68 replies to this topic

[MeiSooHaityu]

Ultimatum X, on 28 December 2015 - 11:13 AM, said:

Well, if Catapults get re-scaled soon I'll probably be upset I didn't grab the Jester during this sale.

I've actually always wanted the Jester, but I've just never wanted to level most of the other Catapults to make it worthwhile.

I can't blame you for not wanting to grind the other Catapult variants. I think the K2 is still pretty decent, but the missile variants can be difficult. I had mastered them a long time ago when such things was easier. If I had to pick a third to grind now, maybe the C1. Still, it wouldn't be easy.

I have the Thunderbolts from the Phoenix pack but they just never "clicked" with me. I bet the Top Dog is nice though.

One thing is for sure, PGI does seem to LOVE the Thunderbolt. If it isn't the Top Dog's hardpoints, it was the ERPPC version (5S?) that used to rule the landscape. It seems like it is always being made to be the defacto IS heavy against the Clans. I'm not complaining, it just seems like the Thunderbolt has seen a lot of love from the devs.

Edited by MeiSooHaityu, 28 December 2015 - 11:24 AM.

[LordNothing]

im sitting on 2300 mc and hope to have enough to buy the top dog before the sale ends. that means lots and lots of cw in the next 2 days. if i fail i might just blow it on an arrow instead or sit on it till the next sale. i currently have 20 or so mechs to master and dont really want to throw on any more unless i can get a really good deal.

jester has the issue that its a support chassis and really isnt very survivable. put a std in it and suddenly its not very fast and cant carry the same firepower.

i never really liked the jagermech either. of course its a chassis i bought early on and sold to free up a mech bay and really didnt take it all the way up the skill tree. though i really like the paint job on the hero.

top dog is a tbolt with the firing points of a banshee. laser vomit overwhelming. if you play a lot of cw you might want. i know i do.

[LordNothing]

Ultimatum X, on 28 December 2015 - 11:13 AM, said:

Well, if Catapults get re-scaled soon I'll probably be upset I didn't grab the Jester during this sale.

I've actually always wanted the Jester, but I've just never wanted to level most of the other Catapults to make it worthwhile.

lerm boats seem to level faster than other mechs if you know how to lerm well (not boating, and staying with the group instead of in the rear, and bringing lock enhancers). but i avoided the a1 like the plague. i leveled the k2 and the other lermapults, but only kept the k2.

[Amsro]

ChewBaka, on 27 December 2015 - 08:06 PM, said:

I was actually thinking of getting a Misery with the MC I earned from events (I have ~4k plus now from, and I didn't even spend a single cent for most of it) however now that I have been reminded of the Catapult re-scaling...hmm...

But the heavy queue is so saturated these days...

Truly it has always been the most popular, no real reason not to run a Heavy mech, best all around mechs.

[Ultimax]

LordNothing, on 28 December 2015 - 11:36 AM, said:

lerm boats seem to level faster than other mechs if you know how to lerm well (not boating, and staying with the group instead of in the rear, and bringing lock enhancers). but i avoided the a1 like the plague. i leveled the k2 and the other lermapults, but only kept the k2.

Playing LRM mechs puts you at the mercy of your team, and the mercy of your opponents ability to not be terrible.

When LRMs are made into a real weapon system that is fun, rewarding and without the ability to play while you eat a sandwhich then I'll start using them again.


Please don't go into the "know how to play LRMs" load of crap, its really not that complicated.

[Aresye]

Jester...hands down.

Between structure buffs, XL friendly hitboxes, jump jets, and high mounts, you can turn a Jester into basically a complete copy of the classic TBR laser vomit.

Mine's packin' 2LPL, 4ML, runs 90kph, and can jump. It's everything the TBR wanted to be.

It's such a good mech I'd classify it as a Tier 1, but I'm going to say Tier 2 because of its torso pitch angles.

[CDLord HHGD]

In this order:

1. Firebrand
2. Jester
3. Top Dog

The FB is way more versatile than the other two loadout-wise. I like the Jester's JJ and twin AMS. Top Dog for me was very uninspired.

[Clownwarlord]

1 or 2 ... 3 is to hot imo.

2 I own but 1 I wish I also owned.

[Bud Crue]

1) Firebrand. Because it is the only mech I am aware of that apparently inspires superstitious fear/offense in some folks for the "satanic symbols" decorating it. I'm not making this up (its been mentioned on other forums posts). Any pretend machine in a pretend game of war that is some how more morally repugnant than other pretend war machines must be bad-***. That, and you can run some diverse load outs as mentioned above.

2) Topdog. Cuz another T-bolt is never a bad idea, even though most of the other variants are better.

3) K-2 if you can live with an XL it is a fun, mobile heavy. Alas it is too similar in size, performance and potential loadouts to my beloved Quickdraws (5k).

[Ultimax]

Aresye Kerensky, on 28 December 2015 - 01:27 PM, said:

Mine's packin' 2LPL, 4ML, runs 90kph, and can jump. It's everything the TBR wanted to be.

2x LPL
4x MLAS

42 point alpha @ 337.5m if using MLAS Range Mod
27 heat to alpha (30-10%)
Estimate 19 DHS
76.2 heat cap
3.75 h/s dissipation


Well, if that's enough firepower.


TBR

2x CLPL
2x CMPL

42 point alpha @ 370m if using CMPL Range Mod and MK I TC
32 heat to alpha
25 DHS
MK I TC
79.8 heat cap
4.89 h/s dissipation


I feel like "...everything the TBR wanted to be" is a bit of a stretch, since the TBR can do something similar and runs at least as cool if not cooler.


There are some solid IS side builds that can't be replicated now clan side, that's for sure, however when I see people discuss how "hot" clan builds are compared to an IS build its usually because that mech is sporting a much large alpha.

Drop the TBRs alpha to something similar and its in a similar ballpark (19 DHS + -15% heat quirk vs. 25 DHS in the above comparison for example), and basically pays for its range with burn time.



(Alternatively I think you could also do 5x CMPLs with MK 6 TC and get to 385m range, doing 40 damage for 30 heat with 25 DHS.)

Edited by Ultimatum X, 28 December 2015 - 06:40 PM.

[Y E O N N E]

Aresye Kerensky, on 28 December 2015 - 01:27 PM, said:

Jester...hands down.

Between structure buffs, XL friendly hitboxes, jump jets, and high mounts, you can turn a Jester into basically a complete copy of the classic TBR laser vomit.

Mine's packin' 2LPL, 4ML, runs 90kph, and can jump. It's everything the TBR wanted to be.

It's such a good mech I'd classify it as a Tier 1, but I'm going to say Tier 2 because of its torso pitch angles.

Closer to the EBJ, to be honest.

Still, it's a solid build. I love the Jester, it's always been something of a diamond in the rough and now it finally shines.

[Barantor]

Yeonne Greene, on 28 December 2015 - 06:26 PM, said:

Closer to the EBJ, to be honest.

Still, it's a solid build. I love the Jester, it's always been something of a diamond in the rough and now it finally shines.

I'm hoping the rescale makes the diamond shine, both for the Jester and for the K2. My old founders cat might work a bit better too, but not until LRMs have the changes they need.

I've always done solid in my Jester, though it can't really tank damage as a tip of the spear by any means, it's mobility lets it flank or do hit and runs very well while putting down a lot of hate. With LPL range extension module it can poke ok too.

[Y E O N N E]

See, I've never thought that the two direct-fire CPLTs were "bad." Before the hit-box pass, I would swing the nose around to intercept shots intended for my XL sides and it was very effective. The K2 was a reliable dealer of pain using 4x ML and 2x AC/10 on an XL300 or with 1x AC/20 and 4x ML on a STD 300. In CW, I would run it with 4x ERLL and it would rack up some great damage (didn't have the Jester yet).

Once I got the Jester, I decided it was even better, since 2x LPL + 4x ML is extremely comfortable even on a STD 300 and that's practically the same thing as the AC/10 K2 build...but more durable and no ammo limitation.

Now with the additional hit-points, you can club enemy 'Mechs to death with relative ease using the direct-fire CPLTs. Shrunken down, and I think it'll join the [ridiculously powerful] Quickdraw at T1.

[MeiSooHaityu]

Yeonne Greene, on 28 December 2015 - 06:26 PM, said:

Closer to the EBJ, to be honest.

Still, it's a solid build. I love the Jester, it's always been something of a diamond in the rough and now it finally shines.

Yea, the Catapult is the IS equivalent to the EBJ IMO. Same weight, similar characteristics and hitboxes, speed and manuverability is similar, and both have similar high mounted weapon placement (although an EBJ's is in the torso and not arms).

I think that is why, as a classic Catapult pilot, I like the EBJ.

[AssaultPig]

was considering jester/top dog myself, wound up getting a jester and have been pretty happy with it (top dog does look fun though, those things die hard.)

both are better options than the firebrand imo; it's hardpoints/quirks make it best suited as a brawler and in the current meta jaegers are too fragile for that

if you want to do dual gauss or dual AC20 the jaeger A does it better

Edited by AssaultPig, 29 December 2015 - 03:03 AM.

[5LeafClover]

Very pleased about the level of discussion this thread has created.

The advice has been personally very helpful to me. In the end I bought a smidge more MC and got both Jester and Top Dog.

[MeiSooHaityu]

Just a side note.

Talking about the Jester inspired me to take it out last night. It was the first time after the Hitbox changes. Yikes! the side torsos take a lot of damage now. I went from a melting CT to melting STs. Maybe the Marauder spoiled me, but I feel the Catapult is still fragile.

Anyway, still a good choice, but torso twist and look for ideal positioning.

[Ultimax]

MeiSooHaityu, on 30 December 2015 - 03:01 AM, said:

Just a side note.

Talking about the Jester inspired me to take it out last night. It was the first time after the Hitbox changes. Yikes! the side torsos take a lot of damage now. I went from a melting CT to melting STs. Maybe the Marauder spoiled me, but I feel the Catapult is still fragile.

Anyway, still a good choice, but torso twist and look for ideal positioning.

Its funny I was on the edge of just buying it during the sale, but a buddy in my unit already has it and told me about how bad the Torso pitch was.


That basically sealed it for me, there are at least a half dozen energy based heavy mechs on the IS side that have standout quirks* that I think I'll just skip the Jester and leave it to the aficionados.

[Barantor]

MeiSooHaityu, on 30 December 2015 - 03:01 AM, said:

Just a side note.

Talking about the Jester inspired me to take it out last night. It was the first time after the Hitbox changes. Yikes! the side torsos take a lot of damage now. I went from a melting CT to melting STs. Maybe the Marauder spoiled me, but I feel the Catapult is still fragile.

Anyway, still a good choice, but torso twist and look for ideal positioning.

Yeah I'm going to try it with a standard engine and see what I can do, but the downside to that is it won't be that near 100kph heavy flanker it used to be.

[Ultimax]

Barantor, on 30 December 2015 - 04:12 PM, said:

Yeah I'm going to try it with a standard engine and see what I can do, but the downside to that is it won't be that near 100kph heavy flanker it used to be.

These should be decent, shield with the left side.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...22037cad56a42c5

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...4aac3dcce4fef86

Edited by Ultimatum X, 30 December 2015 - 04:21 PM.