149 replies to this topic

[L Y N X]

The New PSR (Player Skill Rating) Tier system.

This article is meant to present information PL has helped me to deduce through analyzing post match scores and player stats post match.

There are 5 tiers, the lowest being 5 and the highest tier being tier 1.

We do know PGI's distribution model is just fixed PSR watermarks to meet. As the PSR acual values are hidden, PSR watermarks used are irrelevant since all one sees is a PSR Tier progress bar on one's home page. After each match, under the player stats tab, a Green chevron pointed up indicates a PSR increase, a Yellow equal sign indicates no PSR change, or a Red chevron pointed down indicates a PSR decrease for that given match performance as measured by match score.

We have through trial and error deduced some of the watermarks for match scores on wins and losses that trigger a change or no change in one's PSR.

On a Win:
PSR goes UP a lot if match score is >400
PSR goes UP a moderate amount if match score is >250 but <=400
PSR goes UP a little if match score is >= 100
PSR has NO CHANGE for a match score <100

Note: I do not have data on a zero match score if that would cause PSR to go down on a win, but I suspect PSR does not drop on a win, at the very least I have not experienced that.

On a Loss:
PSR goes UP if match score is > 400
PSR has NO CHANGE for a match score >250 but <= 400
PSR goes DOWN a little if match score is <=250
PSR goes DOWN a lot if match score is < 100

On a Tie:
Both sides, all players see a NO CHANGE to PSR regardless of match score.

As you can see, winning makes it easier to improve PSR.
However, PSR can go up steadily if you can consistently match scores above 250 and 400 on losses.

So what goes into match score?

The short answer is almost everything from Spotting, flanking, protected formations, shooting down enemy UAV's to kills, assists, damage, etc. See more on this here.

Currently, the single largest contributor seems to be damage dealt. Assists seem to be the second biggest contributor and then kills, the rest are very small contributors in the present state of PSR (September 2015), and may possibly change over time.

It appears to me that about half the damage dealt contributes straight away to match score with assist, kills and all those other things making up the difference. Sometimes a PSR, no change on a loss, can occur without a high damage (>400, meaning obtaining well under 400 damage) if many assists are made. But that assumes the losing team made many kills... which means it was a close match anyhow.

This is what we know at present, with more data it is subject to change. PGI will very likely alter it and not say how since they have not shared the above information watermarks.

Info on PSR from Paul @ PGI

Edited by 7ynx, 10 October 2015 - 04:47 PM.

[Tesunie]

Would like to mention... I've had a match score over 300 (I believe it was 330ish) and lost a match. PSR when down. (Then I won a match with a match score of 200ish, and it went up...)

Only note I wish to add, if it helps any.

[L Y N X]

Tesunie,

All my testing indicates that a losing match and match score of 330 would generate a NO CHANGE to PSR as a result.
Your win is right in line with my testing.

Thanks for sharing.

[Tesunie]

7ynx, on 24 September 2015 - 08:38 PM, said:

Tesunie,

All my testing indicates that a losing match and match score of 330 would generate a NO CHANGE to PSR as a result.
Your win is right in line with my testing.

Thanks for sharing.

Just saying. Don't now why then, but I had a red down arrow when I lost. I only had the yellow equal symbol once when I had a rare (for me) match score in the 400s. (Which does match your data.)

Just want information to be as accurate as possible, even if I happen to be wrong.


I just don't feel it's right to preform better and lose and drop in PSR, and then preform worse and win and increase PSR.

[Not A Real RAbbi]

Good start there, 7ynx! Some questions, if I may. And I figure even if they're not asking, the new folks would like to know these answers too. After all, we just came off a match score based weekend challenge, and we're headed right into another in several hours. It would be helpful to know, then, exactly what one must do to qualify/quantify the following:

Scouting
Flanking
Brawling
Protected (light, medium, heavy, assault, as appropriate)
Lance in Formation
Counter ECM (Specifically, how long, if NARC qualifies, if TAG qualifies, can it be done with PPC fire, etc)
Savior Kill

And so on. Those are the ones we see most often, I'm sure. If you have some insight on the topic, it could only be helpful. After all, if EVERYONE in a given match makes a 300+ score, or if all but one or two on the winning team come in under 100, it makes no real difference. So let's help each other make the most of this money-making opportunity!

[Spare Parts Bin]

7ynx thanks for the link. Looks like I need to go snipe,backstab,flank and help my team more.

[Spike Brave]

Perhaps Tier matters as well. I had a match score of 450 and a loss resulting in a reduction.

[Spungie]

I hope so otherwise it would be way too easy to reach T1.

[Nik Reaper]

Spungie, on 25 September 2015 - 07:04 AM, said:

I hope so otherwise it would be way too easy to reach T1.

Some higher tired players showed it's easy as it is, it's all about winning.

Get a group and win most of your games, as long as you get to do at least 200 dmg you will go up in rating, more so than you will on average lose rating on a loss.
It really is as Paus said, it's not showing skill it's showing how many games you played and, in part, how well you did in them, as you will climb higher faster if you do max damage on good games and minimize the prs loss on bad games.

As the graph shows if you do about the same in most of the games, loss or win, the gain from wins is larger then the loss from losses , meaning that as long as you don't lose a lot more then you win ( without you doing enough to get the "=" prs change ) you will steadily go up...

With things as they are now this system only serves to not match players with less played games from the veteran players, there is no accounting for skill, as it never checks how many games you needed to get to your current prs or even what your average match score is...

[L Y N X]

From Paul:

[L Y N X]

Notice that Paul DID NOT attach any match score numbers to the Y-axis, and probably for good reason, as it allows them to change it whenever they want to tweak things and not needing to inform us. Can be changed on the backend w/o being tied to a patch update.

Based on the data we collected and the chart you posted, we can match some match score watermarks to the Y-axis (until PGI changes the values ofc).

Winning Match Scores
Very High = above 400
High = 251 to 400
Medium = 101 to 250
Low = Below 100

Losing Match Scores
Very High = above 400
High = 251 to 400
Medium = 101 to 250
Low = Below 100

This explains why consistent high match scores see the fastest progression at improving one's PSR.

NOTE: our testing included members in Tiers 2,3,4, and 5. This testing saw consistent results. It is possible that Tier 1 operates with different watermarks, but imho I doubt that is the case. Though it would not be the first time I'd be wrong.

Edited by 7ynx, 06 January 2016 - 10:58 PM.

[L Y N X]

TheRAbbi, on 24 September 2015 - 10:28 PM, said:

Good start there, 7ynx! Some questions, if I may. And I figure even if they're not asking, the new folks would like to know these answers too. After all, we just came off a match score based weekend challenge, and we're headed right into another in several hours. It would be helpful to know, then, exactly what one must do to qualify/quantify the following:

Scouting
Flanking
Brawling
Protected (light, medium, heavy, assault, as appropriate)
Lance in Formation
Counter ECM (Specifically, how long, if NARC qualifies, if TAG qualifies, can it be done with PPC fire, etc)
Savior Kill

And so on. Those are the ones we see most often, I'm sure. If you have some insight on the topic, it could only be helpful. After all, if EVERYONE in a given match makes a 300+ score, or if all but one or two on the winning team come in under 100, it makes no real difference. So let's help each other make the most of this money-making opportunity!

Thank you rabbi! I am unable to quantify an answer to your question, but I like where you are going with it. I, too, feel that the current match score too heavily weight damage dealt. I have stopped running lights and medium mechs as a result of my findings in order to improve my PSR because damage dealt is weighted so high on match score. A stealthy light pilot can pick up a kill for less than 100 damage by either head shoting over heated mechs, or back stabbing LRM boats that are unaware, or just hitting that cored CT section or even the side torso of a suspected XL engine. Thus making it much harder for average to above average light pilots to raise their PSR, the elite light pilots will have no problem, I see them score 600-800 damage routinely, so it is possible, just harder. Heavy mechs are just easier (for me) to score that kind of damage.

Lastly, I do support PGI's switch to the PSR system. I just think it needs a bit of tuning is all. For the record, I am a tier 2 pilot now and started PSR in the upper end of Tier 3. Skilling up new mechs may temporarily cause a hit to one's PSR, but I think this is to be expected.

cheers,
Lynx

Edited by 7ynx, 25 September 2015 - 09:06 AM.

[Tesunie]

7ynx, on 25 September 2015 - 09:01 AM, said:

Lastly, I do support PGI's switch to the PSR system. I just think it needs a bit of tuning is all. For the record, I am a tier 2 pilot now and started PSR in the upper end of Tier 3. Skilling up new mechs may temporarily cause a hit to one's PSR, but I think this is to be expected.

The system is a great base. I just feel it needs to be unlinked to wins and losses. Then, PSR could raise and fall by actual individual performance. Match score values would need to be adjusted (such as = results are 150-300. Going down would be beneath that, and up above). Then, win or lose your individual (not teams) performance would directly influence your PSR.


However, great work with the current PSR system. Good information here.

[L Y N X]

Good data on what goes into the MATCH score here.

[Satan n stuff]

7ynx, on 24 September 2015 - 08:38 PM, said:

Tesunie,

All my testing indicates that a losing match and match score of 330 would generate a NO CHANGE to PSR as a result.
Your win is right in line with my testing.

Thanks for sharing.

It's probably not based on match score, but on a similar metric that's weighted slightly differently. That would explain why Tesunie had a 300+ score and still lost some points in PSR. PGI probably wouldn't bother to keep the formula secret if it was the same as the match score formula.

[L Y N X]

Sns,
PSR delta is based of the match result and player match score as documented by PGI's lead developer Paul Inuoye.

All we did here was to give those match score watermarks current values. They are subject to change at PGI's discretion at any time and I believe that is why they did not share the numbers. In fact I expect them to change as the current system is good but not tuned optimally. It is too heavily based on damage dealt.

Edited by 7ynx, 29 September 2015 - 01:55 PM.

[Alekzander Smirnoff]

I've had an increase on match losses with having decent damage, assists, kills, support of various kinds (for example, I carry a tag in my BK-x-KNT's head slot to assist missile boats and reduce heat load. Spotting and tag damage etc... adds up on the match score, I've frequently gotten ='s on match losses and some increases. For the record though, this is usually in the PUG queue, group queue I get smashed lol. I'll try to record some match scores tonight and post back here with scores on losses.

[Not A Real RAbbi]

Yeah, I've been keeping tabs on this. I can do pretty awful in a WIN, and go up in PSR. I can do an above-average (for me) job in a LOSS, and go down. Not sure I've ever gone UP in a LOSS; maybe ONCE that's happened since we started keeping track. I haven't done terrible enough yet in a WIN to go down in PSR.

WIN/LOSS weighs pretty heavily on PSR tier. It SHOULD weigh, but I wonder if it doesn't weigh TOO heavily currently. Last drop I played so far today in a light, I was in a ACH-B with TAG and 4x cSPL. Did upper 400's in DMG, 4 K, 413-ish match score I think. LOSS. Came down to me versus a pretty banged-up Thunderbolt, and I screwed-up trying to drop an artillery strike on him (he was camping his own cap in Assault, after we caprushed it being behind by 2 kills). There wasn't much left of his mech, to be honest. And I'm shocked that I made it THAT long, what with an exposed torso, missing both arms (I think), and both legs in BAD shape. That WIN should be worth more to my fallen teammates, as whatever contribution they made left us, despite losing, leaving only ONE enemy mech on the battlefield, and that a pretty badly damaged one. As opposed to getting rolled 12-1 (with ME scoring the team's only kill, and that after the other 11 were down, saving SOMEONE a post-mortem assist at least), where whatever damage was done didn't amount to much at all; the enemy was left with 11/12 mechs still operating on the battlefield, almost the entire company.

So, margin and means of victory/loss SHOULD play into the PSR change, and therefore, into the match score.

AND AGAIN, here I go playing the broken record. We need to know what constitutes 'BRAWLING', 'SCOUTING', 'PROTECTED LIGHT/MEDIUM/HEAVY/ASSAULT', and so on.

Yeah, maybe we're all PSR-obsessed right now. Could be. But video games have conditioned that in us for DECADES. Who played PacMan just for the fun, and never paid attention to the Top Score or to raising their own personal best score? Huh? NO ONE. That's who. Now we know if we're on the leaderboard (Tier 1 or not?), and we know what needs to improve to get us there. SCORE. That is, PSR.

How do you improve PSR? You play a heavy or assault, one of the meta-favorites, in a meta build, and you focus on DPS. Oh, you like to do recon? Cool. Enjoy Tier 5, LOSER! You're really quite magnificent at fire support? Well, better be able to average 800 D and 4 K per game, or you'll be supporting in the basement, FREAK! No, do the meta thing that everyone else does, or suck it. There is no recognition for any other role, no matter how loudly PGI proclaim their support of ROLE WARFARE FTW! (That 'W' stands for LOSS, unless your role is meta-brawler.)

Simply buffing/nerfing certain mechs' sensor quirks isn't going to solve this, because the PSR scores for anything other than MDK just aren't worth specializing for.

I've done ONE drop in a heavy in over 2 weeks. EBJ-B, cGauss, 5x cERML. Qualifying match for the current challenge. I SUCK at Gauss, I SUCK at HPG Manifold, and I got > 300 with a Gauss-centric build on HPG Manifold, one that I haven't run in weeks.

Go out there with the SHCs and ACHs, and it's maybe every second or third match that qualifies, even though I do better relatively speaking in those. I do MORE, anyway. I spot more enemies, I communicate more with the team, I counter more ECM, and so on. And it's JUST NOT WORTH IT unless I'm comfortable in the Underhive.

And I am.

F*** being a tryhard. That's about as boring as this game gets. It's also what's rewarded in this game.

We really need someone to get on that "Captain Tryhard and MetaGirl" comic...

[Satan n stuff]

7ynx, on 29 September 2015 - 01:51 PM, said:

Sns,
PSR delta is based of the match result and player match score as documented by PGI's lead developer Paul Inuoye.

All we did here was to give those match score watermarks current values. They are subject to change at PGI's discretion at any time and I believe that is why they did not share the numbers. In fact I expect them to change as the current system is good but not tuned optimally. It is too heavily based on damage dealt.

I read that post and while the graph does say match score, previous posts regarding PSR made it clear that the exact formula will be kept secret, which would be completely pointless if it was the match score formula as I already stated. Keeping only the benchmark numbers secret when the rest of the system is already known would be equally pointless because you've just demonstrated how easy it would be to find those.
The fact that your explanation fails to account for a particular result means it must be flawed. This could be due to PGI tweaking values or it could be because you're making assumptions about how the system actually works, but you won't know that until you've tested it thoroughly.
You can document various ways of reaching match scores around your watermarks to find out if any of them give unexpected results and try to come up with a more accurate system, but don't pretend you've found the definitive answer when your research is based on an unproven assumption.

[L Y N X]

No unexpected results, and I gained additional data points to narrow down the high watermark at a match score of 400.

SNS, please do share with me your assumption on which assumption I've made regarding an unproven assumption? I am not understanding you. I am not providing anything definitive, just the matchscore as they are currently for the match score water marks in Paul Inouye's graph. I have shared all my findings. Test them yourself if you are still a skeptic?