23 replies to this topic

[DailyFrankPeter]

This is possibly some ongoing discussion, but "PCC hit detection" search does not yield what I'm looking for.

I'm curious if anyone else gets this: apparently a PPC bolt can miss going between the legs of a target or otherwise very narrowly (such as, because of being mounted on another hardpoint and not having time to converge). On the other hand, when going around a tree or above terrain a PPC bolt seems to be assumed by the system to be nearly the size of a mech! (if there isn't a gap I can walk through, I can't shoot through it - a tree will block a shot even though you didn't hit a trunk, and so will a rock, which evidently is not quite in the way). The visual cue is as if there was an invisible wall.

Somehow firing lasers or ballistics is not prone to this issue (as much at least). A shell goes through foliage no problem and I get a successful hit marker.

Is this lag, a bug or a feature?

Edited by DailyFrankPeter, 18 October 2015 - 08:04 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

DailyFrankPeter, on 18 October 2015 - 05:53 AM, said:

Is this lag, a bug or a feature?

since it's PGI? Probably all 3.

[Mycrus]

Bishop Steiner, on 18 October 2015 - 05:57 AM, said:

since it's PGI? Probably all 3.

So are you in our black knight phase?

Must have thought you were special huh?

[Bishop Steiner]

Mycrus, on 18 October 2015 - 06:06 AM, said:

So are you in our black knight phase?

Must have thought you were special huh?

must of thought I gave a crap what you thought, huh?

Hate to break it to you, I have never been a Black Knight, or a White Knight. I have given PGI grief when it was merited, and defended when people were being dbags or short sighted. The fact that some people, like yourself, apparently, can only go one way or the other, not my problem. I have always had an issue with PGIs hitreg/invisible walls/lag shields. Have been on them about lack of balance in the clans since they were released. And I could spend all day building a list. I also give them credit for doing better in 2014, and to a lesser degree, 2015, than in 2013, on various things.

The fact some folk here are so myopic they need to label everything as black and white, it allows me the amusement of running my siggy.

So by all means, please cling to your labels if it makes the world easier for you to cope.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 18 October 2015 - 06:36 AM.

[Osteo2001]

I've noticed the same issues and a few others with my dual ERPPC / 3 MLS Thunderbolt.

Besides the above (needing a mech sized opening to get the bolts through - specifically on the new maps), I've noticed that damage registration can be borked.

Sometimes It appears only one of the 2 PPC's hits (but not just on legs, can be rest of mech as well) as I do more damage if I use chain instead of group (based on paper doll's in the testing ground). Also, sometimes it registers a rear armor hit when hitting CT (I understand splash damage but front to back w/o hitting side torso or head? I'd understand this mechanic if it were a Gauss in the books due to penetration, but PPC???)

So... I use chain more often as it disrupts the ECM for a longer period of time and seems to do more damage overall and try not to shoot through small openings with the PPC's.

[crustydog]

I like when the ppc goes right through the mech - that's extra special:)

[oldradagast]

PPC's are borked for hit-reg. They can skim a leaf and explode, or go right between the smallest gap on a mech and keep on sailing. And even if they hit, do they really register damage?

But, hey - at least nobody is boating them anymore, and if we get that stupid "crosshairs won't flash on an unlocked target hit" feature on the PTS into play, you'll never really know if you hit or not, so problem "solved!"

[DailyFrankPeter]

Thanks for sharing guys.

I don't understand why the same hit model isn't used as for ballistics, since that one works. Save coding time. Save trees. And nobody would know the difference (well, I mean they would know compared to now - because it would work).

[DailyFrankPeter]

crustydog, on 18 October 2015 - 07:05 AM, said:

I like when the ppc goes right through the mech - that's extra special:)

Maybe they're extra special, exotic particles. You know, the kind that doesn't give a sh** about matter.

It only makes sense to make weapons out of them.

[KHETTI]

70% of the time PPC/ERPPC/cERPPC don't register damage, no point in having them in game really, tbh more than half the weapons in this game could be safely removed without breaking the builds 90% of the population uses.
As long as we have goose and lazorz!.

[DAYLEET]

KHETTI, on 18 October 2015 - 07:53 AM, said:

70% of the time PPC/ERPPC/cERPPC don't register damage, no point in having them in game really, tbh more than half the weapons in this game could be safely removed without breaking the builds 90% of the population uses.
As long as we have goose and lazorz!.

70% is a big and bold number but they center torso miss a lot thats for sure. Ran my ppc panthers for days last week, normal and pts server and too often you have hits that never deal damage. Then i also miss 70% of my shots:/

[JaxRiot]

Ive noticed all of the same things brought up here regarding the PPC's.

When trying to shoot around terrain, building, trees, ect, the PPC bolt is as big as a Shadow Cat and will clip trees and objects that are 150m away making me have to compensate a lot when shooting.

But when I shoot at the legs of a Raven thats standing still at 200m away, it will pass right through the legs not hitting any part of the Raven. Which seems odd to me since the bolt usually seems bigger than the Raven itself. It should have hit the entire side of the Raven.

Ive also noticed what others here have said about firing two PPC's. It always seems as if only one is registering a hit.

[KHETTI]

DAYLEET, on 18 October 2015 - 08:16 AM, said:

70% is a big and bold number but they center torso miss a lot thats for sure. Ran my ppc panthers for days last week, normal and pts server and too often you have hits that never deal damage. Then i also miss 70% of my shots:/

I have a particular fondness of cERPPCs, i've just stopped using them, currently they aren't worth it.

[DailyFrankPeter]

JaxRiot, on 18 October 2015 - 08:39 AM, said:

Ive noticed all of the same things brought up here regarding the PPC's.

When trying to shoot around terrain, building, trees, ect, the PPC bolt is as big as a Shadow Cat and will clip trees and objects that are 150m away making me have to compensate a lot when shooting.

But when I shoot at the legs of a Raven thats standing still at 200m away, it will pass right through the legs not hitting any part of the Raven. Which seems odd to me since the bolt usually seems bigger than the Raven itself. It should have hit the entire side of the Raven.

Ive also noticed what others here have said about firing two PPC's. It always seems as if only one is registering a hit.

I tell you, it's particle physics. There is only a "probability" of particle existing at a particular spot, just as there is a probability of a Raven being where you think it is...

Seriously though, I remember there was this whole issue with Battlefield 4 not registering hits, while using 10Hz network tick rate under the hood. This was apparently fixed by using 30Hz.

Edited by DailyFrankPeter, 18 October 2015 - 09:13 AM.

[ChrisTop]

This might help explain a few of these instances.

https://steamcommuni...h?v=aVmqv3z4gnA

[Grey Ghost]

I remember an older discussion about PPC hitreg where someone posted that the size of the PPC Projectile (server side) was not the same as what we see visually (client side). I'm not sure if it was fact or just a rumor, but they said it was quite small in comparison.

ChrisTop, on 18 October 2015 - 03:09 PM, said:

This might help explain a few of these instances.

https://steamcommuni...h?v=aVmqv3z4gnA

I recall there being a problem where the servers had the wrong Tickrate for a while that tanked the Hit Registration across the board. Now if I remember correctly, a Dev said it was reset to it's normal setting of 30 in order to fix it.

That is less than half the Tickrate people complained about for CS:GO in that video linked above. The way the difference between 64 & 128 Tickrate was described is surely more pronounced at only 30 Tickrate. Might make some sense when thinking of all the weapons that randomly fail to connect.

[Mycrus]

Bishop Steiner, on 18 October 2015 - 06:33 AM, said:

must of thought I gave a crap what you thought, huh?

Hate to break it to you, I have never been a Black Knight, or a White Knight. I have given PGI grief when it was merited, and defended when people were being dbags or short sighted. The fact that some people, like yourself, apparently, can only go one way or the other, not my problem. I have always had an issue with PGIs hitreg/invisible walls/lag shields. Have been on them about lack of balance in the clans since they were released. And I could spend all day building a list. I also give them credit for doing better in 2014, and to a lesser degree, 2015, than in 2013, on various things.

The fact some folk here are so myopic they need to label everything as black and white, it allows me the amusement of running my siggy.

So by all means, please cling to your labels if it makes the world easier for you to cope.

A little bird told me that you got in trouble with the law and was surly since...

Stay positive sunshine coz nobody likes a gray knight...

[DailyFrankPeter]

I have noticed that in 3rd person I can glimpse the white direction arrow THROUGH my mech (i.e. I can see between LT and CT, especially with antialiasing off).

This makes me wonder: if individual components are separate entities - there is no visual connection and they register each their own hits - I wonder if they can sometimes unsync in the eyes of the server, making the space between them larger.

Edited by DailyFrankPeter, 19 October 2015 - 12:46 PM.

[Reptilizer]

oldradagast, on 18 October 2015 - 07:20 AM, said:

*snip*
But, hey - at least nobody is boating them anymore
*snip*

Nonsense!!!

[Jack Dawes]

JaxRiot, on 18 October 2015 - 08:39 AM, said:

Ive noticed all of the same things brought up here regarding the PPC's.

When trying to shoot around terrain, building, trees, ect, the PPC bolt is as big as a Shadow Cat and will clip trees and objects that are 150m away making me have to compensate a lot when shooting.

But when I shoot at the legs of a Raven thats standing still at 200m away, it will pass right through the legs not hitting any part of the Raven. Which seems odd to me since the bolt usually seems bigger than the Raven itself. It should have hit the entire side of the Raven.

Ive also noticed what others here have said about firing two PPC's. It always seems as if only one is registering a hit.

This has been a problem for a long time. Go to the Caustic practice field and try them out. They may hit (reticle turns red), but the paper doll shows no damage. You can fire until you shutdown from heat and it's hit or miss as to whether your stationary mech can hit the other stationary mech. Throw movement into the mix and you have...nothing.