1017 replies to this topic

[Armando]

Nathan K, on 13 August 2015 - 03:20 PM, said:

[/b][/u]

There are talks of PVE in the works.

Well there you go, FINALLY, you will have a REAL solo game experience.

Until that happens how about you wake up to the reality of what this game is right now, and give up this fantasy that playing solo is even possible.

Edited by Armando, 13 August 2015 - 03:37 PM.

[MaxFool]

Telmasa, on 13 August 2015 - 02:37 PM, said:

If you take individual players from the "top clan" a-teams and randomly throw them together as solo players into a match, whether solo or CW, they will be just as effective and competent as they would be in a tag-wearing premade group.

(edit: this also applies to Saxie's reply)

Bottom line: Ability and effort makes you special. Unit tags, use of teamspeak, and sneering at other players, does not.

That is just simply wrong. You just don't take bunch of skilled individuals, throw them together, and have them automatically work as coherent team. Especially not without the use of team speak.

What you can do, is to take a top team and have them play without TS, and expect them to play like a coherent team most of the time. A top team develops a culture of doing things in certain ways, and the only way to learn that culture is to spend hours in TS playing the game.

[Vlad Ward]

Sure, but top (or even mediocre) players don't need to play like a coherent team to win CW matches.

A few (3-4) half decent players with basics done on at least one of their mechs can run around half drunk making disco light shows with their pulse lasers and still stomp most combinations of 12 defenders in cw.

The range of player skill + mech effectiveness combinations possible in mwo is just so very large.

Edited by Vlad Ward, 13 August 2015 - 04:47 PM.

[Livewyr]

Vlad Ward, on 13 August 2015 - 04:44 PM, said:

Sure, but top (or even mediocre) players don't need to play like a coherent team to win CW matches.

A few (3-4) half decent players with basics done on at least one of their mechs can run around half drunk making disco light shows with their pulse lasers and still stomp most combinations of 12 defenders in cw.

The range of player skill + mech effectiveness combinations possible in mwo is just so very large.

This is why you make trial mechs unavailable for CW drop decks.

[Armando]

Vlad Ward, on 13 August 2015 - 04:44 PM, said:

Sure, but top (or even mediocre) players don't need to play like a coherent team to win CW matches.

A few (3-4) half decent players with basics done on at least one of their mechs can run around half drunk making disco light shows with their pulse lasers and still stomp most combinations of 12 defenders in cw.

The range of player skill + mech effectiveness combinations possible in mwo is just so very large.

Bull Sh!at....no player is gonna beat a coherent team playing "solo" (as if such a thing is ever possible...LOL), and anyone who thinks they can is delusional. You play with a "I am solo player mindset" against a coherent TEAM of players you are going to lose every time.

Edited by Armando, 13 August 2015 - 07:49 PM.

[MischiefSC]

Vlad Ward, on 13 August 2015 - 04:44 PM, said:

Sure, but top (or even mediocre) players don't need to play like a coherent team to win CW matches.

A few (3-4) half decent players with basics done on at least one of their mechs can run around half drunk making disco light shows with their pulse lasers and still stomp most combinations of 12 defenders in cw.

The range of player skill + mech effectiveness combinations possible in mwo is just so very large.

Just had a match where only 2 of us broke 1k damage and I was playing with 4 new mechs in my deck and it was my first drop of any sort on Vitric Forge. One of my teammates died *twice* before I even got to the enemy.

The terrible, sad, crushing thing is that I suspect most the rage really does come from people putting together terrible decks and playing like it's underhive pug queue, getting stomped terribly by an enemy team of at best mediocre players and then raging about how unfair it is. It's a problem that is self-created.

It takes so little to do well in CW. It really does. That it's still too much or not worth the trouble for so many is depressing.

[Timicon]

Armando, on 12 August 2015 - 01:24 PM, said:

The issues you describe are real issues, all of which can be solved by finding and dropping with 11 other players who are on the same page. There are many successful CW drop decks (but NONE that include trial mechs), and many tactics that can be used on the battle fields, but NONE if it works when pilots THINK they are playing a "Solo" game.

I understand what you are getting at, but at the same time, finding 11 pilots on-line at the same time (from a House, Clan or faction unit or even from your friends list can be tricky, since most of us work (and since I am in Australia, I work during the day when it is night time (prime time) in the game) so I am unable to be on-line in order to join an LFG of my fellow House pilots or friends, which is a big disadvantage to those of us in the Oceanic region, plus other pilots from around the World (europe, Canada, Britain etc) have people who work during prime time (day-time in the game time) which prevents them from being on-line to join LFG and friends for CW events, which is why there are a lot of pugs in CW matches - they simply cannot be on-line at the same as their friends and Units they have joined, which is what makes making IS 12 man/woman teams tricky at best.
A good idea might be to try and coordinate with friends and their respective Units they have joined about setting out a day and time where the majority of them can be on-line and able to play as a full 12 man/woman Unit in CW matches, but until then, I am afraid we are stuck with a fair number of pugs in each CW event just to even out the game.

On another note (or gripe, if you like) it would be good if people learned the roles of the Mechs they pilot. For example, if you are in a Light 'Mech, then your ob is simply to scout ahead, locate the enemy and then get back as fast as you can to your team mates and defend the heavies and assault 'Mechs (with their much stronger and heavier armour for defense) since it is very difficult for them to combat a Light enemy 'Mech when it gets too close. (and for cap drops, it should the Light pilots and any fast Medium 'Mechs who should take the responsibility to cap, instead of just running around like a headless chook shooting the enemy and getting slaughtered for nothing. And Medium 'Mechs, I realise some are slow, but they should should also hang back a bit, provide fire support for those Mechs who do cap, instead of doing it themselves, especially by themselves where there is a greater chance 2 or 3 or even an entire enemy lance can come down and wipe them out within seconds.

I am not saying pugs are bad, but a lot of people need to know their 'Mechs a lot a better and what roles they play to ensure a lot more victories than defeat.
The Clans, especially in CW matches have this down pat, which is why they are ruling the CW event matches so much lately.

L.T. Boardwalk Defenders (BwD)

Edit: spelling, grammar and a slightly longer post.

Edited by Leif Tanner, 13 August 2015 - 09:35 PM.

[IraqiWalker]

MischiefSC, on 13 August 2015 - 08:02 PM, said:

Just had a match where only 2 of us broke 1k damage and I was playing with 4 new mechs in my deck and it was my first drop of any sort on Vitric Forge. One of my teammates died *twice* before I even got to the enemy.

The terrible, sad, crushing thing is that I suspect most the rage really does come from people putting together terrible decks and playing like it's underhive pug queue, getting stomped terribly by an enemy team of at best mediocre players and then raging about how unfair it is. It's a problem that is self-created.

It takes so little to do well in CW. It really does. That it's still too much or not worth the trouble for so many is depressing.

[STEF_]

Look, I always have fun in CW, it's my fav game mode.
I just dropped in one as soloist, taking screenshots that can sum up why Armando has a point (and more than one, too).

1) taking 3 not even basiced mechs.... who cares? I'm here to have fun.
Oh, look, team(6-8 maybe) vs solos (only 4 trail mechs!)


2)
Well.... it was easy to foresee.... but wait...
What da hell! EIGHT freaking trial mechs now! LOL



3) final screen:


1) "I'm a solo player, I don't want to join a team" is the epigraph in mechwarrior's tomb.

2) How da hell is possible to do less than 800 dmg in CW? Easy: choose as many trial mechs as you can, soloists!



edit: oh look: there is one doing less than 400 dmg in the winning side! Because he was part of a team!!!
So no epigraph for him!

Edited by Stefka Kerensky, 13 August 2015 - 11:56 PM.

[aniviron]

Armando, on 09 August 2015 - 01:33 AM, said:

Community Warfare is NOT fun for solo players, nothing will change that, I will say it again...NOTHING WILL CHANGE THAT...that is a fact, a plain and simple FACT.

I know this quote is from twelve pages ago, but I can't resist: why are you speaking for solo players? I see that you're in a unit, so I assume you're not part of the demographic you seem to represent here.

When I play CW as a solo, I enjoy it, far more often than the solo quick queue. It's really not a fact that solo players hate CW. What I do hate is the hideously long wait times for matches, the mediocre payouts, and the complete meaninglessness of planets. That sucks. But CW itself is fun, and generally speaking it's a lot more fun than the normal matches. The issues I have with CW are all issues that groups have with it as well, so they're not unique to me as a solo player.

You can say that you want to play CW without pugs, that's fine. It's your opinion, and you are free to hold it. But when you're claiming as fact that solo players aren't having fun with CW, that's not okay.

[Uncle Totty]

Livewyr, on 13 August 2015 - 06:37 PM, said:

This is why you make trial mechs unavailable for CW drop decks.

...and I say let there be a max of two in the drop deck. I had to do that for a time since I had no Clan mechs under 75 tons.

[STEF_]

aniviron, on 14 August 2015 - 12:47 AM, said:

I know this quote is from twelve pages ago, but I can't resist: why are you speaking for solo players? I see that you're in a unit, so I assume you're not part of the demographic you seem to represent here.

When I play CW as a solo, I enjoy it, far more often than the solo quick queue. It's really not a fact that solo players hate CW. What I do hate is the hideously long wait times for matches, the mediocre payouts, and the complete meaninglessness of planets. That sucks. But CW itself is fun, and generally speaking it's a lot more fun than the normal matches. The issues I have with CW are all issues that groups have with it as well, so they're not unique to me as a solo player.

You can say that you want to play CW without pugs, that's fine. It's your opinion, and you are free to hold it. But when you're claiming as fact that solo players aren't having fun with CW, that's not okay.

That a look at screenshots in my last post.
Please give your soloist collegues hints, tips, whatever.

Because that match pretty much sum up things.

[Uncle Totty]

Stefka Kerensky, on 13 August 2015 - 11:52 PM, said:

Look, I always have fun in CW, it's my fav game mode.
I just dropped in one as soloist, taking screenshots that can sum up why Armando has a point (and more than one, too).

1) taking 3 not even basiced mechs.... who cares? I'm here to have fun.
Oh, look, team(6-8 maybe) vs solos (only 4 trail mechs!)


2)
Well.... it was easy to foresee.... but wait...
What da hell! EIGHT freaking trial mechs now! LOL



3) final screen:


1) "I'm a solo player, I don't want to join a team" is the epigraph in mechwarrior's tomb.

2) How da hell is possible to do less than 800 dmg in CW? Easy: choose as many trial mechs as you can, soloists!



edit: oh look: there is one doing less than 400 dmg in the winning side! Because he was part of a team!!!
So no epigraph for him!

By my game crashing mid match, forcing me to back out and rejoin. When I come back, I find that the match is ****** and about over.

[IraqiWalker]

aniviron, on 14 August 2015 - 12:47 AM, said:

I know this quote is from twelve pages ago, but I can't resist: why are you speaking for solo players? I see that you're in a unit, so I assume you're not part of the demographic you seem to represent here.

When I play CW as a solo, I enjoy it, far more often than the solo quick queue. It's really not a fact that solo players hate CW. What I do hate is the hideously long wait times for matches, the mediocre payouts, and the complete meaninglessness of planets. That sucks. But CW itself is fun, and generally speaking it's a lot more fun than the normal matches. The issues I have with CW are all issues that groups have with it as well, so they're not unique to me as a solo player.

You can say that you want to play CW without pugs, that's fine. It's your opinion, and you are free to hold it. But when you're claiming as fact that solo players aren't having fun with CW, that's not okay.

QFT

Edited by IraqiWalker, 14 August 2015 - 02:13 AM.

[Catra Lanis]

I have played matches where our 8+4 or even 6+6 have beaten full 12 mans. I have seen solo players follow directions just as good as those in a unit. Being in a unit does not automatically mean that you are a better player, it does not even mean that you are better coordinated. Not every solo dropper run around like a headless chicken.

[Vlad Ward]

Armando, on 13 August 2015 - 07:47 PM, said:

Bull Sh!at....no player is gonna beat a coherent team playing "solo" (as if such a thing is ever possible...LOL), and anyone who thinks they can is delusional. You play with a "I am solo player mindset" against a coherent TEAM of players you are going to lose every time.

Depends. A coherent team of bads? They will still lose every time. No amount of coordination will save people who think bringing 10 LRM boats and 2 ravens is a viable strategy or who couldn't hit the broad side of an overlord dropship with their lasers.

A coherent team of half decent players carrying a couple bads? That may be more difficult to handle, but it's still doable.

A coherent team of players who are at least decent? Now that is difficult. It's just too bad that it's so rare for 12 decent players to end up on the same team. You only see that happening with top cw teams these days.

[Yokaiko]

Stefka Kerensky, on 13 August 2015 - 11:52 PM, said:

2) How da hell is possible to do less than 800 dmg in CW? Easy: choose as many trial mechs as you can, soloists!

I've dropped with 4 trails that were a combined 170 tons and done over 1000 damage, remember the bug where it would blank your dropdeck, yeah that.
:edit
IS trials I may add

Edited by Yokaiko, 14 August 2015 - 05:27 AM.

[Josef Koba]

Armando, on 13 August 2015 - 11:09 AM, said:

My position is the thinking that you EVER drop solo in this game is a fallacy, there is NO SOLO MODE IN MWO. The very concept that Solo Play is possible is false.

You're equivocating. In one comment you use 'solo' as it has been long accepted in MWO - that being a drop by one person who is not a part of an organized team made of of people who specifically formed that team for the purpose of dropping into matches. Then you go on to say that there is no such thing as a solo player, which, if I recall, contradicts the points you made in the original post. You're just changing definitions of words to suit your particular argument at any given time. Obviously, the the strictest definition, you're not 'solo.' Though sometimes in the 'solo' queue it sure feels like 12 individuals rather than a team.

In any case, you originally stated that solo players should not be allowed in CW. If we go by your most recent definitions in the post I partially quoted, there is no such thing as a solo player, ergo your original point is moot. In other words, since there are no solo players, all players should be allowed into CW because they're all part of a team, whether they drop with an organized group or by themselves.

[BSK]

Telmasa, on 13 August 2015 - 02:37 PM, said:

If you take individual players from the "top clan" a-teams and randomly throw them together as solo players into a match, whether solo or CW, they will be just as effective and competent as they would be in a tag-wearing premade group.

..

Bottom line: Ability and effort makes you special. Unit tags, use of teamspeak, and sneering at other players, does not.

Absolutely no. If you ever played chess against a computer, you might have seen an option how many moves you want it to think ahead. A non coordinated group will always think one-dimensional and even after a long training never exceed to think 2 moves ahead. Within a coordinated and comunicating group you start at 2 moves ahead and can go up to 6 moves.

[Necromantion]

MischiefSC, on 13 August 2015 - 08:02 PM, said:

Just had a match where only 2 of us broke 1k damage and I was playing with 4 new mechs in my deck and it was my first drop of any sort on Vitric Forge. One of my teammates died *twice* before I even got to the enemy.

The terrible, sad, crushing thing is that I suspect most the rage really does come from people putting together terrible decks and playing like it's underhive pug queue, getting stomped terribly by an enemy team of at best mediocre players and then raging about how unfair it is. It's a problem that is self-created.

It takes so little to do well in CW. It really does. That it's still too much or not worth the trouble for so many is depressing.

Dude this is the route humanity is taking. Instant gratification through rushing headdown into every situation. People these days are utterly ***** stupid for the most part and that is putting it politely. Im not talking academic smarts either, I am talking about logic and reasoning.