104 replies to this topic

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

saKhan Ds00 Kerensky, on 13 October 2015 - 06:09 AM, said:

I'm curious as to how many people who are buying the Warhammer and Marauder packs intend on sticking with Lore weapon loadouts?

Why I ask, is both mechs were very dependent on PPC's for their "punch". With how PGI has poorly balanced PPC's, it seems more likely players will dump those and grab laser weapons if they actually want to be more useful.

On secondary notes, what about the Warhammer's iconic SRM-6? Is just one really that useful to justify the tonnage in this game for that size of mech when it could obviously use a few more heat sinks?

What about the Marauder's AC5 mount? Is a single one enough to warrant it, or who's going to chance a UAC and have it jam unpredictably? Gauss?

Side note thoughts/rant:
I don't know. I think with PGI finally releasing the major nostalgic icons of Battletech it made me realize that the awesome things about those mechs and what made them nostalgic to me... are pretty much bad in PGI's version of Battletech and in order to survive to the end of a 12 vs. 12 match, I'd have to bastardize that which I held nostalgic to the point it might as well be just another mech.

As someone who runs the CTF 3D as a Marauder, and my Grasshoppers at Warhammers, I can attest to you that I will be running these actual iconic mechs with mostly-stock configurations. With some minor changes, the "Flavor" of my builds will always be in line.

They will likely always utilize the dual PPC they are known for, in the case of the Warhammer, the SRM6 will be there, but I may be removing the dual MG's in favor for heatsinks. [2mlas 2slas as backup is fine.]

The UAC5 in place of an AC5 on the Marauder is easily doable, and I haven't had too many issues doing this with my cataphract that I'm using to proxy... though I'll likely keep the standard AC5 with a cooldown module.

I think the biggest change I'll likely make to these mechs, is updating them to a "3039" configuration, which is a simple retrofit of Double Heatsinks inplace of the singles to help with heat dissipation.

[Malagant]

In response to the OP's question, why bother sticking to lore on builds? This really isn't Battletech anymore anyway, if it ever was...

[GreyNovember]

Two PPCs make me light food.

At least, that's what I'd think if I was in a fast brawler light, and I found a Marauder MORE OR LESS away from his team.

Jump in, facehug, and kill his legs. Because he probably under armored them to carry a bigger engine/heat sinks.

[jss78]

Not sure if if'll ever get the MAD/WHM (lean towards lighter mechs), but I run many of my mechs kind of half-stock. I'll certainly add Endo/Ferro, and I'll then modify the weapon loadout a bit, but I try to keep the essential flavour.

For example, the SHD-2D has possibly the least MWO-viable stock loadout of all (AC5, 2xML, 2xSRM2, LRM5). But I find if I up the AC to an AC10, add a third ML, and use SSRM2's only for missiles, it gets just enough mid-range focus to pull its weight in MWO. Meanwhile, it retains the essence of a lore Shadow Hawk (shoulder AC, arm lasers, guided missiles), and is super fun to run.

As far as MAD/WHM, bless all of you who'll keep running the PPC arms. You'll look awesome.

[Vellron2005]

Mister D, on 13 October 2015 - 08:09 AM, said:

Really just want to run this build.

2 PPCs a Holly & MGs.

Call me nostalgic of those "days of hope"... but the game STILL does not look as good as that promo video.. and it's been, what, 4 years?

I run it on a 1.500$ gaming rig.. doesn't look anything like that..

I know its a "promo video" and not actual gameplay.. I just wish it was actual gameplay..

Not that the game looks bad or anything.. but still.. wish It looked like that..

[LordMelvin]

I'm definitely running the WHM-6R and the MAD-3R "Stock Plus", that is with DHS, Endo, and some tweaks to ammo/armor counts. If only I could have the CMG sounds for my ISMGs...

I've had solid performance using a stock Hellbringer Prime (ECM and light equipment not withstanding), and using an Orion-K for a Marauder build has also netted me reasonable results. I know the HBR benefits massively from the CXL engine, but I can't imagine the WHM or MAD being any less agile than the Orion so I'll play around with STD 300s and see how things go.

Vellron2005, on 23 November 2015 - 04:47 AM, said:

Call me nostalgic of those "days of hope"... but the game STILL does not look as good as that promo video.. and it's been, what, 4 years?

I run it on a 1.500$ gaming rig.. doesn't look anything like that..

I know its a "promo video" and not actual gameplay.. I just wish it was actual gameplay..

Not that the game looks bad or anything.. but still.. wish It looked like that..

That game was also never MWO. That was going to be our single player Mechwarrior reboot (Mechwarrior 5 if you will). When Harmony Gold stomped it in the head early, we got MWO instead.

Edited by LordMelvin, 23 November 2015 - 01:25 PM.

[Tombstoner]

saKhan Ds00 Kerensky, on 13 October 2015 - 06:09 AM, said:

I'm curious as to how many people who are buying the Warhammer and Marauder packs intend on sticking with Lore weapon loadouts?

Why I ask, is both mechs were very dependent on PPC's for their "punch". With how PGI has poorly balanced PPC's, it seems more likely players will dump those and grab laser weapons if they actually want to be more useful.

On secondary notes, what about the Warhammer's iconic SRM-6? Is just one really that useful to justify the tonnage in this game for that size of mech when it could obviously use a few more heat sinks?

What about the Marauder's AC5 mount? Is a single one enough to warrant it, or who's going to chance a UAC and have it jam unpredictably? Gauss?

Side note thoughts/rant:
I don't know. I think with PGI finally releasing the major nostalgic icons of Battletech it made me realize that the awesome things about those mechs and what made them nostalgic to me... are pretty much bad in PGI's version of Battletech and in order to survive to the end of a 12 vs. 12 match, I'd have to bastardize that which I held nostalgic to the point it might as well be just another mech.

You are completely correct in your assessment.
Personally id use 2x gauss in the mg slots..... that underscores lots of issues with this game.

[Silas7]

As a new player, the mech concept of the warhammer made me want to try the game. As the only history I have with the universe was mechwarrior 2 and was too young to have the patience to learn, I'll be keeping the ppc's. As it would just feel wrong not to, especially with arm design like that. For the rest I'll play around with all of my c-bills and find what I like best.

[DAYLEET]

saKhan Ds00 Kerensky, on 13 October 2015 - 06:09 AM, said:

With how PGI has poorly balanced PPC's,

It's not how PGI balanced ppcs it's how PGI balanced match score. Ppc's being better than LL will score poorly over LL. less match score, less damage and less cbills. Can;t blame anyone for not going through the trouble to aim ppcs when nooby lasers reward more.

[Cyborne Elemental]

Sure, when PPC's stop sucking.

All PPC's are still too slow for their effective range bracket, LL and LPL just work better.

PPC not enough punch, ERPPC completely out of reach for 99% of mechs because they're too freaking hot.

Why use 1 ERPPC, when you can be doing 22 damage for the same heat with a pair LPL, and the LPL give you much higher hit success?

Its same problem with AC-10 vs other weapons, its just too freaking slow to be reliable within its range of 450 meters.

Edited by Mister D, 25 December 2015 - 12:17 AM.

[Nauht]

Still playing ppcs/AC in all my MADs.
Tried other configs and I instantly lost the feeling of being in a Marauder. Just felt any other laservomit generic mech.

[Silas7]

Nothing wrong with lasers, they are fun and cool. Just because they are popular for competitve reasons doesn't mean they deserve all the hate going around.

[JesterMWO]

I've swapped Ppcs for large lasers and large pulse lasers on my Marauders as I never seem to do well with PPCs. I did manage to do ok with a quad PPC build in one match so that is a viable build.

[Lykaon]

saKhan Ds00 Kerensky, on 13 October 2015 - 06:09 AM, said:

I'm curious as to how many people who are buying the Warhammer and Marauder packs intend on sticking with Lore weapon loadouts?

Why I ask, is both mechs were very dependent on PPC's for their "punch". With how PGI has poorly balanced PPC's, it seems more likely players will dump those and grab laser weapons if they actually want to be more useful.

On secondary notes, what about the Warhammer's iconic SRM-6? Is just one really that useful to justify the tonnage in this game for that size of mech when it could obviously use a few more heat sinks?

What about the Marauder's AC5 mount? Is a single one enough to warrant it, or who's going to chance a UAC and have it jam unpredictably? Gauss?

Side note thoughts/rant:
I don't know. I think with PGI finally releasing the major nostalgic icons of Battletech it made me realize that the awesome things about those mechs and what made them nostalgic to me... are pretty much bad in PGI's version of Battletech and in order to survive to the end of a 12 vs. 12 match, I'd have to bastardize that which I held nostalgic to the point it might as well be just another mech.

Nope no way PPCs are under performing a single AC is ok but if two or three fit in there then why only one?

I have a 3R with 4 medium lasers 2 AC5s and 1 AC2. A BH2 with 5 medium lasers AC20 and jumpjets, A 5D with artemis LRM15s essentially nothing near a true marauder because those builds are terrible in MWo.

[Wolfways]

saKhan Ds00 Kerensky, on 13 October 2015 - 06:09 AM, said:

Side note thoughts/rant:
I don't know. I think with PGI finally releasing the major nostalgic icons of Battletech it made me realize that the awesome things about those mechs and what made them nostalgic to me... are pretty much bad in PGI's version of Battletech and in order to survive to the end of a 12 vs. 12 match, I'd have to bastardize that which I held nostalgic to the point it might as well be just another mech.

That's how I feel about every mech i like. MWO, not a BattleTech game

[Bishop Steiner]

Wolfways, on 25 December 2015 - 08:10 AM, said:

That's how I feel about every mech i like. MWO, not a BattleTech game

Well, in fairness, translating TT to FPS.... Battletech not an FPS game.

Not a lot one can do to overcome hardpoint location and hitbox/geometry reality. Not sure that one can really be pinned on PGI.

[Wolfways]

Bishop Steiner, on 25 December 2015 - 10:31 AM, said:

Well, in fairness, translating TT to FPS.... Battletech not an FPS game.

Not a lot one can do to overcome hardpoint location and hitbox/geometry reality. Not sure that one can really be pinned on PGI.

Well I know the hitbox geometry isn't their fault but they've been changing hitboxes on IS mechs to make them "better" which is understandable for things like the HBK hunch, but the clan mechs are like paper compared to IS mechs and all pgi do is nerf them.
Playing CW in clan pugs is horrible. Even some IS players in the matches I've had have have said that CW is boring because there's no challenge for them.

And let's not forget that they used TT stats but increased RoF without decreasing damage and heat generation. That is solely on pgi.

[Ihasa]

probably not. As gameplay proves, lore builds mostly suck.

[Chados]

Some weeks into the Marauder, I still run the 3R on a variant of stock. I pack PPCs, ML, and either a uAC5 or LBX10, and STD300s. The 5D, well, I ran the 3D lore build of PPCs, MLs, one LL for awhile but no PPC velocity quirk, so I changed up and went with 4 ML, 2ALRM15, one LL, XL300. The 3M, STD300, 4 LL, AC5. On the BH2 I'm trying 7 ML and an AC20.

Of all five, it is the 5M that is my best, the LL and AC5 are a good combo. But the most overall fun? The 3R builds. I REALLY wish we could get a uAC jam chance reduction on the 3R to go with the PPC velocity quirk!

[Bishop Steiner]

Wolfways, on 26 December 2015 - 04:50 AM, said:

Well I know the hitbox geometry isn't their fault but they've been changing hitboxes on IS mechs to make them "better" which is understandable for things like the HBK hunch, but the clan mechs are like paper compared to IS mechs and all pgi do is nerf them.
Playing CW in clan pugs is horrible. Even some IS players in the matches I've had have have said that CW is boring because there's no challenge for them.

And let's not forget that they used TT stats but increased RoF without decreasing damage and heat generation. That is solely on pgi.

well, the weapon fire is based on (though not identical to) Solaris 7 dueling rules. And while on paper they didn't decrease damage, they actually did because they doubled armor and structure across the board. Reducing weapon damage more would give every weapon a very weak and boring "papercut" feel, and actually make the "big guns" even less appealing than boating smaller guns.

Also, most non IIC Clan Mechs feel fine for toughness. They generally roll damage better than most people seem to admit or realize, still have clan XLs and still in general, outgun their counterparts. In particular, I never have felt the Clan Heavies terribly "soft" aside from the Mad Dogs STs, Stormcrows and Cheetahs seem to ignore damage quite often due to geometry and hit reg. Direwolf ain't fragile, per se, but it's compounded by being unable to reposition if it get's itself in a bad way. Heck, I'm still driving my stock Summoner -P with it's 9 tons (3/4s of max armor) of armor and roll damage on it like a champ. Pretty much always out of ammo and fighting with just my PPC long before I get killed.

I will agree that some IS mechs like the Blackjacks are overquirked though, especially on toughness. And the 4 IICs are curesed because they are all based on IS mechs with bad geometry.... and then made even boxier.