45 replies to this topic

[PFC Carsten]

So, I guess everyone has been on the receiving end of spawncamping so far. I further guess nobody really liked it, at least I didn't.

What makes spawncamping such an idiocracy is the inability for the spawncamped to defend against the spawncampers. PGI choose to adress this with MVP dropships (btw - if the dropships are so OP, why don't the factions use THOSE to fight - each one can easily kill hundreds of mechs, IOW totally breaks immersion).

So, here's the solution. Since it is completely possible for the system to drop a whole 12-man at a time as is done in the beginning, let the drop commander choose to do so for 2nd, 3rd and 4th wave - or, if some are still in good shape, choose the drop time arbitrarily within a certain time window. This way, the spawncampers cannot just focus down one target at at time. Problem (easily) solved.

Or is this already possible? If so, I haven't seen it yet myself and surely never seen it used.

Edited by PFC Carsten, 21 December 2015 - 01:49 AM.

[MaxFool]

Spawncamping is a serious problem. That is, people camping at their spawn.

[habu86]

I voted yes because I'm curious to see how this might work in practice, but, tbh, I have doubts as to whether this will truly solve the problem.

In order for spawn camping to occur, there needs to be a pretty serious imbalance between the teams and, if one team was able to stomp the other to the extent where they get to spawn camp, chances are they'll be able to do so again. In addition, I worry that this could lead to stalemates on certain maps that have somewhat defensible spawn points, with spawn attackers lacking the firepower, armor, and/or loadouts to stage further pushes through chokepoints and engage in CQB, while spawn defenders are too demoralized or overmatched to be able to push out through those same chokepoints, even as a fresh 12-man.

That being said, for all the theorizing, we won't know for sure until we give it an actual shot, and I am all for gathering empirical evidence on this.

Edited by habu86, 21 December 2015 - 04:15 AM.

[PFC Carsten]

MaxFool, on 21 December 2015 - 01:58 AM, said:

Spawncamping is a serious problem. That is, people camping at their spawn.

Thank you for being constructive.

[Hotthedd]

As long as mid-match respawns exist, there will be spawn camping and/or spawn turtling.

[Zibmo]

A different solution, one that requires YUUUUGE maps (trumping Trump there), is what a lot of MMOs do. It is similar to Conquest in the public / group queue where instead of capping flags, you cap LZs (landing zones). At which point choices can be made. Particularly if a presence must be maintained at an LZ in order to keep a cap.

For example: there are 6 potential LZs on a map. Team 1 automagically gets LZ A while team 2 gets LZ F. That leaves 4 LZs to be taken. In order to "cap" an LZ (remove it from neutral), a mech or mechs must stand inside the radius for x number of seconds. In order to MAINTAIN exclusive lock on that LZ, a mech must be positioned such that he can return to "retake" the LZ. If that does not occur, the LZ automatically returns to neutral (anyone can respawn there).

This adds a bit of complexity to the game. Please note that LZs A and F can't be capped and are permanently maintained by each team.

[Widowmaker1981]

Not an actual problem.

With the current dropships and spawn locations, if you are being spawncamped your team is horrendously outclassed, the enemy are simply ending the match quicker, the result is not being changed.

Spawn camping was only a problem in CW because the defender spawns were in the natural path of the attacking team, which resulted in accidental spawncamping and on certain maps certainly did influence the outcome (sulphur, mainly). They fixed that problem by moving the spawns, now there is no problem. There is no need for the godships.

[MrJeffers]

PFC Carsten, on 21 December 2015 - 01:48 AM, said:

Or is this already possible? If so, I haven't seen it yet myself and surely never seen it used.

It can be done, but requires everyone to not select their drop mech until everyone is ready. If you don't select a mech in the 30s window you miss the drop and have to wait for the next one. Would just require coordination for everyone to not select until most of the team was there.

[SkippyT72]

The suggestion of the drop commander dropping a wave is interesting, but how do you know the DC will drop them when he's supposed to, better to just make the drop a "wave" when the last mech is killed, but that will TOTALLY change the dymanic of the game, MW4 had a waves option and it was a different type f match and planning.

BUT

There would not be spawn camping if teams would you know LEAVE the spawn and stop trying to use the dropship's to win the game. Dropship's that are shooting mechs one to two grids from the respawn area is more of a problem, make a timer so if you don't leave you spawn (a .5K area) then you self destruct. That will also take care of unit's having to wait at the end of a drop to kill 4 mechs for that one guy that always seems to disco. The spawn is not your refuge, esp if you are the attacker and refuse to engage and are just attempting to waste the other teams time, I keep hearing that as the excuse and if your actually engaging the other team then yes I could see it as a tatic, but if your just hiding under the OP guns of MVP Dan then it's not it's a exploit of a feature not intended for use in the game.

Edited by SkippyT72, 21 December 2015 - 08:06 AM.

[Tasker]

If you are somehow able to be spawn camped with the completely broken dropships that are in the game right now, you should probably go play another game that is more your speed. I hear Yahoo.com has some cool interactive games you can play online, like Checkers and Go Fish.

[-Vompo-]

Ever got killed in spawn once. I cannot say I minded that since the game was lost at that point anyway and it was my and my teams fault that it even ever got to that situation.

I know it can be a bit annoying way to die especially for pugs who get spawn camped much more than groups. Maybe add a drop now button which would make spawn camping pretty much impossible if the team which is spawning can use their heads.

[Tasker]

Here's a better idea: replace the armament on the dropships with medium lasers, like they used to have.

That way, when a group of 12 coordinated and skilled players are curbstomping a group of 12 incompetent, LRMboating pugs, the game can end in ten minutes instead of twenty minutes, thus saving time for everyone and additional minutes of humiliation for the team being camped.

[PFC Carsten]

Tasker, on 21 December 2015 - 08:07 AM, said:

If you are somehow able to be spawn camped with the completely broken dropships that are in the game right now, you should probably go play another game that is more your speed. I hear Yahoo.com has some cool interactive games you can play online, like Checkers and Go Fish.

Tasker, on 21 December 2015 - 09:59 AM, said:

Here's a better idea: replace the armament on the dropships with medium lasers, like they used to have.

That way, when a group of 12 coordinated and skilled players are curbstomping a group of 12 incompetent, LRMboating pugs, the game can end in ten minutes instead of twenty minutes, thus saving time for everyone and additional minutes of humiliation for the team being camped.

Thank you for being constructive.

[_Comrade_]

If your team is getting spawnedcamp you need to get gud

your team is absolute noobish if they are getting spawn camped, even some of the worse teams can defend a drop given the generous DPS that hero dropship pilot dishes out

[_Comrade_]

the idea of having different drop zones points though would be awesome on a conquest like map but if a team only had one conquest nod conquered they will still get spawncamped in that one area. I have been saying for months now that they need to take quick play which is arguably the more fun mode and put it into CW. But i also think that mechs should be able to destroy dropship weapons, for the realism

Edited by Grimwill, 21 December 2015 - 11:56 AM.

[Tasker]

PFC Carsten, on 21 December 2015 - 10:16 AM, said:

Thank you for being constructive.

You're welcome. I tried to provide a brief, constructive reply that could be easily understood by the CW playerbase.

There is nothing wrong with spawn camping as a concept. It's the equivalent of the mercy rule in a sporting event. If you are being worked so hard that you can't even hold your reinforcement point that comes complete with invincible, death-dealing dropships every 30 seconds, why would you WANT to extend the game?

Does seeing your dropship vaporize an additional 12 to 16 enemy mechs make you feel that much better about how the match went?

Edited by Tasker, 21 December 2015 - 12:25 PM.

[Darwins Dog]

MrJeffers, on 21 December 2015 - 07:53 AM, said:

It can be done, but requires everyone to not select their drop mech until everyone is ready. If you don't select a mech in the 30s window you miss the drop and have to wait for the next one. Would just require coordination for everyone to not select until most of the team was there.

I don't think that's how it works. If you don't select a mech, then you get the next one in line. There's to way to delay the drop.

To the point of the thread: I voted no. Waiting until everyone on the team is dead will give the enemy more time to set up a firing line on one flank. They will instantly drop the closest mech and work their way up the line before the team getting camped can even get all of their mechs into range.

The reality is that you only get camped if you are already losing badly. It sucks to be on the receiving end of it, but getting camped is not the reason why a team lost. With the recently buffed drop ships, it's really hard to maintain it.

[MaxFool]

Darwins Dog, on 21 December 2015 - 12:33 PM, said:

I don't think that's how it works. If you don't select a mech, then you get the next one in line. There's to way to delay the drop.

Nope, you are wrong. If you miss the first countdown (can be anything from 1 to 30 secs), you miss the first drop ship and drop in next. You get the next mech in line automatically only if you don't select mech in time for that second drop ship. That's also why disconnectors take longer to drop, they always miss the first drop ship and take that extra 30 secs to drop.

[Karl Marlow]

What needs to happen is for one side to actively prevent the respawns. Of attackers are getting pushed back so hard the defenders. Are spawn camping the defenders should have some means to prevent the ddropships from returning and this end the match.

[Leone]

I, Personally, would love it if they simply included Aerospace rules for the dropships. ... Well, not the full armoury mind you, the weapons spreads on those things would be properly terrifying, but you know, the whole destructible dropship thing.

~Leone.