178 replies to this topic

[Gas Guzzler]

Nerfing long range weapons also doesn't address IS MPL and cSPL brawling dominance.

[Tesunie]

My problem isn't with SRM damage when they hit and register. My problem is with SRM damage actually registering when they hit, and all SRMs registering when they hit.

I often times have SRMs that hit and do no damage, or all of them hit a single location (I was really close, closer than I probably should have been) and I seemed to only deal 2 points of damage to that component...

I think Hit Registration is what needs correction, not the weapons (or at least not SRMs). I can get my SSRMs to work and deal damage fine though...

[DONTOR]

Sader325, on 05 October 2015 - 01:39 PM, said:

I love SRMS.

This is unnecessary.

Why?

http://www.twitch.tv/sader325


*EDIT*

Odd, match video ****** up.

Oh well 5 kill 450 damage game with a SRM maddog on river city in response to this post.

Next game

4 kills 500 damage.

SRMS are fine, up your game.

*EDIT*

Yay stream fixed.

You should be getting ALOT more than 500 damage with an SRM brawler, damage probably isn't registering. SRMs are in a bad place.

[Khobai]

Quote

Nerfing the heavier/hotter long range weapons will push this game more in the direction of mindless zerg rush brawling.

That would only happen if brawling was superior to long range.

the goal is to find the sweet spot between the two.

Quote

Nerfing long range weapons also doesn't address IS MPL and cSPL brawling dominance.

its lasers/gauss that need nerfs.

not only would that nerf long range but it includes clan small pulse lasers as well.

Edited by Khobai, 05 October 2015 - 02:41 PM.

[Sader325]

DONTOR, on 05 October 2015 - 02:36 PM, said:

You should be getting ALOT more than 500 damage with an SRM brawler, damage probably isn't registering. SRMs are in a bad place.

Why?

I used 300 missiles out of 750 and did 500 damage. that means I missed 100 damage worth of missiles.

Damage registers just fine. Was just playing conservativly.

My highest damage game was 1400 damage in a maddog with 1600 damage worth of missiles.

I never have hitreg problems with SRMS.

[Tesunie]

DONTOR, on 05 October 2015 - 02:36 PM, said:

You should be getting ALOT more than 500 damage with an SRM brawler, damage probably isn't registering. SRMs are in a bad place.

Though SRMs are the biggest culprits, I notice damage vanishing with every weapon in the game, including lasers (but to less of a degree).

When I unload a LL and 2 MLs into a stationary Arctic Cheetah with red internal CT... and he doesn't die forget about taking any damage... It hurts. (Especially when his return fire in our dual killed me, and I saw him take many more hits and still not die... And no. This is no complaint on the Cheetah. It's not specific to it.)

[bad arcade kitty]

what they actually should have done ages ago it's to greatly tighten srm spread

Edited by bad arcade kitty, 05 October 2015 - 02:46 PM.

[Johnny Z]

Mcgral18, on 05 October 2015 - 02:11 PM, said:

Because aside from the Flamer and MG, they are the worst offenders. All ACs can be used at longer range to better effect.


SRMs have poor travel speed, the 6s have a nearly 12M CoF, and they simply lack a punch to be worth the tiny range.


Bring lasers, and you have a better short-to-mid range mech, that kills more efficiently.


I have to doubt anyone who says otherwise. They're an ineffective weapon system.



When a weapon has a sub 300M MAXIMUM range, it's not much of a TTK decrease, because most weapons kill you faster at longer range than SRMs.


Having SRMs be better brawling weapons than Lasers would be good for the game.

Only for fast mechs. there are alot of slow mechs on the Inner Sphere side that could not take advantage of this at all and be victim to it when ever it suited the Omni mech pilot. As is the case already in the case of the Streak Crow and other missile boaters Clan side.

[Rofl]

Sader325, on 05 October 2015 - 02:40 PM, said:

Why?
I used 300 missiles out of 750 and did 500 damage. that means I missed 100 damage worth of missiles.
Damage registers just fine. Was just playing conservativly.
My highest damage game was 1400 damage in a maddog with 1600 damage worth of missiles.
I never have hitreg problems with SRMS.

Did those mechs have any other weapons? It's possible some of your damage came from secondary weapons as well. I don't think we can track damage data so far per match as to tell what weapon did what amount of damage.

[Mcgral18]

Johnny Z, on 05 October 2015 - 02:50 PM, said:

Only for fast mechs. there are alot of slow mechs on the Inner Sphere side that could not take advantage of this at all and be victim to it when ever it suited the Omni mech pilot. As is the case already in the case of the Streak Crow and other missile boaters Clan side.

Which is why you look at post 3, and notice the Clam SRMs get smaller buffs for their tonnage boosts. They still need buffs, because SRMs are a sad weapon system.


Faster travel speed also increases their effective range, so the Atlai can use them to 290M with the better travel speed+module.

[Khobai]

Quote

what they actually should have done ages ago it's to greatly tighten srm spread

nah the game needs less pinpoint damage not more.

what they needed to do ages ago was employ weapon mechanics which got rid of pinpoint damage.

TTK is at all time pathetically low levels. Anything that makes TTK even lower is NOT good for the game.

Edited by Khobai, 05 October 2015 - 02:55 PM.

[Weeny Machine]

Sader325, on 05 October 2015 - 02:40 PM, said:

Why?

I used 300 missiles out of 750 and did 500 damage. that means I missed 100 damage worth of missiles.

Damage registers just fine. Was just playing conservativly.

My highest damage game was 1400 damage in a maddog with 1600 damage worth of missiles.

I never have hitreg problems with SRMS.

Damage doesn't register fine at all.
I had several matches were I shot point blank on the backs of unmoving assaults (Huggin and Oxide). The damage numbers were so low I was flabbergasted and ranged between a loss of 25% up to 50% damage. Once more: there was no effing way those missiles could have missed. This was last weekend. I suppose the server load has something to do with it because during workdays the damage loss seems to be lower.

[Gas Guzzler]

Khobai, on 05 October 2015 - 02:39 PM, said:

That would only happen if brawling was superior to long range.

the goal is to find the sweet spot between the two.

I don't know, groups zerg rush brawl all the time.

[Kira Onime]

Won't make people take SRMS because pinpoint > spread.
The low range of SRMs is also a big downside.

[Gas Guzzler]

Khobai, on 05 October 2015 - 02:54 PM, said:

nah the game needs less pinpoint damage not more.

what they needed to do ages ago was employ weapon mechanics which got rid of pinpoint damage.

TTK is at all time pathetically low levels. Anything that makes TTK even lower is NOT good for the game.

I don't know, all day yesterday I was managing to stay alive in a Black Knight, despite its pathetically bad CT and pathetically low TTK. Typically managed to lose all armor across my torsos and arms before finally dying.

The problem is, people poke their head out when/where they shouldn't and get insta-killed leading to the illusion of low TTK. I'm not really sure what people use as the baseline for what TTK "should" be. It sounds like its pretty arbitrary, and people want to be forgiven for not thinking about what they are doing.

*shrugs*

[bad arcade kitty]

Khobai, on 05 October 2015 - 02:54 PM, said:

nah the game needs less pinpoint damage not more.

what they needed to do ages ago was employ weapon mechanics which got rid of pinpoint damage.

TTK is at all time pathetically low levels. Anything that makes TTK even lower is NOT good for the game.

brawling weapons don't deserve pinpoint damage, only long ranged weapon does :^)

that's the reason why long range weapon can even outbrawl srms

[Nightmare1]

Given the fact that SRM hit reg will probably never be fixed...

...I heartily approve of the OP's statement!!!

And while we're on the subject, can we get MG damage buffed back up to 1 please?

[Alwrathandabout42ninjas]

Nightmare1, on 05 October 2015 - 03:10 PM, said:

Given the fact that SRM hit reg will probably never be fixed...

...I heartily approve of the OP's statement!!!

And while we're on the subject, can we get MG damage buffed back up to 1 please?

This is a good point presented so far from multiple people, hit reg, although better, can sometimes cause your srm's to do little to no damage, even if you hit with them. Honestly, with 64 alpha laserpuke mechs running around with better hit detection and superior range, 3 damage srm's would really help the game overall I think, and get us out of this stale play style we call meta.

Edited by Alwrath, 05 October 2015 - 03:19 PM.

[Nightmare1]

Alwrath, on 05 October 2015 - 03:18 PM, said:

This is a good point presented so far from multiple people, hit reg, although better, can sometimes cause your srm's to do little to no damage, even if you hit with them. Honestly, with 64 alpha laserpuke mechs running around with better hit detection and superior range, 3 damage srm's would really help the game overall I think, and get us out of this stale play style we call meta.

If I recall correctly, we used to have them close to 3 damage. Then the Buckton fix rolled out and SRMs worked wonderfully well, so they nerfed the damage back down.

...Then PGI broke hit reg again and has neither deigned to boost the damage back up or to reapply the Buckton fix. It's sad.

[zagibu]

I don't think simple SRM buffs such as damage or travel speed will change the laser meta. It's just not a good idea to take an unreliable weapon system, no matter how good it can be in the best case.