9 replies to this topic

[Matthew Ace]

Overall, I'm left with the impression that the Dev team isn't very fond of Awesomes (note my phrasing; It's not accusative so chill) - the changes are puzzling to say the least. Maybe something is going behind the scenes and it may all be a big ploy to give it IW advantages for all we know (given that it is, after all, a stellar choice as a command vehicle). Who knows?

All Variants
+14 (+4 from live) to Side Torsos and +25 (+5 from live) to Center Torso does not grant it much survivability, despite being renowned canonically for its thick hide, among the heaviest of all 80 tons. We know it's going to get a rescale, and maybe that's the intention behind being more conservative with these quirks, but that does not really fly when the Zeus has better size and continue to possess bigger survivability quirks.

Suggestion:
- Instead of +14 Side Torso Internals, perhaps +10 Side Torso Internals and +10 Side Torso Armor may be a better idea
- Instead of +25 Center Torso Internals, perhaps +20 Center Torso Internals and +10 Center Torso Armor may be a better idea
(I'm being conservative here actually; had considered higher increase)

On the bright side, they do get decent torso twist rate, which means they are less or not at all affected by the reduction in 'Mech skill tree values (at least for twisting).

This is just my opinion and I'll probably be crucified for saying this, given that Speed and Agility Is Life in MWO but Running Speed (less the Pretty Baby and AWS-9M) and Agility (all AWS) should be more of a primary weakness of the Awesome, while agility and mobility is really more of a Victor and Zeus's specialty trait (that is not to say to remove such quirks from them though).

AWS-9M

• Weapon Quirks in general: Maybe the intention behind the adjustment of values is to make it more specialised for ER PPCs and/or to reduce laser-vomit, but that just seems, I don't know... kind of contradicting to the rest of the quirk adjustments across the board, doesn't it? Overall the chassis has gotten nerfed with regard to this. I don't know if it's to make up for the Torso Twist Speed quirks. If we want a little more flexibility in terms of loadout, maybe make its PPC quirks apply to both PPCs and ER PPCs. The AWS-8Q will still have its place for being the all-energy variant and the ability to carry 4 PPCs (or more, if you want to go crazy), while the AWS-9M is kept to 3 PPCs, but has loadout flexibility in terms of hardpoints, especially its "semi-omni" CT.

• Removal of Range Quirks: The removal of its range quirks may have been an acceptable move if it was part of a bigger objective to globally reduce combat range (which requires trimming down of range quirks), but that does not seem to be the case; in fact, the AWS-8Q gets to keep some of it. Not to mention PPC quirks also applies to its Extended Range counterpart. Consider having part (if not all) of the range quirk restored if there is no intention to reduce range quirks globally. This means between +15% to +25%. (Edit 1st Dec: +10% global energy range quirk minimum. +5% PPC/ERPPC range optional.)

More to come as PTS4 continues.

Edited by Matthew Ace, 01 December 2015 - 03:11 PM.

[Duke Nedo]

I can only concur, I was disappointed when reading especially the 9M quirks.

The 8Q quirks seem fine, it gets more velocity, maintains enough range and gets cooldown shifted towards PPCs. The generic range also adds possibilities. I am happy about that one. It can run 2x2 PPCs so having PPC-specific quirks is fine.

The 9M however, 25% Heat gen on ERPPCs is not enough to make 3x ERPPC a good loadout, ESPECIALLY since ghost heat prevents firing 3x ERPPC, forcing you to use either 2x ERPPC or fire them 2 + 1 which is simply not any good. If gets nerfs to cooldown, removal of range, nerf to duration... and it only got a token 5% velocity. In all, the 9M is quite seriously nerfed because why exactly? Shifting quirks further towards a specific weapon as bad as the ERPPC also hurts it further, it's wedging it into a build that it not viable.

I would suggest a more general approach to the 9M. It has a large engine cap, allow it to run an XL by giving it more armor/structure buffs. Drop the ERPPC specific buffs, much rather quirk energy range and heat gen. Anything except ERPPCs really, or raise PPC ghost heat to 3. 2x Gauss @ 30 PPFLD damage is allowed anyways so, why not. PPCs move slower, you need to lead more = no convergence = no pinpoint. Should be safe enough.

The AWS-PB also gets turned more into a missile boat. I can live with that, it has too few E hardpoints anyways.

The AWS-8R becomes more LURMY, but hotter. That's fine.

The others I don't care about. So all in all, it's the 9M quirks that are not in a good place.

[Inkarnus]

just wanted to leave this here since maybe some didnt read the twitter and find it interesting.

[Matthew Ace]

Inkarnus, on 20 November 2015 - 04:28 PM, said:

just wanted to leave this here since maybe some didnt read the twitter and find it interesting.

Errr.... Your point being?

• If you had read the beginning of my post, you would realise it's an impression and not actually declaring nor accusing.
  
• That tweet was some time after I posted, and it was about the 8Q (of which I had no issue with for weapon quirks).
  
• Even then, Russ may be the president of PGI, but he is also only 1 person and he's not Paul.

I'm sorry, but I really do not know what you are trying to add to the discussion. Having said all that, what do you yourself think about this iteration of the quirks for Awesomes?

Edited by Matthew Ace, 20 November 2015 - 10:43 PM.

[Stonefalcon]

IMO Awesome should be able to fire three PPC/ERPPCs without triggering ghost heat.

[Matthew Ace]

Stonefalcon, on 21 November 2015 - 07:33 PM, said:

IMO Awesome should be able to fire three PPC/ERPPCs without triggering ghost heat.

I'll be fine with keeping PPC and ER PPC ghost heat threshold at 2 if they just reduce ER PPC Ghost heat from 15 to 7 (i.e. same as regular PPCs). Makes mixing of PPCs and ER PPCs less penalising.

[_____]

I also think the new 9M quirks are a big nerf. The ERPPC is already a bad weapon. it's the least heat efficient weapon in the game and its relatively slow velocity makes it more of a mid-range weapon instead of true long weapon like the ERLL. The quirks just makes the weapon less bad, but still bad.

Now, the original TDR-9S ERPPC quirks were overdone a bit, so I'm guessing PGI has some hesitation to bring actually useful ERPPC quirks back. But the 9S has the advantage of high mounts and it really only excelled in CW where extreme range is useful on some maps. The AWS-9M doesn't have good hardpoint locations and is a much larger target, so PGI really has no reason to fear AWS-9M OP calls.

The only good quirk on it right now is the general energy heat gen quirk.

[Matthew Ace]

So for whatever reasons, the team has decided the changes from PTS4 is good to go live as-is, without THE LEAST consideration for further minor value adjustments for some chassis/variants (yes, I'm not only talking about the AWS-9M and Awesomes). What is the point of asking our feedback when there isn't even the slightest consideration where it is deemed reasonable.

Having said all that though, a silver lining is how the other changes outside of a few neglected chassis are at least decent. At least the AWS-8R benefits from the missile changes and that is good.

This gives the impression that the only point behind PTS4 is just a preview of what is going live plus major bugfixes.

UPDATE:
So I got to tweet Russ regarding no further changes to PTS4 quirk list and from what I infer, the quirk list may still be adjusted further down the road (thanks Russ). I certainly hope that will be the case.

I agree I might be overreacting from this post, but I stand by the main take-aways that I said.

Edited by Matthew Ace, 30 November 2015 - 03:20 PM.

[Wruin]

Inkarnus, on 20 November 2015 - 04:28 PM, said:

just wanted to leave this here since maybe some didnt read the twitter and find it interesting.

I think Russ should take that 'excellent' build and go tango with a half-way decent pilot playing the current meta... there's a reason no one plays the Awesome (hint: it's not because it's not awesome).

[TDN Dreadnaught]

The only time I see an AWS 8Q with 3 PPCs and actually feel any fear of it...? When the arctic cheetah using it as a meat shield looks my way.

Edited by TDN Dreadnaught, 05 December 2015 - 11:47 PM.