27 replies to this topic

[Dimento Graven]

Still need that user option to set HUD color, change it on the fly, for certain maps.

I've noticed that the default HUD colors in Caustic Valley cause the targeting reticule and a lot of the HUD information to become for all intents and purposes invisible when targeting objects on the horizon.

For Viridian-punched-in-the-balls-by-a-midget-Bog, the general 'green' color causes issues reading HUD information, and especially with red/green color blindness can cause the reticule to be especially hard to find at times.

We've been asking for this feature for YEARS, LITERALLY, now.

C'mon PGI, give us a break already...

[Lyoto Machida]

Hopefully not too hard for them to implement (but you never know around here). I wish they'd also give us an option for a minimal HUD (maybe just cross hair and target/paper doll info). Could really use the 10 fps or so the HUD eats up...

[Bishop Steiner]

Dimento Graven, on 14 December 2015 - 02:25 PM, said:

Still need that user option to set HUD color, change it on the fly, for certain maps.

I've noticed that the default HUD colors in Caustic Valley cause the targeting reticule and a lot of the HUD information to become for all intents and purposes invisible when targeting objects on the horizon.

For Viridian-punched-in-the-balls-by-a-midget-Bog, the general 'green' color causes issues reading HUD information, and especially with red/green color blindness can cause the reticule to be especially hard to find at times.

We've been asking for this feature for YEARS, LITERALLY, now.

C'mon PGI, give us a break already...

http://mwomercs.com/...37#entry4880337

Gameplay
• A 'Color Blind Options' section has been added to Game Settings.
• This section currently features a new color blind friendly reticle option (crosshair changes shape when a hit is detected).
• Increased the cooldown and duration bonuses on all DropShip weapons.

[Dimento Graven]

Bishop Steiner, on 14 December 2015 - 03:06 PM, said:

• A 'Color Blind Options' section has been added to Game Settings.
• This section currently features a new color blind friendly reticle option (crosshair changes shape when a hit is detected).

Thanks for the link, truly!

However, my reading comprehension skills seems to think that PGI completely missed the point, if I take exactly what they've posted as their colorblindness 'solution.'

What I understand is that they are stating that their solution is that the crosshair will change shape when a hit is detected.

The whole point of the color blindness 'issue' is that we won't see the shape change, because we can't see the crosshair.

I hope it's just poor documentation, I really do. I guess I'll have to wait until tomorrow to see, BUT, if it is that the crosshair only changes shape... Can everyone else see how useless that is when the colors make it so that you can't see the damn crosshair?

It's so friggin' ironic, and 'par for PGI's course', it's actually kind of funny...

[Bishop Steiner]

Dimento Graven, on 14 December 2015 - 03:58 PM, said:

Thanks for the link, truly!

However, my reading comprehension skills seems to think that PGI completely missed the point, if I take exactly what they've posted as their colorblindness 'solution.'

What I understand is that they are stating that their solution is that the crosshair will change shape when a hit is detected.

The whole point of the color blindness 'issue' is that we won't see the shape change, because we can't see the crosshair.

I hope it's just poor documentation, I really do. I guess I'll have to wait until tomorrow to see, BUT, if it is that the crosshair only changes shape... Can everyone else see how useless that is when the colors make it so that you can't see the damn crosshair?

It's so friggin' ironic, and 'par for PGI's course', it's actually kind of funny...

Indeed, that is a good question. All I remember from PTS3? I think was that half the time I didn't register if I was hitting because the reticle change was non intuitive. I guess only will know for sure tomorrow.

[Mechteric]

I think because the HUD is in flash makes it hard to design (or redesign) for custom colors, but then again it's possible they just didn't think it was important when they did it first.


Even though I'm not colorblind, I decided my new game RogueMek should have the ability to customize as much as possible

Edited by CapperDeluxe, 14 December 2015 - 04:57 PM.

[Mycrus]

Bishop Steiner, on 14 December 2015 - 03:06 PM, said:

http://mwomercs.com/...37#entry4880337

Gameplay
• A 'Color Blind Options' section has been added to Game Settings.
• This section currently features a new color blind friendly reticle option (crosshair changes shape when a hit is detected).
• Increased the cooldown and duration bonuses on all DropShip weapons.

Minimally viable... does not help at all...

[Dimento Graven]

CapperDeluxe, on 14 December 2015 - 04:56 PM, said:

I think because the HUD is in flash makes it hard to design (or redesign) for custom colors, but then again it's possible they just didn't think it was important when they did it first.

Yes, yes, yes, the standard, "But programming is hard... <lip quiver> <whimper> <tear drop>" excuses we get when something is requested.

Seriously though, this has been identified by the players since early, EARLY in closed beta, PGI acknowledged it not too long afterwards, and their solution (as currently documented) is to help color blind people NOT by allowing them to change the HUD color, but instead, KEEP THE COLOR THE SAME, just make the cross hairs change shape when a hit is registered?

Man I REALLY hope that this feature is just poorly documented by whomever it was wrote the patch notes. They guy writing the patch notes doesn't necessarily have to have anything to do with programming or testing. Crimany, they could have just handed the janitor a bunch of notes on the patch for all we know, BUT, if this truly is their idea of a solution for 'color blindness'... Did anyone at PGI even bother Googling the damn term 'color blindness'?

Or was it a situation of:

MWO Production Meeting - 2012-12-15:
Production Lead: Ok guys we need a solution for color blindness.
Programmers: What's that?
Production Lead: Y'know some people have difficulty distinguishing between certain colors.
Artistic Lead: You can't change the colors! I did thousands of hours of research to find out what were the most aesthetically pleasing colors in live fire situations were, and these are THE BEST colors for a HUD, EVER!
Production Lead: Yeah but a portion of the player base can't see the HUD.
Artistic Lead: Don't care.
Programmers: Umm... Gee boss, that's hard to do. We'd have to, I dunno, add a variable in there somewhere, and maybe provide a settings interface. I mean, we'd actually have to write twenty or thirty lines of code. That'll be double, maybe triple over time for sure...
Production Lead: <sigh> Ok, what can we do quick and easy?
Artistic Lead: I always thought the shape of the crosshair was too bland and generic. Why not give me a little bit of time to find out the most aesthetically pleasing crosshair shapes in live fire situations, maybe we'll just do that instead.
Programmers: Yeah, someone else does the artwork, all we'd need to do is add just two or three lines of code for that. Should only take about 7 weeks...
Production Lead: Get on it.

MWO Production Meeting - 2013-06-01:
Production Lead: How's that research on the colorblindness solution, y'know the crosshair change?
Artistic Lead: Still researching.

MWO Production Meeting - 2013-12-01:
Production Lead: How's that research on the colorblindness solution, y'know the crosshair change?
Artistic Lead: Still researching.

MWO Production Meeting - 2014-06-01:
Production Lead: How's that research on the colorblindness solution, y'know the crosshair change?
Artistic Lead: Still researching. I got it down to one of three choices, we're having them consumer tested.
Production Lead: Consumer testing?
Artistic Lead: Yeah I got each symbol in front of a different fern. Whichever fern grows the most, that'll be the one we choose.
Production Lead: You realize you're equating our user base to vegetation?
Artistic Lead: Is that wrong?

MWO Production Meeting - 2014-12-01:
Production Lead: How's that research on the colorblindness solution, y'know the crosshair change?
Artistic Lead: Had to start over. All three plants are dead.
Production Lead: Dead, wtf happened?
Artistic Lead: Apparently watering ferns with left over Tab cola doesn't do well, though I can't be sure if it wasn't the three symbols that actually killed them.
Production Lead: You've got to be kidding me... The symbols killed the plants?
Artistic Lead: Well, I guess I could just go ahead and chose one of the symbols as long as YOU agree to be responsible if any of our users end up dying because we chose the wrong one.
Production Lead: <sigh> I hate you people sometimes.

MWO Production Meeting - 2015-06-01:
Production Lead: How's that research on the colorblindness solution, did we end up killing any more plants?
Artistic Lead: Decided to use goldfish as the consumer testers this time around.
Production Lead: Uh... Why?
Artistic Lead: Well, I went to the carnival and you know that ring toss game? Well I won TWO goldfish! Thought it was kismet...
Production Lead: You had 3 symbols though. Did you buy another fish?
Artistic Lead: No! You people don't pay me enough for that so, I just filled a bowl with water and tossed in some of those fish shaped cheese crackers.
Production Lead: You what... Oh never f'ing mind. So what were the results.
Artistic Lead: Well one symbol was so bad, the fish crackers dissolved and green and black funky stuff started growing in that bowl. So we know not to use that symbol. The other two fish seemed to do equally well initially, but the one closest to the window eventually died. The last fish still seems to be doing well, so THIS is our new cross hair shape for hits.
Programmers: Ok finally, this will take us about 6 months.
Production Lead: SIX MONTHS?!?! What happened to 7 weeks.
Programmers: We're going to proceed very cautiously. Remember, these symbols initially killed some plants. While the ONE goldfish seemed to do ok, we don't know if it just happened to have a genetic mutation that allowed it to withstand the affects.

Edited by Dimento Graven, 14 December 2015 - 05:42 PM.

[Aetes Nakatomi]

Note the word currently.

In itself implying that more to be added at a later date.

Perhaps they are working on it and putting each completed module in as soon as they are finished.

Also th vast majority of games do not bother to do anything at all for colour blind players... Ever

Edited by Aetes Nakatomi, 14 December 2015 - 05:48 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Aetes Nakatomi, on 14 December 2015 - 05:44 PM, said:

Note the word currently.

In itself implying that more to be added at a later date.

Perhaps they are working on it and putting each completed module in as soon as they are finished.

Also th vast majority of games do not bother to do anything at all for colour blind players... Ever

Well, and not all color blindness is the same. But I can't think it would be too difficult to add like 6 or so color options along the spectrums for people to scroll through to allow people to find what actually contrasts for them.

Still and all, I can't sit here and assassinate their effort (or lack thereof) until it's actually in play and we get actual feedback from colorblind players.

[Aetes Nakatomi]

I just gets my back up. The constant 'we want this thing' 'been asking for this thing since closed beta' 'how hard is it to do my thing?!' 'my thing should be done before your thing' 'PGI tried to do my thing but it's not the exact thing I wanted'... Never ending and always about 50 things at once...

The sad thing is I really want a colour blind setting that is useful to people who need it. Just do not see how QQ on t forum achieves this.

Edited by Aetes Nakatomi, 14 December 2015 - 06:09 PM.

[Chuck Jager]

I know that a big problem with the new "EXPLOIT" is the growth of image recognition software. Folks use the dual monitor settings to run to a second computer running the software and when they see a combination of shapes and/or colors it will run a command or macro to execute as a game controller. I hope this is why they made it neutral in its contrast. Any ability to up contrast or change color would make this issue bigger.

Also many shooter games with a variable setting for the value of the aim indicator still have bad problems if you go across different backgrounds especially flight games with variable atmospheres. Of course this immersion is magnified for color blind folks.

Also the ability to add more contrast and adjust color setting will add the ability for "META" folks to remove "immersion" and end up with more of an advantage.

I knew a color blind pro level mountain biker who rode an extra 10 miles because the organizers of a local race marked the different routes with tracking tape that appeared exactly the same as the tape that local hunters used. The organizers did not understand because they checked that morning to make sure their tape was a different color. NOTE he still won.

You can always make a request for an accommodation. You will need the proper paperwork in the proper fashion - have fun. Keep track of the process and network with others with the same issue. This is not fun, but by working with others hopefully the combined efforts can do some good in the future.

Good luck

Edited by Chuck YeaGurr, 14 December 2015 - 06:23 PM.

[Narcissistic Martyr]

It might be hard to find a color that works for every single map and for people with all of the different color blindnesses...

So... why don't we just make the cross hairs have 2 black lines and 2 white lines and then when you hit have the 2 flash from black to white or vice versa real quick.

[Barantor]

I've been asking for color blind adjustments since beta.

I didn't even know the crosshairs changed color when it hit till someone told me about a year ago.

I still have a hard time figuring out how damaged a section is on the paperdolls.

I keep playing because I like it, but the HUD is doing me zero favors atm.

[JC Daxion]

Barantor, on 14 December 2015 - 08:32 PM, said:

I've been asking for color blind adjustments since beta.

I didn't even know the crosshairs changed color when it hit till someone told me about a year ago.

I still have a hard time figuring out how damaged a section is on the paperdolls.

I keep playing because I like it, but the HUD is doing me zero favors atm.

Instead of just asking for color blind options.... How about come up with a way, that would work for you? If you are not color blind, it is next to impossible to know the issue.. Especially, when there are so many different kinds of color blindness.


and FYI, im in a wheel chair.. when i have an issue, i don't say I need wheel chair options.. I say, This door needs to be wider, or this switch needs to be lower, Or this thresh hold is to high.. ect.. In other words, explain what you are not getting.. and come up with a way to make it work for you..

Use photo shop, or paint, and come up with a color scheme, or way to see the paper doll... come up with a way that would work for you to see a Lock, Or a hit...

Maybe add Stripes to paper doll, Maybe a adding flashing dots for locks some place,, Maybe change reticule from black to light grey??? I don't know, because i don't have the issue.. But give them clear options about what works and what doesn't and you will have a much better chance of getting something done..

saying we need color blind options to someone that has no idea what the issues are.. is well kinda pointless ya know?

[Khobai]

good color blind settings

now you guys will be able to tell the difference between red and blue

[Barantor]

JC Daxion, on 14 December 2015 - 08:45 PM, said:

Instead of just asking for color blind options.... How about come up with a way, that would work for you? If you are not color blind, it is next to impossible to know the issue.. Especially, when there are so many different kinds of color blindness.


and FYI, im in a wheel chair.. when i have an issue, i don't say I need wheel chair options.. I say, This door needs to be wider, or this switch needs to be lower, Or this thresh hold is to high.. ect.. In other words, explain what you are not getting.. and come up with a way to make it work for you..

Use photo shop, or paint, and come up with a color scheme, or way to see the paper doll... come up with a way that would work for you to see a Lock, Or a hit...

Maybe add Stripes to paper doll, Maybe a adding flashing dots for locks some place,, Maybe change reticule from black to light grey??? I don't know, because i don't have the issue.. But give them clear options about what works and what doesn't and you will have a much better chance of getting something done..

saying we need color blind options to someone that has no idea what the issues are.. is well kinda pointless ya know?

I've had people from PGI ask me what works and which things work and which don't and it never went anywhere man, so after a while I gave up and just play the game as I can.

I've told them in several posts here, told people that work there in messages on the forums with pictures and the whole bit... so I don't know what to tell you other than "been there, done that, nothing changed".

[JC Daxion]

Barantor, on 14 December 2015 - 09:08 PM, said:

I've had people from PGI ask me what works and which things work and which don't and it never went anywhere man, so after a while I gave up and just play the game as I can.

I've told them in several posts here, told people that work there in messages on the forums with pictures and the whole bit... so I don't know what to tell you other than "been there, done that, nothing changed".

trust me.. I feel for ya.. It sucks.. Sorta like going to a restaurant and not being able to get through the bathroom door. after years of asking them to just flip the door.. (the door even broke once, and they put new hinges on the stall, which could of easily gone on the other way, so it opened in the right direction...) I just stopped going there... we won't get into the fact that they don't have a ramp 15 years later.... though they had no issues fixing the curb... which actually worked as a ramp when it was broken!


Maybe try tweeting russ?? I do wonder if they went to all gray scale it that would work?

Edited by JC Daxion, 14 December 2015 - 09:24 PM.

[Mycrus]

Aetes Nakatomi, on 14 December 2015 - 05:44 PM, said:

Note the word currently.

In itself implying that more to be added at a later date.

Perhaps they are working on it and putting each completed module in as soon as they are finished.

Also th vast majority of games do not bother to do anything at all for colour blind players... Ever

Note the word breath... as in "don't hold it"...

[Chuck Jager]

JC Daxion, on 14 December 2015 - 08:45 PM, said:

Instead of just asking for color blind options.... How about come up with a way, that would work for you? If you are not color blind, it is next to impossible to know the issue.. Especially, when there are so many different kinds of color blindness.


and FYI, im in a wheel chair.. when i have an issue, i don't say I need wheel chair options.. I say, This door needs to be wider, or this switch needs to be lower, Or this thresh hold is to high.. ect.. In other words, explain what you are not getting.. and come up with a way to make it work for you..

Use photo shop, or paint, and come up with a color scheme, or way to see the paper doll... come up with a way that would work for you to see a Lock, Or a hit...

Maybe add Stripes to paper doll, Maybe a adding flashing dots for locks some place,, Maybe change reticule from black to light grey??? I don't know, because i don't have the issue.. But give them clear options about what works and what doesn't and you will have a much better chance of getting something done..

saying we need color blind options to someone that has no idea what the issues are.. is well kinda pointless ya know?

I have had to ask for accommodations at work, and yes what they want is specifics on what needs to be addressed.