116 replies to this topic

[Dino Might]

Lugh, on 02 September 2015 - 04:19 AM, said:

It would be more useless than whatever you view as the most useless light in the game.

Those are sorely needed buffs.

So you must consider all other lights but the FS9 as useless. I can't imagine you actually having piloted many of these chassis and still having that view. Without those buffs, your ACH still has more than double the armor of my Locust, it has 50% greater range with CSMPL, has 50% more total damage per alpha when running six of them, does not die with single side torso loss, has jump jets, has ECM...

And yet, somehow, my Locust is not useless by any stretch of the imagination...

I really don't want to know what you would do if you were given the keys to the balance department when you consider that mech as useless without +15 structure quirks.

Edited by Dino Might, 02 September 2015 - 06:24 AM.

[Lugh]

Dino Might, on 02 September 2015 - 06:24 AM, said:

So you must consider all other lights but the FS9 as useless. I can't imagine you actually having piloted many of these chassis and still having that view. Without those buffs, your ACH still has more than double the armor of my Locust, it has 50% greater range with CSMPL, has 50% more total damage per alpha when running six of them, does not die with single side torso loss, has jump jets, has ECM...

And yet, somehow, my Locust is not useless by any stretch of the imagination...

I really don't want to know what you would do if you were given the keys to the balance department when you consider that mech as useless without +15 structure quirks.

Hardly. Ravens played correctly are extremely useful, however most of them pop on 2 LL and sit so far from being useful and garnering less score (l33t skill mange l33t skill) being super saiyan sniper dude instead of being in a position to shield assaults from incoming LRM fire and firing at what the assault is firing at. Jenners are EXCELLENT at high speed harrassment operations. Spiders are ok at best but whatever floats your boat.

All of the clan lights(except the ACH) wish they were mediums like the Ice Ferret so they could at least run faster than 106...

I have not seen a mech attract more hate on the battlefield in a long time. And I have seen entire teams Immobalized by the threat of 3 ACHs dropping down on them from above while my team happily destroyed them all trying to get a shot on the little distractions.

And I am SUPER glad that you aren't in charge of balance thinking that a 20 ton mech should be as durable as a 30 ton mech.

I am not a fan of either the Commando or the Locust, because of the ease with which I myself dispatch them. What all the winy tryhard round here SHOULD be asking for (if they really think those structure quirks are so OP) is for more of those sorts of perks for lights.

Trust me the extra 2 seconds of PEW PEW with that single remaining pair of c spls isn't going to save you anymore than not piloting a light in the first place. (This is why most don't pilot lights, it takes way more effort to dodge hitscan weapons)

[Dino Might]

Lugh, on 02 September 2015 - 06:39 AM, said:

Hardly. Ravens played correctly are extremely useful, however most of them pop on 2 LL and sit so far from being useful and garnering less score (l33t skill mange l33t skill) being super saiyan sniper dude instead of being in a position to shield assaults from incoming LRM fire and firing at what the assault is firing at. Jenners are EXCELLENT at high speed harrassment operations. Spiders are ok at best but whatever floats your boat.

All of the clan lights(except the ACH) wish they were mediums like the Ice Ferret so they could at least run faster than 106...

I have not seen a mech attract more hate on the battlefield in a long time. And I have seen entire teams Immobalized by the threat of 3 ACHs dropping down on them from above while my team happily destroyed them all trying to get a shot on the little distractions.

And I am SUPER glad that you aren't in charge of balance thinking that a 20 ton mech should be as durable as a 30 ton mech.

I am not a fan of either the Commando or the Locust, because of the ease with which I myself dispatch them. What all the winy tryhard round here SHOULD be asking for (if they really think those structure quirks are so OP) is for more of those sorts of perks for lights.

Trust me the extra 2 seconds of PEW PEW with that single remaining pair of c spls isn't going to save you anymore than not piloting a light in the first place. (This is why most don't pilot lights, it takes way more effort to dodge hitscan weapons)

I sure hope to see you join EMP or SJR soon with your l33t skillz. Everything you say smacks of "because I'm so darn good." But you see, I will grant you that you are a mechwarrior prodigy. That further undermines the points you are making, because balance is not entirely determined by the top 1% of players. It has to be a universal system.

I didn't say my 20 tonner should be as armored as your 30 tonner. Nice strawman. All I said was that even without your structure quirks, you still have way more armor than I do, and I can make use of my mech, so why couldn't you make use of yours without those quirks?

Those teams that had 3 ACHs drop on them had to shoot them or risk being cored out by 36-42 point alphas in the back, multiplied by 3. Your team had great tactics, to push with the heavies while the lights distracted them. But there wasn't going to be a lot the enemy could do at that point. They'd get crushed unless they similarly had 3 ACHs coring out you guys in the back.

Let me try and dig up a video tonight about those extra seconds of pew pew with the ACH with 2 CSMP to show you what can be done with that...

[Lugh]

Dino Might, on 02 September 2015 - 06:49 AM, said:

I sure hope to see you join EMP or SJR soon with your l33t skillz. Everything you say smacks of "because I'm so darn good." But you see, I will grant you that you are a mechwarrior prodigy. That further undermines the points you are making, because balance is not entirely determined by the top 1% of players. It has to be a universal system.

I didn't say my 20 tonner should be as armored as your 30 tonner. Nice strawman. All I said was that even without your structure quirks, you still have way more armor than I do, and I can make use of my mech, so why couldn't you make use of yours without those quirks?

Those teams that had 3 ACHs drop on them had to shoot them or risk being cored out by 36-42 point alphas in the back, multiplied by 3. Your team had great tactics, to push with the heavies while the lights distracted them. But there wasn't going to be a lot the enemy could do at that point. They'd get crushed unless they similarly had 3 ACHs coring out you guys in the back.

Let me try and dig up a video tonight about those extra seconds of pew pew with the ACH with 2 CSMP to show you what can be done with that...

Funny that you got 'I'm so good' from my post, when what I was describing was quite clearly the opposite. Without that extra structure, i personally an already avowed terrible light pilot would not deem them worth using often, because they would be less capable of doing what I use them to do.

I've also stated over and over in the ACH whinefest 2015, that I do NOT see a problem destroying them in ANY mech that has any sort of laser set up. (And apparently neither does Soy[since you wanted confirmation from somebody that IS viewed as good].

They are not the second coming MECHJESUS that most are making them out to be. They don't need to be nerfed. They are just fine.

[Nori Silverrage]

Eh, It's pretty limited in builds because of low available tonnage.
The SPL build is amazing though.

[Hydrothermia]

Lord Scarlett Johan, on 31 August 2015 - 02:49 PM, said:

Depending on the level of nerfs, most of us will likely just go back to Firestarters.

The structural quirks will likely be the only nerf, and it still should be able to compete with Firestarters.

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

Hydrothermia, on 02 September 2015 - 07:31 AM, said:

The structural quirks will likely be the only nerf, and it still should be able to compete with Firestarters.

Which is really the only buff they didn't need.

[Almond Brown]

Hydrothermia, on 02 September 2015 - 07:31 AM, said:

The structural quirks will likely be the only nerf, and it still should be able to compete with Firestarters.

The added structure quirks provides the ACH-A an additional 60pts. of IS, which in turn allows it to surpass total damage tanked to a Mechs that weighs 5 tons more.... The FS9. ????? The A's leg has more IS points than Leg Armor ffs... what gives...

[Juju Shinobi]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 31 August 2015 - 02:39 PM, said:

cause once they get nerfed noone will know hat to do lol

I still play my Locust 1E and on regular basis so I don't let the Artic Cheetah or previously the Firestarter make me sloppy and cocky. Though really, the AHC is a huge crutch

[ApolloKaras]

Has anyone posted an actual analysis of the ACH's hit box?

[Lugh]

Saxie, on 02 September 2015 - 10:54 AM, said:

Has anyone posted an actual analysis of the ACH's hit box?

Yes. It's buried in one of the many whine threads. McGral18(?) if I recall correctly posted it.

[Mcgral18]

Saxie, on 02 September 2015 - 10:54 AM, said:

Has anyone posted an actual analysis of the ACH's hit box?

Here's a non-scientific random shooting of a Cheetah

[Yellonet]

If we just ignore the discussion about it being broken in some way and just think of it as a very good light mech it is still OP, let me tell you why.

Obviously a (large?)majority of players have a hard time getting good hits onto this particular mech. I can say this based on number of threads about it and that in most of the matches where we have had Cheetahs in one or both teams, almost everyone struggle to make any kind of good damage to it, they very often survive being shut down with 2 or 3 enemies around, to start back up and run away. I usually see them running alone right into big groups of enemies, only to come out with yellow or perhaps some orange armour.
And even if you manage to hit it, the damage just spreads too well, thus its effective armour becomes a lot more than other mechs with the same number or armour points, this again is often observed as ACH often lives down to 30 even 20% total health.
This is why it is OP as it is extremely better than any other mech at holding up to damage.
So in the end it doesn't really matter if it is broken or not, it is way way OP regardless.

Edited by Yellonet, 02 September 2015 - 11:42 AM.

[Y E O N N E]

JujuShinobi, on 02 September 2015 - 10:51 AM, said:

I still play my Locust 1E and on regular basis so I don't let the Artic Cheetah or previously the Firestarter make me sloppy and cocky. Though really, the AHC is a huge crutch

When I get into a Firestarter, I deliberately play sloppy to experience the durability.

Arms go poof pretty quick under concentrated fire. The rest takes significantly longer.

I am a terrible Firestarter pilot.

[Leggin Ho]

Yellonet, on 02 September 2015 - 11:42 AM, said:

If we just ignore the discussion about it being broken in some way and just think of it as a very good light mech it is still OP, let me tell you why.

Obviously a (large?)majority of players have a hard time getting good hits onto this particular mech. I can say this based on number of threads about it and that in most of the matches where we have had Cheetahs in one or both teams, almost everyone struggle to make any kind of good damage to it, they very often survive being shut down with 2 or 3 enemies around, to start back up and run away. I usually see them running alone right into big groups of enemies, only to come out with yellow or perhaps some orange armour.
And even if you manage to hit it, the damage just spreads too well, thus its effective armour becomes a lot more than other mechs with the same number or armour points, this again is often observed as ACH often lives down to 30 even 20% total health.
This is why it is OP as it is extremely better than any other mech at holding up to damage.
So in the end it doesn't really matter if it is broken or not, it is way way OP regardless.

You can watch a FS or even a Spyder do the same thing, some points from the legs maybe, nothing more or you just make it liek the rest of the clan lights, worthless for anything other than ECM coverage.

[Andi Nagasia]

Mcgral18, on 02 September 2015 - 11:29 AM, said:

Here's a non-scientific random shooting of a Cheetah

My God Please give the NVA those HitBoxes PGI? Please?