344 replies to this topic

[Eco]

more QQ from being owned...

[Tennex]

it shoudl be limited so that all these mechs the developers are making don't feel monotonous and interchangeable.

[Sayyid]

MWHawke, on 13 November 2012 - 08:57 AM, said:

When you say variant, what does that mean? It means customized right? Your English fails.

LOL FAIL!

Variant, variation.

Factory variants are built and designed or ENGINEERED by the factory, not by some slob with a crecent wrench and a hammer in a garage.

REAL LIFE EXAMPLE.

Kid with a Honda Civic 1993 DX model takes the D15 out and puts in a D16. Is not redesigning the car, they are swaping out engines for another stock engine that is found in that car.

Same kid takes the SAME car and takes out the D15, and tries to put a 351 Windser in it. Not going to happen. He would need to fabricate, or in simplest terms MAKE, engine mounts, move the engine bulk head aka Firewall, make the car rear wheel drive, mount a rear differential, and put in a real transmission not just a transaxle.

Samething is true in mechs. You cant take a pre-engineered bit of military machinery and simply slap a larger gun on it and hope for the best.

You cant put a 155mm Howitzer in a M1 Abrams turret
You cant put the M256 120mm the turret of a M2 Bradley
You cant put a M2HB .50cal upper reciever on a M16A2
You cant put a 40mm Bofors in a F16C Falcon in place of the 20mm Vulcan.

Somethings are just facts of life. Live with it, adapt to it, and overcome it.

[Odanan]

Wolv e, on 09 July 2012 - 03:28 PM, said:

Aye, hard point are fine, but still does not prevent "unreasonable" mech configs..

What is an "unreasonable" mech config? I tell you what: the stock variants.
Boats are efficient. The people who made the Battletech game is either naive either not-very-bright (to be kind) to design all those crappy stock mechs.

I think the hardpoint system is enough. But I agree you should pay a high price to do any custom job in your mech (like there was in the MW2:Mercs).

[Harrison Kelly]

Half of the fun of Mechwarrior is getting to build your own Mech.

Sorry for all the TT purists who are slavishly devoted to "realism" and "stock variants" but 1) 90% of stock variants suck in this game. Just look at trial mechs. Why would I ever WANT to drive something that awful when I can make up my own stuff? 2) TT has stupidly unrealistic things in it too, case in point "Ammo in the legs." Who's to say what's realistic in a game with giant stompy walking tanks?

Can't say I'm in favor of limiting more customization and all the talk about "hurr durr the IS couldn't modify their own Mechs" is weak at best; custom variants were always part of the game by the 3049 timeline AFAIK.

[vifoxe]

Winters Flight, on 09 July 2012 - 03:38 PM, said:

Actually, a PPC on a light mech is cannon.

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Panther

Obviously, there are some trades in weight and speed to mount such a large weapon on a small Mech, but they make excellent scout hunters and cheap direct fire support.

Yea, but if every light can fit a ppc then where's the flavor?

I'll say it now and I'll say it as many times as it takes.

**** your lore, balance the game.

Edited by vifoxe, 13 November 2012 - 12:58 PM.

[Odanan]

Sayyid, on 13 November 2012 - 12:36 PM, said:

You cant take a pre-engineered bit of military machinery and simply slap a larger gun on it and hope for the best.

You cant put a 155mm Howitzer in a M1 Abrams turret
You cant put the M256 120mm the turret of a M2 Bradley
You cant put a M2HB .50cal upper reciever on a M16A2
You cant put a 40mm Bofors in a F16C Falcon in place of the 20mm Vulcan.

Somethings are just facts of life. Live with it, adapt to it, and overcome it.

You can customize any vehicle. It won't be cheat though.

Edited by Odanan, 13 November 2012 - 01:06 PM.

[Odanan]

Harrison Kelly, on 13 November 2012 - 12:54 PM, said:

Half of the fun of Mechwarrior is getting to build your own Mech.

Sorry for all the TT purists who are slavishly devoted to "realism" and "stock variants" but 1) 90% of stock variants suck in this game. Just look at trial mechs. Why would I ever WANT to drive something that awful when I can make up my own stuff? 2) TT has stupidly unrealistic things in it too, case in point "Ammo in the legs." Who's to say what's realistic in a game with giant stompy walking tanks?

Can't say I'm in favor of limiting more customization and all the talk about "hurr durr the IS couldn't modify their own Mechs" is weak at best; custom variants were always part of the game by the 3049 timeline AFAIK.

This. ^

[Sayyid]

Odanan, on 13 November 2012 - 12:58 PM, said:

You can customize any vehicle. It won't be cheat though.

I think you mean cheap.

And none of those were done without engineering. You cant do that in your garage in your backyard or on the side of your house. I know, I did custom work for years.

[NocturnalBeast]

No, customization should not be changed, it is already limited by weight, hardpoints and critical spaces, there is no reason to limit it further. Customization is a large part of what makes Battletech and Mecwarrior great. I don't understand why people who decide not to spend money on this game, want to limit what others can do just because they aren't patient enough to save c-bills.

[Kaijin]

quasihuman, on 13 November 2012 - 01:19 PM, said:

No, customization should not be changed, it is already limited by weight, hardpoints and critical spaces, there is no reason to limit it further. Customization is a large part of what makes Battletech and Mecwarrior great. I don't understand why people who decide not to spend money on this game, want to limit what others can do just because they aren't patient enough to save c-bills.

BOOM headshot!

Plenty of people in this thread who're Founders suggesting some limits to customization

[Sayyid]

quasihuman, on 13 November 2012 - 01:19 PM, said:

I don't understand why people who decide not to spend money on this game, want to limit what others can do just because they aren't patient enough to save c-bills.

How do you know that people without Founders tags havent spent money on this game?

Thats a mighty pretentious statement you made there.

[Grizley]

Kaijin, on 13 November 2012 - 01:28 PM, said:

BOOM headshot!

Plenty of people in this thread who're Founders suggesting some limits to customization

We have limits to customization. I think what we have is restrictive enough.

The hardpoints allows them to keep the really eyebrow rasing builds we saw in some previous Mechwarrior games like a 14 ER Med Laser mech out of the game. Or at least restricted to the Nova like it should be.

As a side note, am I the only one looking forward to the Nova? A jump capable medium mech with 12 ER Medium lasers standard? My new favorite brawler...

[Ultrabeast]

Sayyid, on 13 November 2012 - 12:36 PM, said:

Somethings are just facts of life. Live with it, adapt to it, and overcome it.

This isn't life, it's a game with big stompy robots with lasers. Oh yeah, we have those in real life. I just took mine for a drive.

[aspect]

Oh weird, I thought I was reading the MWO general discussion forums, not the tabletop gaming forums. I must have clicked on the wrong section, because it would be stupid to post a thread about how something doesn't work a certain way in some other game (bt tt) and then use that as a reason why it shouldn't work that way in MWO.

[One Medic Army]

Go play MWLL, or a stock only mode if they include one.

Most of us here like customizing mechs, and the customization is already significantly restricted from TT.

[MWHawke]

Sayyid, on 13 November 2012 - 12:36 PM, said:

LOL FAIL!

Variant, variation.

Factory variants are built and designed or ENGINEERED by the factory, not by some slob with a crecent wrench and a hammer in a garage.

REAL LIFE EXAMPLE.

Kid with a Honda Civic 1993 DX model takes the D15 out and puts in a D16. Is not redesigning the car, they are swaping out engines for another stock engine that is found in that car.

Same kid takes the SAME car and takes out the D15, and tries to put a 351 Windser in it. Not going to happen. He would need to fabricate, or in simplest terms MAKE, engine mounts, move the engine bulk head aka Firewall, make the car rear wheel drive, mount a rear differential, and put in a real transmission not just a transaxle.

Samething is true in mechs. You cant take a pre-engineered bit of military machinery and simply slap a larger gun on it and hope for the best.

You cant put a 155mm Howitzer in a M1 Abrams turret
You cant put the M256 120mm the turret of a M2 Bradley
You cant put a M2HB .50cal upper reciever on a M16A2
You cant put a 40mm Bofors in a F16C Falcon in place of the 20mm Vulcan.

Somethings are just facts of life. Live with it, adapt to it, and overcome it.

I just don't understand you. When factories can do it, you mean others can't do it?

I have seen village mechanics make mods to their cars that "professional" mechanics can't. So don't say fail when you don't understand the argument.

Sayyid, on 13 November 2012 - 12:36 PM, said:

LOL FAIL!

Variant, variation.

Factory variants are built and designed or ENGINEERED by the factory, not by some slob with a crecent wrench and a hammer in a garage.

REAL LIFE EXAMPLE.

Kid with a Honda Civic 1993 DX model takes the D15 out and puts in a D16. Is not redesigning the car, they are swaping out engines for another stock engine that is found in that car.

Same kid takes the SAME car and takes out the D15, and tries to put a 351 Windser in it. Not going to happen. He would need to fabricate, or in simplest terms MAKE, engine mounts, move the engine bulk head aka Firewall, make the car rear wheel drive, mount a rear differential, and put in a real transmission not just a transaxle.

Samething is true in mechs. You cant take a pre-engineered bit of military machinery and simply slap a larger gun on it and hope for the best.

You cant put a 155mm Howitzer in a M1 Abrams turret
You cant put the M256 120mm the turret of a M2 Bradley
You cant put a M2HB .50cal upper reciever on a M16A2
You cant put a 40mm Bofors in a F16C Falcon in place of the 20mm Vulcan.

Somethings are just facts of life. Live with it, adapt to it, and overcome it.

Oh.. and you can't put a torso onto 2 legs on a 100 ton chassis and still get it to move around and swing it's arms and shoot weapons. So, which part of facts of life don't you get?

Live with it.

[Tarman]

Sayyid, on 13 November 2012 - 01:09 PM, said:

I think you mean cheap.

And none of those were done without engineering. You cant do that in your garage in your backyard or on the side of your house. I know, I did custom work for years.

You must not know very many other hotrodders then, let alone the stuff that gets done to military vehicles in the field on extended tours. Saying "Engineeering" like that's somehow different from "Making Things" is silly. I don't breathe, I inhale and process atmospheric components!

[Kaijin]

MWHawke, on 13 November 2012 - 05:56 PM, said:

I just don't understand you. When factories can do it, you mean others can't do it?

I have seen village mechanics make mods to their cars that "professional" mechanics can't. So don't say fail when you don't understand the argument.



Oh.. and you can't put a torso onto 2 legs on a 100 ton chassis and still get it to move around and swing it's arms and shoot weapons. So, which part of facts of life don't you get?

Live with it.

http://mwomercs.com/...ost__p__1413631

[MWHawke]

Kaijin, on 13 November 2012 - 10:27 AM, said:

No. It means variant. These are all built in a factory, not field customizations.

Hinds are as good a modern-day example as any.

http://en.wikipedia...._Mi-24_variants

So, what does a variant make it? You mean a variant is not a customization?

Stormwolf, on 13 November 2012 - 09:36 AM, said:

They (re)built that thing at a factory, you can do anything in a factory. There are only a few custom mechs in BT when compared to the armies of stock designs.

Battletech knows 35 customs out of 851 stock designs in 3050, although many of these are rebuilds of the same mech or replaced a previous custom in later years (the Centurion CN9-YLW2 is the same mech as the CN9-YLW). Note that I left out omni mechs in the custom list because they can be reconfigured on the fly.

If you read the technical readouts, you will see lots of customized mechs in the short stories they share by the side.