22 replies to this topic

[TheArisen]

Or do they just "eyeball" it?

Do they play with the mech in a game of sorts, or do they just design it, give it stats and send it out?

[Master Pain]

i think mech design is an artistic decision for them

[Krivvan]

Mech design and hardpoints (yeah I know...) are pretty much entirely an artistic decision, and as far as I know they don't often go back to change it in favor of game balance.

[TheArisen]

Master Pain, on 22 September 2015 - 04:17 PM, said:

i think mech design is an artistic decision for them

No wonder some mechs just fail. In TT, hard point placement doesn't but this is a live action game. /sigh how depressing.

I really wish Pgi would optimize the mechs somewhat. They don't have to make everything like a jeagermech but still they should tweak it for balances sake.

[FupDup]

I think it's safe to say that the vast majority of mechs that are effective in MWO are that way because they either:

A. Inherit their TT/BT strengths (e.g. TBR, SCR, DWF)
B. Have the ability to remove their TT weaknesses (e.g. HBR, ACH, Victors and Shadow Hawks back in the day)
C. Pure accident (also Shadow Hawk)


Mechs are bad in MWO for the same reasons, just in reverse (inherit TT weaknesses, can't remove weaknesses, pure accident).

Edited by FupDup, 22 September 2015 - 04:54 PM.

[ThisMachineKillsFascists]

eye ball if you are lucky. You know all it needs to have 1-2 game content tester. they dont have to work full time at all. And the payment of those guys isnt uber. Those pro game testers have to understand how to min max and how to "abuse mechanics, in order to avoid them later on.

currently they hardly eye ball even stats. minus 3000% torso twist on one of the enforcer says everything

Edited by ThisMachineKillsFascists, 22 September 2015 - 04:57 PM.

[Deathlike]

Any time PGI doesn't take any actual care to balance out the shape of the mech, relative to their tonnage... we end up having to "quirk" to fix the "artistic deficiency".

It's why the Quickdraw, Trebuchet, Mist Lynx, and a host of Tier 4+5 mechs are where they happen to be.

[ThisMachineKillsFascists]

Deathlike, on 22 September 2015 - 05:01 PM, said:

Any time PGI doesn't take any actual care to balance out the shape of the mech, relative to their tonnage... we end up having to "quirk" to fix the "artistic deficiency".

It's why the Quickdraw, Trebuchet, Mist Lynx, and a host of Tier 4+5 mechs are where they happen to be.

quickdraw was never bad. i had 3 of them from day one. Ppl hate for some reason its shape/ torso sze

Edited by ThisMachineKillsFascists, 22 September 2015 - 05:04 PM.

[Krivvan]

ThisMachineKillsFascists, on 22 September 2015 - 05:03 PM, said:

quickdraw was never bad. i had 3 of them from day one. Ppl hate for some reason its shape/ torso sze

They're alright now, but only because of the quirks.

[Lyoto Machida]

Does PGI test much of anything is the real question...

[MechaBattler]

Well their new system on the PTS for quirks is supposed to take every aspect into account. But they still need to do a balance pass on weapons. And thankfully they admitted that they weren't very clear with the goals of the PTS changes. So hopefully the next pass we'll see something more promising than just overloading mechs with structure quirks or gimping them with only good infotech quirks.

So in theory. Once they figure out what works and what needs rebalancing. They'll have a system in place for balancing new mechs.

Although. It's funny when they give a mech good quirks. "It's Pay 2 Win!".

Edited by MechaBattler, 22 September 2015 - 05:56 PM.

[Deathlike]

Krivvan, on 22 September 2015 - 05:35 PM, said:

They're alright now, but only because of the quirks.

Any mech that is even remotely considered "decent" and has major armor quirks (at least +10 to armor in any section) means that it isn't as durable as it could be (although, I think the Highlander is the only major exception to that rule). Zeus for instance would be much worse w/o those quirks.

Edited by Deathlike, 22 September 2015 - 06:09 PM.

[Ghogiel]

Krivvan, on 22 September 2015 - 05:35 PM, said:

They're alright now, but only because of the quirks.

I miss my 4PPC QKD ppc meta poptart days.

[XX Sulla XX]

Not very well.

[Davers]

Krivvan, on 22 September 2015 - 04:27 PM, said:

Mech design and hardpoints (yeah I know...) are pretty much entirely an artistic decision, and as far as I know they don't often go back to change it in favor of game balance.

Well, we have had a few hit box adjustments over the years, and then there is that whole Redesign thing that PGI isn't talking about...

[TLBFestus]

Of course they test it. don't be silly.

I have it from on good authority that PGI tests the Mechs just as rigorously as they test the parameters they set for tournaments.

[Khobai]

fear not. paultech solves all your mech balance woes

any mech with bad weapons, armor, and movement will get better sensor quirks to make up for it.

[ThisMachineKillsFascists]

Deathlike, on 22 September 2015 - 06:09 PM, said:

Any mech that is even remotely considered "decent" and has major armor quirks (at least +10 to armor in any section) means that it isn't as durable as it could be (although, I think the Highlander is the only major exception to that rule). Zeus for instance would be much worse w/o those quirks.

You ll laugh and i can understand that but i dont think the highlnder is as bad as ppl talk about it. Iam playing very often my victor or highlanders. HAAAA and iam mid t2 I basically deteste meta in any game. I dont wanna follow the sheep heard

Edited by ThisMachineKillsFascists, 22 September 2015 - 08:29 PM.

[ChewBaka]

I wonder why you guys are expecting each mech to be well designed though. By Btech lore, they aren't supposed to be. Only the clan mechs as well as later IS designs are purpose-built for war.

So yeah, dodgy hitboxes kinda adds to the atmosphere of the game even if they are bad for balance.

I really wish people will stop harping about balance. Yes, some balance is needed but it doesn't need to be blanket for all. Some mechs should indeed be lemons because well...they were lemons in Btech.

Making every mech equal will just make this game stale with no personality. Some of us like our oddball mechs, weird hitboxes and all.

[Gas Guzzler]

Khobai, on 22 September 2015 - 06:36 PM, said:

fear not. paultech solves all your mech balance woes

any mech with bad weapons, armor, and movement will get better sensor quirks to make up for it.

Don't always see eye to eye with you, but I really do enjoy this current trolling method that you have adopted