592 replies to this topic

[Husker Dude]

Araevin Teshurr, on 07 December 2015 - 12:56 PM, said:

The timers on the event has just over an hour left, but the attack phase on the map says 3days left, so will the battle go on for another three days and they will extend the challenge?

I don't know if everyone has seen it, but wasn't there an announcement that CW would be down until Thursday, after the event, until the Steam release? I assume that's what the three days mean.

[Steve Pryde]

Dawnstealer, on 07 December 2015 - 11:49 AM, said:

Compare that to the Clan ERLL, which can be taken on any Clan mech - Clans will have a consistent range advantage.

There's no argument here: Clans have better range. They SHOULD have better range. But that needs to be balanced. To PGI's credit, it's starting to feel that way.

It is in a way "balanced", the burning time is ridiculous long. And so long IS have mechs with range quirks IS will have the range advantage. It's your fault if you aren't taking the mechs with the range quirks. I only played clans this event because I couldn't change the faction for the event. Love the new Marauder and I wasn't allowed to us it. :-/

[Husker Dude]

Steve Pryde, on 07 December 2015 - 01:06 PM, said:

And so long IS have mechs with range quirks IS will have the range advantage. It's your fault if you aren't taking the mechs with the range quirks.

I don't think it's fair to say that because certain IS mechs have range quirks where their ERLLs can outshoot Clan ERLL, that IS has the range advantage. It's an extremely narrow argument for which that's true, particularly when ERLLs are not a terribly viable weapon in every circumstance.
I think the biggest laser range quirk now is 25%, isn't it? Literally the only weapon that quirk will give a better range, between IS and Clan, is the ER LL.

[Arkhangel]

if nothing else, this event did highlight two things: it's going to catch a lot more aimbotters, and it's showing just which units are tryhards when it comes down to it.

For those of both sides that won matches through actual skill at arms, I salute you.

Edited by Arkhangel, 08 December 2015 - 03:50 PM.

[TheLuc]

Dawnstealer, on 07 December 2015 - 11:34 AM, said:

Sadly, lore had Clans as massively overpowered. That was only balanced out by the fact Mechwarrior (as opposed to Battletech) was a role-playing game: the Clans nerfed themselves.

First off, the Clans ran their mechs in Stars, where 10 Clan mechs would form the rough equivalent of 12 IS mechs, but even there, a 10 v 12 match between lore-based Clan mechs and lore-based IS mechs would be a ridiculously easy walk for the Clans.

Because they were so honorable, the Clans would also nerf themselves by bidding prior to a battle. Different units and Clans would bid for the right to invade a planet, with one saying "I could take it with 3 Stars" and the next saying "I could take it in two!" and the original saying "I'll do it in my underwear, blindfolded!" and so on.

Since this is a computer game and not a role-playing game, the first has some programming issues (according to Russ) and for the second, no Clan player would willingly nerf themselves. I mean, just look at these forums with the balance starting to approach parity. Then try to imagine those same players saying "Yeah, we'll run with a 200 ton cap because we're so much better than these guys."

Would never happen.

So PGI's only solution is to bring the weapons into some kind of balance. They're going with range vs heat and burn time. Personally, I would have gone with range vs damage, so IS weapons would do more damage with a steep drop-off over range, but Clan weapons would do more consistent damage over greater ranges. Clans would want to play at range, IS would want to brawl - lore achieved.

Sorry but it can be done , thing is that so far Russ and the team didn't figure it out or don't want to due to vision in as in a company term which hurts the game and the franchise. No need to debate the subject as the player base has no power to influence the inner workings of PGI, unless there is a mass exodus to some other game.

[Dassh]

Husker Dude, on 07 December 2015 - 01:04 PM, said:

I don't know if everyone has seen it, but wasn't there an announcement that CW would be down until Thursday, after the event, until the Steam release? I assume that's what the three days mean.

No. It said it ends 9:15 PM UTC, it was like half an hour before and the tournament page says the event is over. So thats it, done. We lost.

[Juodas Varnas]

Welp, i guess clans win again.

Though to be honest, i don't think i've seen IS ever crawl out of <50% during the event. I've only seen it fluctuate from 15% to about 45%.
I'm sure they did, but it was probably only long enough for every clanner to take a screen cap to "prove it's balanced".

[Husker Dude]

Honestly, I think the worst balance issue I saw during the event were the wait times on IS. Hopefully next time, as I'm sure we'll see Tukayyid 3 at some point, the populations of both factions can somehow be equalized, and more maps slots added so the waits aren't closing in on 20 minutes.

[Dawnstealer]

Steve Pryde, on 07 December 2015 - 01:06 PM, said:

It is in a way "balanced", the burning time is ridiculous long. And so long IS have mechs with range quirks IS will have the range advantage. It's your fault if you aren't taking the mechs with the range quirks. I only played clans this event because I couldn't change the faction for the event. Love the new Marauder and I wasn't allowed to us it. :-/

And I dropped three of them so I could grind them. And was regularly hit by Clan mechs while I was still out of range...

And I have taken the meta mechs in the past, but as has been pointed out, the only place there's a range advantage is with a few very specific mechs and with the ERLL. That's it.

I don't even know why I'm arguing it at this point - it's really obvious. I don't think any Clan player honestly argues that the IS has a range advantage overall.

Edited by Dawnstealer, 07 December 2015 - 01:50 PM.

[Dassh]

Juodas Varnas, on 07 December 2015 - 01:41 PM, said:

Though to be honest, i don't think i've seen IS ever crawl out of <50% during the event. I've only seen it fluctuate from 15% to about 45%.
I'm sure they did, but it was probably only long enough for every clanner to take a screen cap to "prove it's balanced".

It was over 50% several times.
Btw I still think it's balanced now (about). Take into consideration that both MS and KCom were fighting clan side, IS was full of cracking fresh trial mech newbies. Not to mention most of my games weren't defense but counter attack what is the worst imo. Etc. balance is a complicated issue here.

[Husker Dude]

Yeah, I agree that counter attack is really rough. That's kind of the issue with daily CW drops, where the organized groups go on the attack and PUGs flock to defense queues, but before long a planet is on all counter attacks.

[HelBound]

Fought the good fight, seemed like a loosing battle all weekend regardless. Didn't think anything would flip today.

With the topic of IS newbs....how goes PGI intend to swing steamers towards the factions or clans? Deeper still, Steiner or FRR? Bear or Wolf?

[Zodie]

Dawnstealer, on 07 December 2015 - 01:45 PM, said:

And I dropped three of them so I could grind them. And was regularly hit by Clan mechs while I was still out of range...

And I have taken the meta mechs in the past, but as has been pointed out, the only place there's a range advantage is with a few very specific mechs and with the ERLL. That's it.

I don't even know why I'm arguing it at this point - it's really obvious. I don't think any Clan player honestly argues that the IS has a range advantage overall.

IS has range advantage (with right mechs) but I'm not arguing xD

[Tom Sawyer]

Good fight everyone. Let PGI deal with the flame wars.

[Chados]

My perspective is that the Clans won again. By a comfortable margin, but close enough that it's clear the IS can put up a respectable fight depending on circumstances. I think that settles the question of how bad they got nerfed. Things are looking fairly close to balanced from these results.

[shopsmart]

IS did crawl out past 50% briefly I think, although it was when europe woke up.

[Phaelon Wolf]

Great matches all weekend... good in--game banter from just about everyone.

...and fun was had by All!

[Big Tin Man]

shopsmart, on 07 December 2015 - 02:05 PM, said:

IS did crawl out past 50% briefly I think, although it was when europe woke up.

We were on the right side of 50% when I went to bed last night, but everyone knew the organized clanners would get out the cheetah/streakcrow rush in the last hours to close it out. I'm assuming that is what happened? Last I checked this morning it was ~70% clan

Edited by Big Tin Man, 07 December 2015 - 02:16 PM.

[Memnon Valerius Thrax]

23:13 Time here in Germany.

Event over since 13min but its still going on, my guys get a new match at 23:05 Time and IS get Ghostdrops over Ghostdrops and we lose now?
Sound fair.

[Tom Sawyer]

Russ Bullock ‏@russ_bullock
Yes we should be in ceasefire now - looking into it - looks like it ended at about 56% clans - pretty close - pretty happy about that