413 replies to this topic

[Vulpesveritas]

Really I think it should be like it would be IRL. Guns except when you see a guy shut down due to overheating, save your ammo, walk over to the guy, and stick something sharp through the cockpit. Or just something really big and really heavy.

That said, I could see something of a bayonet, like what is described as a lance in game. Just a sharp pole sticking out of the arm for if you get in range. So I can stick said sharp object through guy with flamer's window.

That said, I vote for limited customization so we won't see nothing but boats.

Edited by Vulpesveritas, 11 January 2012 - 05:52 PM.

[Alekto Serenis]

Heres my oppinion

True custom's BUT DO LET THEM COST APPROPIATE IN BOTH MAINTENANCE AND DURING THE REFIT

Plese stay true to the tt, sometimes i just want to ride something awkward (twin-gauss catapult, or this solaris type assault full of mg's eg.), anyone thinking about people min/maxin, those arent worthy of respect of any kind

Please let those of us that want to earn their personal ride, up to the decision what way a screw is put in, have it, but make it requiring some determination. Damn, it could even be a "pilot skill" to be able to refit mechs or the depth of this (like at max you even go fractional accountings and be able to change basically anything within the rules from tt)

[Pht]

Terick, on 08 December 2011 - 08:07 AM, said:

Make sense when you look at the DA stuff and there is all sorts of melee and not nearly as many guns.

Pardon? What? who?

Dude, DA has *all* of the previous weapons systems, they're still viable and still around; and they've added other non-melee weapons to boot.

If you're gonna hate on it, at least ... know what it is!

[Elizander]

As much as I'd love to have full customization, it doesn't work too well in a game like Mechwarrior for PC.

I would prefer to have something similar to the slot system in MW4 (and not have mechs introduced later on with full omni slots making it all moot) and/or they sell 'configurations' of each mech based on what variants already exist.

For example:

Atlas AS7-D has an LRM-20, AC/20, Medium Laser x4, SRM-6 and weapon slots suitable to the weapon types that it has. You can probably take out the 4 M.Lasers and put in 2 PPCs but no more than that or remove the SRM-6 and have 2 LRM-20s).

Atlas AS7-WGS has an AC/20, PPC x2 and additional heat sinks and a different set of weapons and the slots available are also different from what Atlas A has (this would be mostly energy with one ballistic slot).

This way you can pick a base variant and tweak it depending on what weapon slots it has available or something. If they disallow engine modification then you'd have to get the Atlas model that you want that has a stronger engine and probably less weapon slots.

I am sure some people will hate this limitation, but if they go with full custom, I will certainly join 99% of the community with my unique ER Large Laser x6 configuration.

[Soturi05]

Inner sphere standard mechs are not designed to be user upgradable, they are made to their model standards with their standard armaments and any attempt to upgrade weapons or anything for that matter usually requires a ton of retooling to the chassis which is expensive and difficult work which is why mostly wealthy and powerfull people had any custom variants, personally i dont have a problem using standard loadouts and really if i want ease of customization i will have to wait for an omnimech but even then i would probably just stick to the canon variants.

[proktor]

when you buy a mech, from that point onward you can choose wich variant you want to field before going into combat
instead of customizing your mechs.
these variants are all existing models, and cannot be changed
(just an idea)

[Liam]

I hope for MW4 extended slot system, with finer slot segmentation.

Gauss: 11 slots
SL: 3 slots
ERLL: 8 slot points
ERML: 5 slot points
PPC: 10 points
LRM5: 3
LRM10 6
LRM15 9
LRM20:12

etc ... allowing "better" finer balancing. All slot numbers should be off cause balanced around weapon mechanics, damage output and heat.

Mixed slots would be nice: energy / ballistic, otherwise makes the gauss no sense ...

[Solis Obscuri]

Because why ever use a stock HBK-4G Hunchback if I can replace the AC/20 and small laser with fifteen machine guns, four tons of ammo, CASE, MASC, and four jumpjet, charge in point blank and lie on the trigger...

Cattra Kell, on 05 December 2011 - 05:14 AM, said:

I wouldn't mind a mixed version of this system. As much as I liked the freedom of the Mw2/Mw3 system I found far to many players min-maxing. With Mechwarrior 4 I did enjoy the hard point system as well due to the fact it *tried* to balance what weapons could be fitted.
Lets also not forget in the Novels and lore wise that indeed you could fit what you wanted but it often took weeks of hard work that involved either buying a new arm or tearing out all the guts in the arm and reconstructing it after the weapon was installed, most of the time if there was a large laser in the arm before, you either were installing a PPC or other lasers to replace the large laser due to the capacitors already there.

I wouldn't mind seeing though, different mech variants. What I mean by this is the same mechs, say there are 3 versions of the Thorn, the only difference is the hard points available on it. This would allow some customization (based on what variant you want) but also keep some balance so you don't roll with a 5 ERPPC Alpha-Cat. Just my own opinion on the subject, I am sure other people have other opinions and I hope that they post them too.

Soturi05, on 12 January 2012 - 08:48 AM, said:

Inner sphere standard mechs are not designed to be user upgradable, they are made to their model standards with their standard armaments and any attempt to upgrade weapons or anything for that matter usually requires a ton of retooling to the chassis which is expensive and difficult work which is why mostly wealthy and powerfull people had any custom variants, personally i dont have a problem using standard loadouts and really if i want ease of customization i will have to wait for an omnimech but even then i would probably just stick to the canon variants.

Agree with these. I'm thinking there needs to be limitations on customization. I'm not saying it has to be the MW4 semi-omnimech style (though I can see that being workable), but I think it should be very expensive to customize mechs beyond some basic weapon swaps, and expensive to rebuild/replace them when lost, compared to stock models.

[FACEman Peck]

Frankenmech is the worst idea ever, being able to customize like MW4 Mercs exactly would be amazing.

[Solis Obscuri]

Also, it would be great if the customization system took into account the complexity of the changes. Taking my HBK-4G example again, if I want to, say, remove the small laser and a half-ton of armor to free up weight for an extra ton of ammo, the modification should be pretty straightforward:

• Remove armor plates from desired areas.
  
• Remove small laser and actuation servos.
  
• Cap and stow wire bundles for power supply.
  
• Apply armor plate over laser aperature.
  
• Open mech left torso access.
  
• Install additional ammo bin.
  
• Update CPU software to remove small laser, add ammunition.
  
• Test software.
  
• Troubleshoot
  
• Update fire control systems to remove small laser
  
• Test.
  
• Troubleshoot

But if I decide to instead remove the AC/20 and replace it with two large lasers and a LRM/10 with one ton of ammo...

• Remove armor plating from mech left torso.
  
• Remove ammo bins
  
• Remove armor plating from mech right torso
  
• Position clamps/joist/jigs to support structure.
  
• Remove structural elements if/as required to access AC/20.
  
• Disconnect myomer actuators from AC/20
  
• Remove AC/20.
  
• Remove ammo feed assemblies from center torso.
  
• Fabricate mounting hardpoints for LRM/10
  
• Devise myomer actuation for LRM/10
  
• Install LRM/10 and actuators.
  
• Replace right torso structure
  
• Remove jigs
  
• Update mech CPU for removed AC and added LRM system
  
• Run response test for new myomer bundles
  
• Troubleshoot
  
• Fabricate mounting hardpoints for large laser
  
• Install large laser and myomer actuators
  
• Fabricate new power supply wire bundle
  
• Route bundle from engine to large laser
  
• Update mech CPU for added large laser
  
• Run response test for new myomer bundles
  
• Troubleshoot
  
• Fabricate mounting hardpoints for large laser
  
• Install large laser and myomer actuators
  
• Fabricate new power supply wire bundle
  
• Route bundle from engine to large laser
  
• Update mech CPU for added large laser
  
• Run response test for new myomer bundles
  
• Troubleshoot
  
• Mount ammo bin for LRM/10 using existing hardpoints (if possible)
  
• Route ammo feed line for LRM/10
  
• Update mech CPU for added ammo storage
  
• Update fire control system for removed AC and added LRM and large lasers
  
• Calibrate alignment of added weapon systems
  
• Troubleshoot
  
• Test ammo feed for added LRM
  
• Troubleshoot
  
• Fabricate new armor cowling for added weapon systems
  
• Replace armor plating on left torso
  
• Replace armor plating on right torso
  
• Test to confirm new systems are aligned and functioning properly
  
• Troubleshoot

One of those modifications should take at most a week in a mech bay and a few thousand C-bills.

The other should take several months and well over a million C-bills, and for that cost I might as well have just sold the Hunchback and bought a Thunderbolt if I really wanted large lasers and LRMs so badly...

[Alekto Serenis]

Now we remove the time and add as a factor instead increased cost based upon the skills of the hired tech


Which could be another "gear" to buy that requires additional cost, imagine the difference between some astechand some mastertech, the first one would be cheap in upkeep, afterall he got basically no skills, but it would be expensive if he had to customize your mech, the mastertech would be expensive, but he does not just keep your mech in shape, that little magician could improve your maintenance ("New gear, lets just put this cable here and tadaa works like new!"), your salvage and lower the cost of customizing your ride (he could be the one that knows how to jury rig that clan ppc into your Shadow Hawk^^)

[Sug]

We should get as much customization as our real life military tank drivers get.

[Black Sunder]

Some quotes:

Quote

[PAUL] The pure amount of customization options is something to behold. Whether or not we can fit all of them in is another question. It is this level of customization that makes it really a tough decision process when it comes down to what is included and what is pushed off the plate.

Quote

[PAUL] ....Does this mean we dumb the game down for the casual, new player? No it doesn’t. We just need to make sure the new player has an enjoyable time while they learn the ins and outs of the game as well as the intricacies of customizing a BattleMech.

Sug, on 12 January 2012 - 04:32 PM, said:

We should get as much customization as our real life military tank drivers get.

Cupholders?

Edited by Black Sunder, 12 January 2012 - 04:36 PM.

[Blackfire1]

I say neither and both, stick to cannon. You have specific variants with a set loadout. If you want to customize your mech you need to shell out some massive amounts of cbills and time for the custom work to be done. When that is the case I think there should be a combo of both systems. You can put anything you want as long as you take in the weight and area your working on. (Can't put an LRM 20 on an atlas's arm for example)

Edited by Blackfire1, 12 January 2012 - 04:39 PM.

[Sug]

Black Sunder, on 12 January 2012 - 04:35 PM, said:

Cupholders?

Hula girls.


I think there should be limited customization. Replace standard lasers with pulse lasers, or an autocanon for a gauss rifle. That sort of thing. Variants with 18 medium lasers or 6 ac/2's should not be allowed.

Since they mentioned we could join a faction, a merc unit, or be a lone wolf, i'd like to have customization limited by what you choose to join. Something along the lines of:

House Unit = Stock variants only. But you don't need to worry about repairs or replacing your mech.
Merc Unit = The upgrade path ie, lasers to ER or Pulse, Autocanon to Ultra/LBX, you or your unit pays for upgrades
Lone Wolf = Highest amount of customization possible, within reason. A MW4 slot system maybe. But you pay for all repairs and upgrades.

Edited by Sug, 12 January 2012 - 04:47 PM.

[Nik Van Rhijn]

i think a lot of those who want instant customisation as in previous incarnations are going to be disappointed.
Look at the quotes Black Sunder posted above. I think that what Sug said for House units will probably also be true. What army has ever allowed the grunts to customise their weapons in that way. (Yes I know it was done on an ad hoc basis in both WW2 & Vietnam).It may be that small tweaks are allowed like dropping a weapon(s) for more ammo/armour/heatsink. But not changing engine, armour type or double heatsinks.
Even if they allowed upgrading by Merc's based on TT they could effectively limit it by rarity as well as time and cost. ie expect to win a lot of contacts before you could really upgrade a single mech after running costs of the unit are taken out. Some new tech such as CASE could be "rare" or "common", relatively cheap/quick or expensive/slow depending on wether thay consider it unbalancing or not.
We don't know what they are going to do, but I think it highly unlikely that we will have the MW3/MW4 type instant build a totally new mech design.
I know some people have said that this would be a "gamebreaker" for them and they wouldn't play. Probably as many have said just the opposite. The fact is that the majority of people coming to the game on launch will never have played the franchise before and won't miss what they never had.
The other thing to remember is that most of the previous games were single player PvE with MP tacked on. This will be the first MP online, PvP only when it launches (ignoring Beta's).

[Dlardrageth]

Nik Van Rhijn, on 13 January 2012 - 05:29 AM, said:

[...]
I know some people have said that this would be a "gamebreaker" for them and they wouldn't play. Probably as many have said just the opposite. The fact is that the majority of people coming to the game on launch will never have played the franchise before and won't miss what they never had.
[...]

Also people tend to talk a lot on a winter day... not necessarily everything has to be taken literally. If I could be bothered, I could easily make a small list of people claiming they would quit/not play if this and that were implemented or not. And then some time after release check again and confront them with their former statements. IF I could be bothered... which I frankly cannot.

A couple of people claiming they would eventually boycot the game is nothing worth mentioning twice really. Either they do or they don't, won't matter in the grand scheme of things anyway. With an attitude like: "Either PGI does this, like I demanded, or I won't play!" they are probably not a great loss to the MWO community anyway.

Edited by Dlardrageth, 13 January 2012 - 08:11 AM.

[Mason Grimm]

Dlardrageth, on 13 January 2012 - 07:35 AM, said:

A couple of people claiming they would eventually boycot the game is nothing worth mentioning twice really. Either they do or they don't, won't matter in the grand scheme of things anyway. With an attitude like: "Either PGI does this, like I demanded, or I won't play!" they are probably not a great loss to the MWO community anyway.

Keep track of those names so I can ask them "Can I have your stuff?" after a "You mad, bro" round of emails!!!

[Black Sunder]

Mason Grimm, on 13 January 2012 - 07:41 AM, said:

Keep track of those names so I can ask them "Can I have your stuff?" after a "You mad, bro" round of emails!!!

The mark of a true EVE player.

[McScwizzy]

I say make the mechlab like the BattleTech mech sheets. Full customization.