85 replies to this topic

[Bishop Steiner]

ComradeHavoc, on 16 December 2015 - 06:39 AM, said:

What's with the cave dwelling ancients the hiss whenever a change a change is suggested or when "Simplicity™" is kept?

I'm talking about the veterans that play with premade teams with extreme meta builds and yet whine and piss how bad the game is and give it bad reviews on steam and downvote positive reviews without commentating.

It's like a fastfood restaurant that's been in business for years keeping a simple menu and slowing adding things has a grand-reopening which brings in potentially new customers and a new demographic, whilst some half-naked old customer is pissing on the building yelling at everyone new trying to enter.

So explain to me, because I don't really understand what's so fractured about the game that the old vets as a community would smear feces on it to keep new players away?

The good news? If the Steam Reviews are to be used as a measuring stick?

The number of Bittervets are far outnumbered by the not so bitter, or even shockingly, CONTENT Vets.

People are far more inclined to speak up about negative things, when they are unhappy, than when they are happy or content. Been a truism of reviews in retail business since retail business reviews were invented. And the more entitled, self righteous and angry the Butthurt is, the more rapidly the person let's one know about it.

The fact that with 1100 or so reviews, that the overall score still lands as "Very Positive"?

Would imply that the Legion of Butthurt is a more exclusive club than they would have you believe. Let them vent. Let them fill reddit and star citizen game forums with their vitriol. Some make valid points and actual objective and constructive negative reviews are beneficial to a game's health, as it shows the Devs that all is not "perfect" (of course step two requires devs to care and listen).

The more ridiculous logorrhea being posted? It's just good comedy to see some neckbeard in their mom's basement get all worked up because the game wasn't made the way THEY wanted it, or because Russ/Paul/Bryan didn't hang out with them at the Launch event, etc.

Make some popcorn, and enjoy. If Steam users who read it are gullible enough to be swayed by it, well they are probably too stupid to be concerned about, anyhow.

Rhaythe, on 16 December 2015 - 07:09 AM, said:

Founders were sold on mechwarrior online being a specific kind of game. And for a while, it was while in closed beta. Today, it's a very different game. And for many people, it's quite disappointing.

MWO is what it is. A mech-based twitch shooter that has far more in common with games like Hawken than most of us founders are comfortable with. In my opinion, it's still a good game. But I can understand why some vets are disappointed in how it's turned out.

"Thinking man's shooter". Yeah. Right.

Eh. Not all FPS are "twitch" shooters. Certainly, the twitchier you are, the better one does, but compared to Hawken or Titanfall game play? This is like... the 3 toed sloth of twitch shooters.

[ComradeHavoc]

InspectorG, on 16 December 2015 - 08:33 AM, said:

The Salt must flow.

I mean if we're going with a Dune reference, the vets really need to stop ******** on the worms, and organize.

[MechaBattler]

They expected the game to be one thing and got another. I think even PGI expected the game to go one way and then realized how much work they were in for. For a while there development just stalled out because they had to rebuild a part of the game. They said it was UI.20. But I think some fundamental part of the game was broken and they had to throw up a smoke screen so they could justify the time needed to rework it.

But this kind of thing is not uncommon. Go through games on steam that have had early access/beta and since released. You'll see a very familiar language in the reviews. "I played this game since early access and now...the devs ruined it!"

[Amsro]

InspectorG, on 16 December 2015 - 08:33 AM, said:

The Salt must flow.

[ComradeHavoc]

Amsro, on 16 December 2015 - 09:10 AM, said:

[Jun Watarase]

PGI routinely makes bad decisions. Anyone who has done marketing cannot help but facepalm.

[Rhaythe]

Bishop Steiner, on 16 December 2015 - 08:36 AM, said:

Eh. Not all FPS are "twitch" shooters. Certainly, the twitchier you are, the better one does, but compared to Hawken or Titanfall game play? This is like... the 3 toed sloth of twitch shooters.

Again, comparing it to what it once was. But I'm upvoting you just because of that comparison alone.

[DaZur]

Bittervets In this community remind a lot of the average wife/girlfriend... They can't remember the good thing they experienced yesterday but consistany bring up what you did wrong three years ago.

Edited by DaZur, 16 December 2015 - 10:18 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

DaZur, on 16 December 2015 - 10:18 AM, said:

Bittervets In this community remind a lot of the average psycho ex-wife/girlfriend... They can't remember the good thing they experienced yesterday but constantly bring up what you did wrong three years ago. And will stalk you till death, over it.

FTFY

Cuz if a person's average wife/GF experience is anything like dealing with the idjits that peopled reddit and SC forums? What in the heck are you doing with them still...even if the sex IS great?

[DaZur]

Bishop Steiner, on 16 December 2015 - 10:20 AM, said:

FTFY

Cuz if a person's average wife/GF experience is anything like dealing with the idjits that peopled reddit and SC forums? What in the heck are you doing with them still...even if the sex IS great?

Hmmm... The cook food?

Your correction is far more accurate than mine.

Edited by DaZur, 16 December 2015 - 10:25 AM.

[Lyoto Machida]

ComradeHavoc, on 16 December 2015 - 07:27 AM, said:

I haven't played MWO nearly as long as some of the players here and to me it seems pretty solid. I didn't even know that ghost heat was a thing until today.

Lol...PGI.

[Idealsuspect]

Skoll, on 16 December 2015 - 07:01 AM, said:

We're called bittervets for a reason. A big reason for the vitriol is how IGP/PGI handled the game and treated the community for several years. The sacking of Garth, Niko's reign of terror, disagreements with gameplay decisions, ghost heat.

There is a lot to be angry about but PGI is seemingly getting better appears.

Ghost hate.

In fact it's totally true what you say but we have to considere that PGI are doing some efforts in the good way since end 2014 ..
They listen "us" a bit more ( but well i guess listen the communauty less more was just impossible ^^ )

[Bishop Steiner]

DaZur, on 16 December 2015 - 10:24 AM, said:

Hmmm... The cook food?

Your correction is far more accurate than mine.

jeez....I've always done the cooking.... (it's what I get for having been a professional chef, I suppose.... though I finding cooking therapeutic, too)

[Mawai]

Some folks can't seem to get over differences that they have had with PGI over the years in terms of their community interactions, game design decisions and development priorities.

Objectively, I would say MWO is a good game. The interface has come so far in the past year that it feels like a different game. The fundamental game play, in matches, shooting up mechs, is both fun and pretty much the same as closed beta. Mechs die a bit faster on average but the recent agility nerfs slowed that down a bit since reactions are slower.

The change to overall agility by nerfing the mech XP skill bonuses actually helped the game move away from the "twitch shooter" meme which I think is a good thing. It is no longer quite so easy to turn quickly and fire at targets of opportunity or to torso twist suddenly to mitigate all of the damage onto the arms. Both quick shots and mitigation are still possible but not nearly as easy or guaranteed and I think both of those are good things.

Anyway, getting back to the "bitter" vets ... some of them quit long ago and simply hold a grudge against PGI. Some cheated and were caught. Others seem to firmly believe that no matter what PGI does it is wrong and the game must be terrible as a result. Others simply have a different vision of what MWO should be and vilify PGI for not making that game. Another group of folks are simply griefers. You get them in any MMO but these folks see the opportunity to extend it to real life. Of course, many of these would post under new or alt steam accounts to retain anonymity. The fact that most of the reviews and feedback are overwhelmingly recommending the game is a sign that the negative opinions are not a representative part of the community.

All that said, PGI has and continues to have community communications and community management problems. They appear to ignore these forums. It seems questionable that anyone at PGI even reads these comments whether they are useful or not.

In addition to that, there are game design decisions that have caused problems since they were introduced (the bad balance and hard counter nature of ECM, TAG, NARC, BAP, LRMs and SSRMs). On the other hand, although lots of folks like to complain about Ghost Heat ... it is a decent way to limit boating weapon systems without preventing it entirely. Some folks don't like it. Personally, I don't like the 6PPC Stalker and other high PPFLD builds even more.

I occasionally played AC40 mechs (K2) before Ghost heat and they were a GREAT support mech in a brawl. They were able to pump out round after round of 40 point pinpoint damage indefinitely. Four shots was usually sufficient to blow away most mechs through the CT ... and it didn't take that long. With ghost heat you manage to get off 2 of those .. the 3rd will usually overheat you.

Nine medium laser hunchbacks had a great alpha. I would really not want to see a 12 laser Nova without ghost heat. At least having to fire in two banks of six usually means the damage gets spread out a bit and gives the target a change to react.

It would be nice if they had another mechanic but personally I can't complain too much about ghost heat since the alternatives seem worse to me.

[Mystere]

Bishop Steiner, on 16 December 2015 - 10:20 AM, said:

FTFY

Cuz if a person's average wife/GF experience is anything like dealing with the idjits that peopled reddit and SC forums? What in the heck are you doing with them still...even if the sex IS great?

Was that a trick question?

Edited by Mystere, 16 December 2015 - 10:47 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Mystere, on 16 December 2015 - 10:46 AM, said:

Was that a trick question?

not really.... with basic hygiene and even the social skills of an average jr high school student, sex is one of the easiest commodities to attain these days. I admit, it seems a fair portion of gamers are lacking in both those criteria (the lack of social skills being painfully apparent by the idiocy posted without any comprehension of just how idiotic it is), so I can see the conundrum, but.......

[Jun Watarase]

Quote

The fundamental game play, in matches, shooting up mechs, is both fun and pretty much the same as closed beta.

You are forgetting that was acceptable in closed beta precisely because it was closed beta and gameplay was expected to evolve beyond an arcade shooter. The fact that it hasnt despite closed beta being 3+ years ago is quite dissapointing..

[rollermint]

jghjghj

Edited by rollermint, 16 December 2015 - 11:00 AM.

[Malagant]

Ronyn, on 16 December 2015 - 08:32 AM, said:

Some players have become heavily, and I mean heavily invested in this game(monetarily). When you have a bunch of money tied up in something and the game takes a nose dive, it's hard to let go. This heroin example, like some have acquitted it to, doesn't really apply. Money is the defining characteristic here.

When someone invests and feels like they have been burned, they have a few choices. The extreme of which is to try and make their 'once beloved' burn.

Another is to judge the game harshly with the idea that the game will improve over time.

And, another is to develop a psuedo-stockholm syndrome and pray that the nay-sayers will not burn your beloved and these are the ones that tend to become over protective of the game.

Many people that have been here for a long time know that PGI does nothing unless you have a loud voice, attack their wallet or brown nose over twitter.

^This!

[1453 R]

A goodly portion of the playerbase is unwilling to ever forgive Piranha for 2013, and has willfully discarded everything the company has done since. With the exception of any slips or mistakes, which they are quick to tear at.

‘Disillusioned’ is a good term for it, methinks. ‘Delusional’ works too, if less broadly. As has been mentioned, the Founders were sold a game which they will often claim they did not get. As well, many old BattleTech tabletop players stand behind those Founders (as they’re usually the same people, really) in claiming that this game has Betrayed The Spirit of BattleTech™ and is a travesty and abomination upon the face of their beloved franchise.

Some of these players are so disconnected from reality that they believe the franchise would honestly be better off – that it would be Better For BattleTech – if MWO were to collapse and die, and deprive Piranha of the license in the process. They actively desire to burn the game down in the hopes that someone else will start over and “give us the BattleTech game we actually want/deserve”. How these people manage to delude themselves into thinking that any developer would be willing to touch a property whose playerbase actively and deliberately attacks any attempt to adapt the franchise to the modern day, I do not know. But I suspect it involves the sort of narcotics they do not grow in fields in Kansas.