could still go after Catalyst guns blazing.

Or, and here's what I'm hoping, Hasbro's lawyers looked into HGs claims to Macross, found out that HG hasn't a leg to stand on, and said "drop it, or we'll sue YOU out of existence" - in which case Catalyst might be safe.

According to bg.battletech, these mechs are the reimagined versions, so they may be safe. Quote from bg.battletech:


" REIMAGINING THE CLASSICS

The re-designing of the unseen BattleMechs that was accomplished as part of Project Phoenix was the right option at that time. It ensured those BattleMechs were usable by the community in both Technical Readouts and miniatures form as we thoroughly explored the unfolding plot lines of the Jihad Era.

However, as FanPro—and then Catalyst—continued to exploring the full breadth of theBattleTech history in Historical, Era and Field Manual sourcebooks, it became more apparent that the solution that worked so well for post-3067 left the ’Mech berths empty for previous time periods, especially the Succession Wars. After years of weighing the pros and cons, we’ve made the decision to not just dip our toes in the pool, but to leap into the deep end: straight out of the DropShips into a hot LZ!

We’ve spent the last half-year re-imagining the unseen BattleMechs that will always be one of the hallmarks of BattleTech. Our goal during all of this remains to merge 21st Century sensibilities (aka legal issues) with the classic lines that make those ’Mechs so near and dear to all of us."

Edited by Ed Steele, 25 July 2015 - 10:27 AM.

[Alan Davion]

Hawk819, on 25 July 2015 - 09:56 AM, said:

I read that HG filed suit against Hasbro. Due to the fact that Hasbro made a Transformer called Jetfire, that resembled the Super Veritech VF-1S.

Back during the original Hasbro Transformers G1 toy run, Jetfire basically was the Super VF-1S toy, recolored slightly. I don't know if anything happened with that way back in the day.

HG did file suit against Hasbro over a more recent version, in which it was essentially just a GI JOE F-14 Sky Striker fitted an extra booster thing between the tail rudders, and called Jetfire. Pretty sure this thing couldn't transform though... And when you really looked at the actual toy, the booster portion was so ridiculously small so as not to resemble the Super Valkyrie boosters in any but the most miniscule sense.

HG just went ape over nothing basically, because that's all they've done for the last 20 years, keeping a stranglehold on Robotech, trying to extend that to encompass all of Macross in its entirety. It has to come back to bite them in the ass at some point.

[NocturnalBeast]

Alan Davion, on 25 July 2015 - 10:23 AM, said:

Back during the original Hasbro Transformers G1 toy run, Jetfire basically was the Super VF-1S toy, recolored slightly. I don't know if anything happened with that way back in the day.

HG did file suit against Hasbro over a more recent version, in which it was essentially just a GI JOE F-14 Sky Striker fitted an extra booster thing between the tail rudders, and called Jetfire. Pretty sure this thing couldn't transform though... And when you really looked at the actual toy, the booster portion was so ridiculously small so as not to resemble the Super Valkyrie boosters in any but the most miniscule sense.

HG just went ape over nothing basically, because that's all they've done for the last 20 years, keeping a stranglehold on Robotech, trying to extend that to encompass all of Macross in its entirety. It has to come back to bite them in the ass at some point.

I used to own Jetfire as a kid and I bought it because it looked like a Veritech from Robotech (which was on TV at the time), wish I could find it.

Edited by Ed Steele, 25 July 2015 - 10:29 AM.

[DAYLEET]

Hawk819, on 25 July 2015 - 09:56 AM, said:

I read that HG filed suit against Hasbro. Due to the fact that Hasbro made a Transformer called Jetfire, that resembled the Super Veritech VF-1S.

DUDE i had that thing when i was a kid, a friend borrowed it and broke it and then kept telling me it was always broken. How can someone ******* lie to my face like that i will never understand.

[BarHaid]

Ed Steele, on 25 July 2015 - 10:29 AM, said:

I used to own Jetfire as a kid and I bought it because it looked like a Veritech from Robotech (which was on TV at the time), wish I could find it.

I still have mine. And yes, the ONLY reason I bought it was because it IS a Super Veritech. - complete with detachable armor and UN Spacy logo. They just threw on an Autobot logo also and said "Gud enuf!".

[Alan Davion]

Ed Steele, on 25 July 2015 - 10:29 AM, said:

I used to own Jetfire as a kid and I bought it because it looked like a Veritech from Robotech (which was on TV at the time), wish I could find it.

DAYLEET, on 25 July 2015 - 10:39 AM, said:

DUDE i had that thing when i was a kid, a friend borrowed it and broke it and then kept telling me it was always broken. How can someone ******* lie to my face like that i will never understand.

ebay is your friend. They've got plenty of G1 Jetfire from as little as $20... EDIT: Scratch that... All the way up to $2,200.

Edited by Alan Davion, 25 July 2015 - 11:03 AM.

[C E Dwyer]

Ed Steele, on 25 July 2015 - 10:23 AM, said:

According to bg.battletech, these mechs are the reimagined versions, so they may be safe. Quote from bg.battletech:


" REIMAGINING THE CLASSICS

The re-designing of the unseen BattleMechs that was accomplished as part of Project Phoenix was the right option at that time. It ensured those BattleMechs were usable by the community in both Technical Readouts and miniatures form as we thoroughly explored the unfolding plot lines of the Jihad Era.

However, as FanPro—and then Catalyst—continued to exploring the full breadth of theBattleTech history in Historical, Era and Field Manual sourcebooks, it became more apparent that the solution that worked so well for post-3067 left the ’Mech berths empty for previous time periods, especially the Succession Wars. After years of weighing the pros and cons, we’ve made the decision to not just dip our toes in the pool, but to leap into the deep end: straight out of the DropShips into a hot LZ!

We’ve spent the last half-year re-imagining the unseen BattleMechs that will always be one of the hallmarks of BattleTech. Our goal during all of this remains to merge 21st Century sensibilities (aka legal issues) with the classic lines that make those ’Mechs so near and dear to all of us."

IP rights also include the words distinct likeness.

What I've seen so far easily falls into that category.

I hope I'm wrong, but I think HG will jump all over this, and then Catalysts naivety will bite them on the ass, as not only will they have worked and spent money in this, but HG will get the profit from it, and the battletech fans will, be pissed at them for getting every ones hopes up.

Maybe there is actually some cunning plan, maybe they have already cut a deal with HG behind the scene's, which would also be an unwise choice, if it wasn't announced.

I would readily throw money at unseen if they were to look like what I've seen, but I think its far to close, never the less the Coffee and popcorn are on stand by

And my wallet after I see PGI's 3D models

Edited by Cathy, 25 July 2015 - 11:14 AM.

[Tordin]

Awesome news! Now I hope it will come to pass and make everyone happy, us the fans, PGI, MS, Catalyst, etc. Even the dreaded H.G with their nosy lawyer eyes and all..

[NocturnalBeast]

DAYLEET, on 25 July 2015 - 10:39 AM, said:

DUDE i had that thing when i was a kid, a friend borrowed it and broke it and then kept telling me it was always broken. How can someone ******* lie to my face like that i will never understand.

Human nature, learn to accept it.

Alan Davion, on 25 July 2015 - 11:00 AM, said:

ebay is your friend. They've got plenty of G1 Jetfire from as little as $20... EDIT: Scratch that... All the way up to $2,200.

LOL, I already spend too much on pixel mechs in MWO! If I had a spare $2200, I would put a down payment on a new car or something.

[kosmos1214]

0bsidion, on 24 July 2015 - 07:46 AM, said:

I don't know, but man, it's always nice to see the Marauder again

Tennex, on 24 July 2015 - 07:48 AM, said:

I personally don't mind this version

i like shimering sword work to it looks like it should buts far enough away that hg cant jump on it to bad

Bishop Steiner, on 24 July 2015 - 07:55 AM, said:

I'm...gonna cry, looking at the WHM.

Amazing how Unseen close they are..... I always went further away because HG boogeyman. Wonder what has changed?

Kiiyor, on 24 July 2015 - 08:05 AM, said:

*deep breath*

HG are probably assembling their cadre of lawyers, feeding them with the souls of particularly cute puppies after bathing them in the blood of the innocent, so that their dark lord l̝͈͡a̶ẉ͈̮̻͙̬̰s̤̥͉u̟̩i̶̲t̳̺̠̦̭͜ can be awoken and shepherded into battle to wring every last penny out of everyone using a license they probably don't have a claim to anyway.

i seem to remember HG losing a lawsuit that pretty much meant that they didnt own the entirety of macross out side of japan witch would tend to weaken there universal {LT-MOB-25} block i dont know the details though

0bsidion, on 24 July 2015 - 09:04 AM, said:

I think Alex did fine with his Battlemaster, but it just isn't the Battlemaster. And I seriously doubt CGL would have moved forward with this if they didn't have a leg to stand on. I also doubt they all just lost their marbles and decided litigation sounds like a great way to pass the time. Either they negotiated some deal or found a loophole.

1453 R, on 24 July 2015 - 11:07 AM, said:

There's a difference between licensing movie rights that will reinforce the strength of your franchise, and thus the strength of your original copywrong, to a megagagglegigacorp that could armwrestle you into the ground with their toes, and finally losing a legal battle against the current holders of an IP Harmony Gold has been trying to sabotage, strangle, and otherwise kill off for decades.

Nobody says no to Sony. I'm absolutely certain HG is going to do everything in its power to say no to CGL. It'll be interesting to see whether that original beyond-messed-up copywrong of HG's has eroded enough by now that CGL can finally beat it and get their blasted 'Mechs back.

Me? I'm hopeful. Copyright cases have been getting more and more heated as of recent times, with more public pressure being applied against obviously criminal misapplication of copywrong law (and by 'criminal' I mean 'offensive to any right-thinking individual', not legally criminal). Harmony Gold's been polluting the Robotech franchise for, what? Forty years now? They've been damaging BattleTech's business for just as long. It's time and more than time that somebody finally laid knuckle to HG's jaw and said "KNOCK THIS HORSE P!SS OFF AND PLAY FAIR ALREADY."

I am eagerly awaiting the courts' decisions and hoping they will concur.

Mors Draco, on 24 July 2015 - 12:41 PM, said:

I'll see your Wasp and Stinger and and raise you my Phoenix Hawk L.A.M. without transforming action that will suck twice as bad!

ill take 3 please

[Alan Davion]

kosmos1214, on 25 July 2015 - 12:11 PM, said:

i like shimering sword work to it looks like it should buts far enough away that hg cant jump on it to bad

Shimmering Sword did do the cover art for the Mercs book.

[SilverlightPony]

Tennex, on 24 July 2015 - 07:48 AM, said:

I personally don't mind this version

Anthony "Shimmering-Sword" Scroggins' designs are some of my favorites as well. I think I actually like it better than the original Marauder design, since it places the big top gun on the right side to actually match the spec sheet, instead of having it visibly top-center but still treated like it's in the right torso.

[Scout Derek]

SilverlightPony, on 25 July 2015 - 12:37 PM, said:

Anthony "Shimmering-Sword" Scroggins' designs are some of my favorites as well. I think I actually like it better than the original Marauder design, since it places the big top gun on the right side to actually match the spec sheet, instead of having it visibly top-center but still treated like it's in the right torso.

Tell me about it, just look at it, all the curves and even the feet just make it look what we all imagine our mechs to be in MWO.

Though one thing always scared me about the marauders; that cockpit placement D:

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

Mors Draco, on 24 July 2015 - 12:01 PM, said:

I don't. But i suppose I'd have to buy the pack just to get the Rifleman. Because I mean, honestly, the Marauder looks cool, but I always prefered the Rifleman.

Yeah but think of it from a precident position. Mechs that we literally haven't seen in official videogame form since the 1980's -early 90's [MW2 didn't even have all the unseen]

Some of these mechs, outside of fan projects like Mektek, or MWLL, haven't been in a videogame... I'll happily pay for a Phoenix 2 pack that has these.