306 replies to this topic

[DeathlyEyes]

PGI needs to institute a warning box that says something along the lines of "WARNING: You just selected to play COMMUNITY Warfare. You should expect to see COMMUNITIES, playing together as COMMUNITIES in this game mode. If you do not like this DO NOT PLAY THIS GAMEMODE.

[White Bear 84]

For all the cries of 'not a community' there seem to be a lot of players incapable of simply jumping in faction TS, grouping up with other player - even if they are not part of a unit and just well.. ..playing like a community and not a lone wolf on a mission to get annoyed with CW.

You don't NEED a 12 man organised group from the same unit... ...just one example - over the CW event I have dropped in a group ranging from 5-12, mixed davion from HHOD, RRB and various other units, some without tags too. Why did our teams win all our matches against the clans? Because we are a community and we work together.

[purplewasabi]

Thumbs up to the OP. Over the CW event last weekend, I tried telling some players that the environment has become highly competitive and that it is no longer the casual founding (because some players claimed they were founders and it implies that they know better than me) days of MWO. We must work together, coordinate and communicate etc. but it mostly fell on deaf ears.

KahnWongFuChung, on 09 November 2015 - 08:02 AM, said:

MercStar has not been on Wolf for quite some time, and they have nothing to do with the crux of my argument.

I disagree before-MS- started playing in your clan your teams were good but not elite players like you seem to have now that take hardly no damage and give out a lot of1-2 shot kills I have fraped a few of your games and I see repeated exploits and other weird gameplay that you as honor bound clan members were not doing?

So what changed your clan from just good players to like playing in god-mode every battle? I wonder but PGI does not care about exploits/ETC. to this game as long as the USD continues to flow in. And since you're being brash and direct, I would like to do that to.


P.S but you are not the only units I have seen this happen to after a -MS- merger and its not because yo have gained so much player skill per player to become so L33t (

I rolled with MS a couple of times in CW and regular group drops, and their coordination is simply extraordinary. All units in MWO should strive to their level if I'm honest. Show them some respect.

Regarding your comment, Kahn, are you assuming that player skills remain idle? No, it doesn't, its dynamic. Players that put in the most effort will triumph in the end, not whiners. Its all about adapting to the changes that PGI is introducing and if you can't do that, how do you expect yourself to have the competitive edge?

Re. weird gameplay, this statement here proves how stubborn and rigid some players are in the community. No creativity. No imagination. Always doing the same thing while expecting the same results, not knowing that their over-reliance on the same old tactics have made themselves obsolete.

Re. exploitation, I think it work both ways. We, Innersphere have our strengths and so do Clans. Those who do not exploit the system, IMHO are simply selling themselves short, you are voluntarily handicapping yourself. A common mistake I saw during last weekend's CW event, but I don't blame them because these events often attract a lot of casual players. But for MWO veterans/regulars to whine about exploitation is simply dumbfounding.

[PFC Carsten]

CW should not be available to anyone expcept Tier1's with fully filled bars (which I'm not), it's end-game content after all, who additionally have to be paying customers and have joined a unit, since it's a team game.

[\sarcasm]

CW should have separate queues for solos and units as well. To make it a little different, maybe the deciding battles for each given planet could only be fought by units.

And remember this, unit guys: If solos cannot be bothered to join CW any more, you'll experience the barren wasteland that is CW not outside of incentive-rich events like over the past weekend. AND you will have to wait for other groups to fill the companies on both sides, no solos to exploit for making the 8-premade into a 12 strong company and such. In short: Your wait times will drastically increase as well.

And on the honor-side... I've played yesterday evening a round of CW against an 7 or 8 premade (didn't bother to count exactly) with the rest on both sides all being solos. When we figured out how not to be farmed anymore (mid-wave 2), some of them suddenly did the unexpected/unheard of and actually destroyed Omega to end the match. So, there are certain groups of players who actually seem enjoy seal-clubbing.

[Tom Sawyer]

Seriously when are these threads going to stop? When PGI finally gave us CW it was to offer an alternate means of play to single dropping. Granted CW needs of a ton of work. Often it seems like an alternate to regular assault drops.

However the premise IS and SHOULD be teams working together. Its COMMUNITY warfare. And dedicated teams using TS and practicing together are GOING to often stomp pug teams that just drop willy nilly.

There are MANY team speak servers within the various houses and clans. Find one and just listen in without even playing. Be respectful, do not interrupt the drop if you are not involved. You just may pick up some tips . Depending on the server you might just invited to drop. And you will quickly release all BS about overpowered mechs aside its the teamwork, the calling of targets, the listening to the drop commander, that will often lead to a win.

You might just end joining a unit and enjoying CW for what it was meant.

[Jon Gotham]

Commander A9, on 07 November 2015 - 10:38 PM, said:

Winning the match starts with what you choose to do for your team.

You are wasting your time mate. The "community" here is probably the worst I've ever witnessed and that includes WoT. The attitude towards teamwork here is baffling and quite sad really.
The self -entitlement from the prosolo crowd has stunned me as well as the self dishonesty, this "community" attitude has seem the vast majority of my friends and unit mates (from 3 units) leave the game. Why play a game where teamwork is vilified? Or having friends on your friendslist is frowned upon?
Why play when being a selfish, self-centric solo is encouraged? About 40 of my friends agreed. They are now gone. As is their $1500+ spends and future spends.
Most of us have moved onto titles where the selfish solos don't whine and demand the game is changed to cater to them, because there is "more of them."

Enough is enough of it.

[DarkMetalBlade]

Kamiko's got a real good point - Most people just want to jump right in & blow some steam off by blowing stuff up; the prospect of working as a team is little more than a foreign concept to them, & is thus frowned upon.

Seeing that the bulk of the population is like that, you can guess why CW is a barren wasteland.

[Vickinator]

We have Arctic Cheetahs but you have Firestarters, lol assuming that those two are even close anymore.

[ZenFool]

The problem being that people that "whine" about the game are paying customers.

Sadly, I agree with OP to some extent. The problem is that the majority of actual paying customers don't care and HAVEN'T CARED FOR OVER A YEAR.

That's right, CW was supposed to create a sense of belonging. To a unit, to a faction. Instead, it made a game mode insta win for everyone in a unit. The mode is balanced so that you know, wave one, who is going to win. No random player wants to deal with thirty minutes of losing when they know that's whats going to happen.

The problem is no longer who joins a unit, because its been made clear that many won't. The problem is now, how do we make a game mode that caters to units without alienating EVERYONE else?

[Jon Gotham]

ZenFool, on 18 November 2015 - 05:46 PM, said:

The problem is no longer who joins a unit, because its been made clear that many won't. The problem is now, how do we make a game mode that caters to units without alienating EVERYONE else?

This is the core of it, because I don't think it's possible. A lot of my in game friends have been pushed away by the poor attitude of our playerbase and PGI designed a game around players that didn't have this poor attitude.
Trouble is the majority (no matter actually how much bigger it is) have this poor attitude and PGI have not addressed this. Trouble is, PGI's original vision for the game cannot work with the pro solo mindset.
I think MWO is in trouble as most just want a mindless pokemech team solomatch. PGI don't get this. Most of the team players I know have got this, and have taken their wallets elsewhere....

and that isn't good news as they are the type of player that PAYS LONG TERM.

[jarhu]

At least I died with boots on.

[PFC Carsten]

kamiko kross, on 18 November 2015 - 08:20 PM, said:

A lot of my in game friends have been pushed away by the poor attitude of our playerbase and PGI designed a game around players that didn't have this poor attitude.
Trouble is the majority (no matter actually how much bigger it is) have this poor attitude and PGI have not addressed this. Trouble is, PGI's original vision for the game cannot work with the pro solo mindset.
I think MWO is in trouble as most just want a mindless pokemech team solomatch. PGI don't get this. Most of the team players I know have got this, and have taken their wallets elsewhere....

So, it's poor attitude when you desire a fair match? FWIW, right now, there's absolutely no matchmaking. Consider having a soccer/football leagues without divisioning into classes, so that your friendly neighborhood team would face Real Madrid - and not for charity, but when they want to achieve something.

Because: „Solo players“ is not the correct assumption. Impromptu Teams would be correct.

Easy solution: Separate group and solo queue as in „quick play“-mode. Problem solved. Units have to wait hours for a game? Cry moar.

[Black Ivan]

Well said PFC Carsten. Problem is with PGI not reallocationg ressources to create a match maker, because they say CW has not enough population is somehow a self fullfilling prophecy. More people won't come if there is no decent match maker so there won't be any more population. Sigh, CW could have been a great thing and include the full community, now it is a barren wasteland.

[PFC Carsten]

The very least thing (and a very very easy one too) PGI could do would be to integrate CW-gameplay into quick-play mode: Play individual CW matches for pure solos without any impact on the map, just like a normal quick match.

Effort:
Near Zero
Wins:
One more game-mode with a little more tactical value than pure skirmish
Loss:
Hm... maybe some PUGs won't join "real CW", but otoh, some may get to like it and go for the real thing. Dunno.

[Michal R]

Lol guys lol
The problem with CW on IS side is that players bring bad mechs to game.
You know that the claners will have Tiber, Loki, Ebon, Storm Crow, Cheaters.
And what IS brings? Atlas with LRM... FK idiots. ("Give locks" - FK morons they have 4-5 ECM i every drop).
Then they do 500 DMG in 4 mech and they cry because they lose.
When you go to gun fight don't take knives and sticks, bring bigger guns. Simple rule.
But IS players don't understand this.

This is the problem.

And remember there is one rule of CW:

IF YOU CAN'T DO 1000 DMG IN 4 MECH DON'T PLAY CW.

It's better for you and others.

[PFC Carsten]

Michal R, on 19 November 2015 - 03:38 AM, said:

Lol guys lol
The problem with CW on IS side is that players bring bad mechs to game.
You know that the claners will have Tiber, Loki, Ebon, Storm Crow, Cheaters.
And what IS brings? Atlas with LRM... FK idiots. ("Give locks" - FK morons they have 4-5 ECM i every drop).
Then they do 500 DMG in 4 mech and they cry because they lose.
When you go to gun fight don't take knives and sticks, bring bigger guns. Simple rule.
But IS players don't understand this.

This is the problem.

The problem are people who do not (want to) understand what the problem is and who instead keep posting the same stuff over and over again in order to silence all constructive criticism aimed at making CW a viable and fun game mode for a larger group of users WITHOUT making it un-fun for established units.

It's not the Atlas, it's not LRMs and it's not Clans being considered OP. The Problem is matchmaking or rather the lack of it. Secondary problem is wait times and tertiary problem is lack of incentive/motivation to engage in CW as it was meant to be (i.e. a persistent and involving ongoing warfare).

What you describe (unlevelled Trial-Mechs vs. Clan-Meta) is a direct result from the lack of matchmaking - because new players who don't buy packages simply will not have access to superior clan tech from the start - and could only try CW with a complete Trial deck. This amplifies the unbalanced match-ups, as clan players tend to be more experienced since they had to play more to afford their drop deck compared to the IS player.

Michal R, on 19 November 2015 - 03:38 AM, said:

And remember there is one rule of CW:

IF YOU CAN'T DO 1000 DMG IN 4 MECH DON'T PLAY CW.

It's better for you and others.

It all depends on the match-up, the play-style, your role etc. If the match up is fair, 1000 DMG isn't a problem for most, including solo players except for stomps or gen-rushes.

[oldradagast]

So, to clarify, a 12-man seal-clubbed a bunch of casuals and PUG's and then wonders why those people don't want to become seal-clubbers themselves. Next, top it off with the winners whining about the losers not enjoying losing, and we have CW in a nutshell. And people wonder why CW is a nearly dead format with nothing but anger and try-hards remaining.

PFC Carsten, on 19 November 2015 - 04:12 AM, said:

It's not the Atlas, it's not LRMs and it's not Clans being considered OP. The Problem is matchmaking or rather the lack of it. Secondary problem is wait times and tertiary problem is lack of incentive/motivation to engage in CW as it was meant to be (i.e. a persistent and involving ongoing warfare).

Exactly. The try-hards in this forum and in CW have shouted down all constructive ideas to fix the format because such changes would remove their ability to seal-club for free wins and then simultaneously insult the losing team on the forums AND whine that the losing players don't rush out and join one of the teams that just got done trashing them both in-game and on-line. Match-making is the only fix for CW, but now that the game format is basically empty, it's probably too late to save it.

[Khereg]

oldradagast, on 19 November 2015 - 04:17 AM, said:

The try-hards in this forum and in CW have shouted down all constructive ideas to fix the format because such changes would remove their ability to seal-club for free wins and then simultaneously insult the losing team on the forums AND whine that the losing players don't rush out and join one of the teams that just got done trashing them both in-game and on-line. Match-making is the only fix for CW, but now that the game format is basically empty, it's probably too late to save it.

Not sure if I qualify as a tryhard, but since my unit is the one most often held up as chief seal-clubbers, here's my (unsanctioned) take...

I've never seen us "shout down" the idea of a matchmaker in CW, only point out that population numbers and current configuration of the mode make it completely nonviable. Bump up the population 10x and it becomes a viable option - one I'd be in favor of, personally. As much as you like to push the mantra that we're all a bunch of...how do you put it? Psychopaths? That's just not true for most of the people you accuse and your lapse into such hyberbolic language undermines whatever kernel of a legitimate point you might have.

[Michal R]

PFC Carsten, on 19 November 2015 - 04:12 AM, said:

It all depends on the match-up, the play-style, your role etc. If the match up is fair, 1000 DMG isn't a problem for most, including solo players except for stomps or gen-rushes.

Men even when I play pug vs 12 premade I do 1500 DMG and some kills - ALWAYS And i'm a average player.
Why? Becouse I don't bring bad mechs.

Even when enemy stomps and do gen rush i play and kill.
Most of players stand and watch don't know what to do.

Yes queue in CW is broken, but rest is ok.
You don't need matchmaking in CW. You need only to have half brain to think what you do. This is not CoD when you run and shoot.

And about incentive/motivation to engage in CW - CW is best place to grind and CW have best fights. Even when you loose.

[DarkMetalBlade]

ZenFool, on 18 November 2015 - 05:46 PM, said:

The problem is no longer who joins a unit, because its been made clear that many won't. The problem is now, how do we make a game mode that caters to units without alienating EVERYONE else?

I might have found that out myself, from a post in a different thread:

sycocys, on 18 November 2015 - 08:40 AM, said:

Or just get rid of the map entirely as it serves absolutely no purpose until there's a population that's actually interested in the mode.

Then groups can't hide from each other. And the pugs will have a far better chance at not fighting the 12 mans that make them cry themselves to sleep.

Really, with unit tags on planets serving zero purpose, it's best to just scrap the IS map until people start coming here more.