28 replies to this topic

[Frosty7]

I've been playing this for about 34 hours now, according to Steam, and until recently I kinda just figured the community had zero clue on how to play the game. I would typically attempt to cover a flank or attack an enemy flank but just get left by my lonesome as everyone clustered into a ball and left me for dead. Even my Atlas and Dire Wolf would succumb to the most meager and random flank attack because nobody would help me push back. I was beginning to think that the meta revolved entirely around clustering into a big ball at the start of the game and following the hive mind wherever it guided us, but I took a look on the forums for advice.

I saw that cartoon strategy guide thing and thought it was fun but it only told me everything I already knew. After all, I am a long time fan of the Total War series so formation maneuvering isn't something I aint never heard of before, so once again I assumed nobody knew what the definition of "team work" was. I bit the bullet and continued following the hive mind as everyone else did because it felt like the only way to keep myself in the game, but I still couldn't resist pushing those yummy squishy flanks. Every single time I'd still get abandoned by the two medium mechs who were right beside me moments before and killed in moments while the rest of my zerg swarm continued to stroll in a general direction parallel and unrelated to the enemy.

About five ish hours ago I discover this thing called "pilot skill" by browsing these forums. I check mine and I'm firmly stuck in the center of 4 and haven't budged ever since then. One match I single handedly rescued a friendly King Crab who was the one and only guy on our right flank, took up his place as the bullet sponge, called frantically for reinforcements via text chat, damaged the crud out of a Dire Wolf and an opposing King Crab, and then died after spotting at least a total of 5 bad guys. Thankfully our buddies did win the day since they arrived right as I died and mopped up the remains my declawed and half cored victims, so I wanted to spectate to see the final results of my performance... According to the after action report I LOST PILOT SKILL!!! I guess the fact that I only lived for 3 minutes makes me a noob.

Now... I really just want to know how in the love of Battletech am I supposed to ever get a chance to run with people who actually know how to play this game. I'm not a competetive gamer at all but I do like to put in an effort and not be doomed to a 4 minute life expectancy because nobody else knows what they are doing. Are there any tricks to racking up pilot skill or am I just going to have to tolerate these lobotomized zerglings for the rest of my natural life span?

[Wintersdark]

You have to get better. To do that? Read threads here. Learn to build strong robots. Learn to mitigate damage. While you're new in particular stay with the group. Not necessarily squashed up together, but inside a couple hundred meters. Don't rely on others not abandoning you; you don't abandon them.

The first step to being a good player in MWO is learning to keep your ego in check and work with the team, rather than expecting them to work with you.

Edited by Wintersdark, 29 December 2015 - 07:50 PM.

[Frosty7]

Wintersdark, on 29 December 2015 - 07:49 PM, said:

You have to get better. To do that? Read threads here... Don't rely on others not abandoning you; you don't abandon them.

You didn't read my post.

Anyway, just played in my Jagermech on Crimson Strait. We made a plan in the pre-game to send alpha on a flank run, bravo to cover the mountain pass, and charlie (my lance) to hold the tunnel. Everyone ditched two of the bravo guys to hang out with me at the tunnel. I said something about it in chat and some people went back to mountain pass (including some of alpha lance). Once the fighting started, all but myself, one other charlie lancer, and one alpha lancer stuck to the plan. Everyone who wasn't already at the mountain pass trickled there one at a time to get get killed one at a time. And hey, I managed to shoot at exactly one bad guy before I got cored myself, so I lost more elo yay!

Come on guys, this whole elo thing doesn't help people learn how to play: it just drowns the newcomers in their own ignorance so that they never get better because nobody with experience and skill is around for them to learn from.

[Neutron IX]

It can really help to find a gang of pilots to run with.

Check out the recruitment forums, and even if you don't join up with a unit, alot of folks are down to run with you in groups. Hang out on faction recruitment threads or see if you can get onto house team speak units and look for groups to run with.

Most groups/units are always happy to find players who are interested in team strategies and tactics.

And who knows, you might discover a unit that's a really great fit, and make it your permanent home even,

[Wintersdark]

Yeah, joining a unit is going to get you the best training.

Complex plans - multiprong attacks and flanks - are a losing strategy in the public queue even at higher tiers, let alone t5/t4. It's too hard to adequately communicate and coordinate without the training and practice you get fighting alongside the same guys all the time.

The most successful strategy at low level play is the murderball. Master that, execute it well, then you'll move up.

But yeah, there are LOTS of units that pride themselves in taking on new players and training them, if you're sincerely willing to learn. There's a LOT to learn, too.

[Frosty7]

Will try the looking for group feature then. Looks a bit empty but that might be because of the time of night. Yay afternoon shift!

Edit: Define "murderball?" I feel like that's when everyone forms into a single blobby phalanx thingy like I've been seeing a lot but it could be something else too

Edited by Frosty7, 29 December 2015 - 08:34 PM.

[Modo44]

Welcome to MWO.

PSR is an experience bar, only somewhat correlated to player skill. Since you obviously have a grasp on tactics, it should go up to tier 3 relatively quickly for you. Unfortunately, it slows down later.

Because of the high TTK compared to other games, it pays greatly to be in a tight group/communicating firing line shooting at the same targets. You can rarely take on more than one mech solo, and it is generally not advisable. Good players know this, and converge as a matter of course. To achieve that kind of cooperation in lower tiers, you pretty much have to group up (and sometimes yell at people).

BTW, you still want to learn how to build mechs properly, since bringing solid builds plays a crucial part in MWO. Go to Metamechs.

Edited by Modo44, 29 December 2015 - 10:28 PM.

[Spetulhu]

Frosty7, on 29 December 2015 - 07:42 PM, said:

I really just want to know how in the love of Battletech am I supposed to ever get a chance to run with people who actually know how to play this game. Are there any tricks to racking up pilot skill or am I just going to have to tolerate these lobotomized zerglings for the rest of my natural life span?

I've had an account for years but only started playing "seriously" in the last few months myself. A solo pilot can become a terror on his own, but if he has a couple of guys to run with he'll be much much more, well, everything. You sound like someone who would like playing in a group so I'd recommend getting with a so-called unit. Not only will that mean you can go quick play with a couple mates, you can also do Faction Warfare with a couple mates. Third-party as it is TeamSpeak3 (as in so many games) is about the minimum point where you show that you actually want to join a team and become a useful member of that team.

[Roland09]

Frosty7, on 29 December 2015 - 07:42 PM, said:

Assaults...

1. Flanking in an Assault Mech is not a good idea in general (exceptions exist), since Assaults tend to be slow, especially the 100 ton monsters. By the time you get where you think the enemy was two minutes ago, they may be long gone. Also, a single Assault Mech moving on a flank makes a juicy target for any small group of enemy fast mechs, or even a single Locust. Even if he doesn't kill you, you will most likely also not kill him, and while you are manoevering to cover your backside, he has practically neutralized a much larger portion of your team's total firepower for only a tiny fraction of their's.

Instead, you should be part of the spearhead formed by your Assault lance. Sticking with the rest of the team is good advice. Leave the flanking to your more nimble team mates.

2. You were frantically typing for help? Try to use in-game VOIP instead. It's more likely to get people's attention, and you don't have to essentially block your controls while you are typing. Otherwise, the best thing you can do while typing is either run in a straight line (which sucks), or get your *** plastered to some building, which sucks as well.

3. Better still, get Teamspeak, which is way more comfortable than in-game VOIP, join a unit or at least get on a faction's major TS hub. talking to people makes things easier, not only when calling for help, but also for coordinating your spearhead assault.

Oh, btw: housekurita.tserverhq.com

[White Bear 84]

Frosty7, on 29 December 2015 - 07:42 PM, said:

Are there any tricks to racking up pilot skill or am I just going to have to tolerate these lobotomized zerglings for the rest of my natural life span?

From my knowledge, score above 150 damage in a win to go up and score 450+ damage in a lose to prevent yourself from going down. Don't know how/if this is different in lower tiers..

Generally speaking anyone that plays well can go up.. ..really helps if you get wins though, more than often enough this will involve you pulling in extra hard, but will always be those matches where the team is a total fail and your best is still not good enough, just have to roll with the punches and keep carrying as best you can!

Edited by White Bear 84, 30 December 2015 - 01:29 AM.

[Pat Kell]

Being an assault pilot is honestly one of the toughest skills to learn. You have to know when to commit yourself because since they are the slowest, once committed, it is very difficult to withdraw from the fight. Also, I have preached this before but people who speak of flanking and complex maneuvering such as you mentioned in your post about crimson straits is best left to people who have had the time, patience and comms to make it work. If you don't have all 3 of these things, any time you make a flanking maneuver work will most likely be due to either luck or pure negligence on the enemy teams part. Sadly, in solo que, sticking with the herd is generally the best tactic around. If you like complex maneuvers, I would agree that finding a team to run with is key.

Some things to keep in mind, as an assault, don't commit too soon unless you fell that your death will bring victory to your team. As a Heavy and medium, look for opportunities to get off a free shot on an enemy that is focused on someone else. As a light, look for those lone assaults that have been left behind by their team or who have thought it might be a good idea to try and flank. Flanking should be left to mechs who have the ability and speed to withdraw. Sorry if you feel like this is preaching to the choir as you seem to have a good feel for combat tactics but this game boils down to who can put the most guns on target at once, which is why forming into a ball and just roaming the battlefield all together tends to win the day.

Also, use arty strikes or UAV's to get extra damage or spotting assists, and try to take advantage of all the little bonuses that come from shooting a mech that is shooting a friendly, running with your lance, being near mediums and lights etc etc...the game rewards sticking together more than anything and this is what will help your PSR go up.

Edited by Pat Kell, 30 December 2015 - 01:39 AM.

[Rogue Jedi]

a new player is placed into tier 5, where the least skilled players reside, as you get better you will go to higher tiers, where you will be teamed with and against more skilled players, however in solo queue you will rarely get the real teamwork you seem to want.

You can try taking command and suggesting tactics, I should not need to say this, but request and suggest do not demand or order, and be polite about it, do not swear at or insult. Most importantly do not take it personally when the team disregard your strategy ^{(and they will, frequently)}.

To get the advanced tactical play you seem to want find and join a unit.
http://mwomercs.com/...s-inner-sphere/
http://mwomercs.com/...factions-clans/
http://mwomercs.com/...ons-merc-corps/

Group queue and Faction play are completely different to solo queue, for starters if someone takes command people are usualy more willing to work together, and in a larger group it is possible to start planning as soon as you know what map you are on, and if you can get the rest of the team on board you can pull off some advanced tactics.

Edited by Rogue Jedi, 30 December 2015 - 01:50 AM.

[LightningStorm]

If you call yourself a good tactician, then you should use voip to guide others to execute your plan, especially in pug faction play queue, I can't count how many faction games i've won thanks to someone taking up command.

[mailin]

Yes, the murderball is what you've been seeing. Stay close to your buddies and move with them. Maybe don't think of it as a murder ball. Instead think of it as The Jelly Donut of Destruction With One Bite Taken Out Of It. Assaults are the filling, mediums and heavies are the light, fluffy batter, and lights and fast mediums are the sugar coating on the outside. As long as the Jelly Donut of Destruction With One Bite Taken Out Of It stays together you won't make a mess.

The first, most important tactic to learn other than the murder ball is patience. Go with the murderball and wait for the hive mentality to take over. Move with them. There are a LOT of lessons to learn after that, but for now, that's the most important. Your primary focus at this point is to stay alive while dealing some damage. Don't be hasty, and the enemy will come to you.

[The Basilisk]

The lfg feature is NOT what you are looking for.
From what i read in your opening post you got some serious missconceptions about the Game and how it works.
Best thing for you would be to forget everything you think to know about taktics and vidgames, get recruited, join a group on voice com and start from scratch.
There realy is A LOT to learn.
VOIP will make this easyer.

Edited by The Basilisk, 30 December 2015 - 02:29 AM.

[Rogue Jedi]

Frosty7, on 29 December 2015 - 08:11 PM, said:

Anyway, just played in my Jagermech on Crimson Strait. We made a plan in the pre-game to send alpha on a flank run, bravo to cover the mountain pass, and charlie (my lance) to hold the tunnel. Everyone ditched two of the bravo guys to hang out with me at the tunnel. I said something about it in chat and some people went back to mountain pass (including some of alpha lance). Once the fighting started, all but myself, one other charlie lancer, and one alpha lancer stuck to the plan. Everyone who wasn't already at the mountain pass trickled there one at a time to get get killed one at a time. And hey, I managed to shoot at exactly one bad guy before I got cored myself,

you said you planned pre game, how many players were involved in the planning or agreed to follow it? I ask because not everyone has chat switched on, the same as VOIP it can be disabled. it is possible you made that grand plan with 2-4 other players and more than half the team did not know about it.

Quote

so I lost more elo yay!

this whole elo thing doesn't help people learn how to play: it just drowns the newcomers in their own ignorance so that they never get better because nobody with experience and skill is around for them to learn from.

Elo was phased out months ago in favor of the Player Skill Rating levels, but it is nice to see you have read some of the older threads

[epikt]

Frosty7, on 29 December 2015 - 08:11 PM, said:

Anyway, just played in my Jagermech on Crimson Strait. We made a plan in the pre-game to send alpha on a flank run, bravo to cover the mountain pass, and charlie (my lance) to hold the tunnel.

That's a bad plan.
It basically means you have to fight 4v12, then 4v12, then 4v12.

[Insufficient Skill]

*nvm*

Edited by Insufficient Skill, 19 January 2016 - 02:31 PM.

[Not A Real RAbbi]

^^^ THIS. Our friend epikt has nailed it, there. Yeah, it sure looks like the game WANTS you to work in lances of 4, within your company of 12. Looks are deceiving. Sending four of anything on a 'flank run' is almost certainly suicide, unless they're GOOD light drivers and find a BAD team's straggling BAD assault driver or two left alone. OR, they may be able to delay by stirring up some chaos in the opponent's backfield. In Tier 4 PUG play, though, that's unlikely to be a good idea, and maybe, MAYBE, two lights AT MOST may blow a minute or two off harassing the enemy before contact.

Sadly, real-world thinking gets you slaughtered in the game world. Example: Call of DutyField, or whatever. Yeah, tactical A F...

MWO isn't much different in some ways. The meta game has developed on its own. It is its own living, breathing, ugly, stinky breath, yellow-teeth, adult video collecting in grandma's basement, MONSTER, with a mouse in one hand and a box of Kleenex in the other; Ritalin's collecting dust in the medicine cabinet.

Tiers 5 and 4, you move up by joining the murderball and out-trading the other guys. ESPECIALLY in an assault mech. Your opponents aren't that great, most likely, at focusing their fires, so you'll live plenty long that way. Find a target that your buddies are shooting, that you have line-of-sight to, and shoot at it too. Kill steal? Sure, it's all good in PUGlandia. Throw down, homie. Learn to torso twist, keep an eye out at all times for LRM cover, and never let yourself get separated from the murderball. You'll be over here in Tier 3 grind with me in no time...

[Koniving]

Frosty7, on 29 December 2015 - 07:42 PM, said:

You're in a pit with most newbies to begin with, giving you (and them) a chance to learn the game. I should mention there's two distinctions in "Pilot Skill."

There's "Pilot Skills" as in the skill tree that lets you access modules to improve your mech.

Then there is "Pilot Skill Rating" in which the game compares your skills to other players' skills and then if you lose to say, lower skills, you lose skill. If you lose to higher skills, it stays the same. You win against higher skills, yours goes up. If you win against equal skills, it goes up or stays the same. If you lose to equal skills, it either goes down or stays the same.

In any given match, there's bound to be two people with a 'higher skill set.' Usually, they're the ones with paint.
Normally, they're in the middle of the group with everyone forming up around them or strangely, they're the ones behind your group, causing the entire group to split off and chase or systematically killing your group with terrifying efficiency.

Edited by Koniving, 30 December 2015 - 05:17 AM.