107 replies to this topic

[InvisibleJim]

Available tonnage should vary every day based upon the number of players dropping per faction.

Perhaps it should 'drag' based upon tonnes lost to simulate the effect of equipment losses in war.

This would encourage people to "spread out" and to improve their play.

Edited by InvisibleJim, 07 January 2016 - 11:30 AM.

[knight-of-ni]

Koniving, on 05 January 2016 - 05:21 PM, said:

Going the otherway in tonnages would be far more beneficial to gameplay as a whole. Range of 225 being a pretty good start. Even better would be changing weight limits based on location. Say this planet gets a weight limit of X, but that planet has a weight limit of Y. Per battle might be neat but it'd be a little too often. Ultimately to make CW more fun, it needs 1) a goddamn purpose, 2) a distinction between faction and merc units, 3) fewer camping assault mechs hiding in the shrubbery next to turrets, 4) more dynamic "drop off" points, 5) more dynamic turret locations, 6) actual missions, 7) different stages of victory/defeat,...

Actually I could go on for a long time. First and foremost CW needs less "meta," and for that the drop weights need to be more dynamic.

A shrubbery?

[Koniving]

knnniggett, on 07 January 2016 - 12:35 PM, said:

A shrubbery?

Yesh. Assaults in the Shrubbery.


The kind you bring home to the Knights who say Nii.

[Sugabearto Kell]

^^ I pissed myself laughing

[s33b]

may i don´t understand all of your thinking about that ,sorry for my bad english knowlage for now,

but i don´t know why so many of you want restrictions of cw tonnage. clans and is are nearly balanced (in my opinion). everyone should choose they own dropdeck even if clans and is could take 400tons ,and? where is the problem? why i must choose lights for cw when i prefer heavies and assaults? everyone skills are that only thing why cw NEVER will be right balanced for all.

Edited by s33b, 07 January 2016 - 06:11 PM.

[GermanPartisan]

Kotev, on 05 January 2016 - 06:18 PM, said:

It won`t help even if they increase to 300 tons. Problem is that with recent Is buffs and Clan nerfs, IS has slight advantage over Clan and every expirience player will want to max his potential so 90% went IS. All new people is going to Clan becouse of its attractivnes and cool looks so there is big skill lvl difference at the moment. This is all from PUG world perspective but unit premades also follow the same line. THE only way to correct this is to buff clan mechs at IS lvl and make dropdeck tonnage same.

A "SLIGHT" advantage ? - They have EVERY advantage there is ... Theyre mainly laserboating these days so lets compare - they can fire more LL or LPL at once, those are usually mounted on chassis that give them ridicoulus ranges (800m+, 911m on battlemasters for ERLL) - they have lower burndurations, lower CD - higher alphas ( cause they can fire more weapons at once)

They have more tonnage, pretty much all relevant mechs have structure buffs that put them up at least one class ( BJs sport the structure of heavy mechs )

They can actually vary the size of their engines ( and making us go slower now when losing one sidetorso might be realistic to a degree but wasnt really necessary ) - have no fixed JJs

Clan ERLL are basically unplayable - the burnduration is just too damn high - LPLs are the only way to go stuck at 660m max range (still the best clanweapon), the maxrange of ML and MPL got cropped, so that its not double the range anymore.

And the list goes on and on and on.

So what I see here is a HUGE advantage - IS is flat out better right now in every conceivable way. Thats why everyone is flocking to IS.

PGI needs to stop to listen to TIER 5 players, without unit, getting crushed in CW - whilst running LRM Centurions - flocking the forums crying for further nerfs to clanmechs. Clans did dominate once, not because the weapons were imbalanced, but because we had the stronger playerbase - It takes more time and sometimes even money to get clanmechs so ofc you usually end up with more dedicated players that spent more time playing the game on the clanside. But you cannot start to balance gamemechanics based on your playerbase.

The recent developments in CW show this to be true - once the better units/players switched, IS started dominating the game. Because now the Inner Sphere has the better mechs AND most of the better players. IS mechs as they stand right now are way better than clanmechs. Period.

Edited by GermanPartisan, 07 January 2016 - 08:44 PM.

[Alec Braca]

GermanPartisan, on 07 January 2016 - 08:42 PM, said:

A "SLIGHT" advantage ? - They have EVERY advantage there is ... Theyre mainly laserboating these days so lets compare - they can fire more LL or LPL at once, those are usually mounted on chassis that give them ridicoulus ranges (800m+, 911m on battlemasters for ERLL) - they have lower burndurations, lower CD - higher alphas ( cause they can fire more weapons at once)

They have more tonnage, pretty much all relevant mechs have structure buffs that put them up at least one class ( BJs sport the structure of heavy mechs )

They can actually vary the size of their engines ( and making us go slower now when losing one sidetorso might be realistic to a degree but wasnt really necessary ) - have no fixed JJs

Clan ERLL are basically unplayable - the burnduration is just too damn high - LPLs are the only way to go stuck at 660m max range (still the best clanweapon), the maxrange of ML and MPL got cropped, so that its not double the range anymore.

And the list goes on and on and on.

So what I see here is a HUGE advantage - IS is flat out better right now in every conceivable way. Thats why everyone is flocking to IS.

PGI needs to stop to listen to TIER 5 players, without unit, getting crushed in CW - whilst running LRM Centurions - flocking the forums crying for further nerfs to clanmechs. Clans did dominate once, not because the weapons were imbalanced, but because we had the stronger playerbase - It takes more time and sometimes even money to get clanmechs so ofc you usually end up with more dedicated players that spent more time playing the game on the clanside. But you cannot start to balance gamemechanics based on your playerbase.

The recent developments in CW show this to be true - once the better units/players switched, IS started dominating the game. Because now the Inner Sphere has the better mechs AND most of the better players. IS mechs as they stand right now are way better than clanmechs. Period.

Dude. The ERLGL is not unplayable. 4 of us were killed by massed (laser boated) ERLGL from a long ways off on Boreal and got bogged down unable to open the gate. Don't tell me that Clan weapons are unplayable because I have fought 228/KCom/BO/-SC-/ in occasional CW matches and we get rolled. So my question is that when you a utterly smashed, did you just get outplayed or do you really blame the weapon systems? Do you see how many Clanners use LRMS now and boat lasers?

Did Clan territory shrink because all of the competitive merc units leave and left uncoordinated pugs and newbies who are inexperienced and don't communicate? Or is it because of IS buffs on SOME of the mechs?

Do you ever see a Fenris in CW? No. Do you ever see a Vindicator in CW? No. This is because they suck and they sucked before and "nerfs" and "buffs." Be honest, are you consecutively getting rolled because you are being outplayed? Really ask yourself "am I doing anything wrong?" I know for damn sure we did many things wrong in terrible matches. I don't understand. Do some players suffer from the "Stackpole effect" and think just because they went Clan automatically think that they're entitled to victory no matter how much or how they play? SOME SOME people sound entitled! This is sometimes how it sounds like. I'm sorry but talk to the big merc units who do what they do, and that is jump from faction to faction. If PGI really wanted to **** you over, they would say that the Clanners would NEVER hire mercs because they don't believe in them per canon.

It's like arguing about religion, this is perpetual. Send a letter to Russ and the dev team on how you have been screwed over and ask why they did it so they can personally write each and every one of you how sorry they are about a December 1st patch. Then you can write all of the big merc units and ask for their apology that they are not fighting FOR you and now AGAINST you. But everything will be cool again when they jump back to Clan again.

Now, that being said, I will write Russ and the dev team about how the Clanners took 1/4 of the IS and surrounded Terra before the map reset bc Clan are fantastically OP and I did nothing wrong except lose matches when I got outplayed.

While I'm at it I will write Russ a letter demanding how the IS lost Tukayyid twice and the CLans got 1/4 of the IS before the map reset, including pretty much, the borders of the Republic of the Sphere surrounding Terra.

*head explodes*

Edited by Alec Braca, 08 January 2016 - 12:41 PM.

[Kreisel]

So max weight of each weight class of mech is 35+55+75+100= 265. The current weight limit is you get to take the your pick of just about any mech so long as you stick to one of each class, if you want more than one of a heavier class then something has to drop in weight. Thus there is still some trade off in your choices for the tonnage of the mechs you bring, just not as much of one.

I get why some people really feel we should have lower tonnage limits but think of this: Clan CW Tonnage limits might be more limited by what people are liable to actually HAVE available in terms of mechs. Clan mechs take an inordinate number of C-bills (and thus hours of play) to earn, so it's likely most clan players have bought at least one pack. Realistically speaking any customer who bought a a Clan pack is going to expect (and rightfully so) that they can make a viable CW drop deck from that pack.

Invasion, Smallest tonnage for a mech of each class: 35+50+70+85= 240
Invasion, Largest tonnage for a mech of each class: 35+55+75+100= 265
Invasion, just bought the cheap half: 35+50+70+100=255
Wave 2: 25+45+65+80= 215 (lets face it, your only good option if you only bought this pack is to stack Hellbringers)
Wave 3: 30+45+65+95= 235
Origins: 35+50+75+90= 250
Steam: 30+55+75+100= 260

Clan Mechs available at specific tonnages.
20: none
25: Mist Lynx
30: Arctic cheetah
35: Kit Fox, Adder, Jenner IIC
40: none
45: Ice Ferret, Shadow Cat
50: Nova, Hunchback IIC
55: Stormcrow
60: Mad Dog
65: Hellbringer, Ebon Jaguar
70: Summoner
75: Timber Wolf, Orion IIC
80: Gargoyle
85: Warhawk
90: Highlander IIC
95: Executioner
100: Dire Wolf

Now look at that list again an eliminate all the mechs that are garbage for CW. Trying to put together a workable drop deck without taking the same one over and over is tricky, especially if you are trying to work from only one of two of the Clan packs (since the majority of players can't afford $500 to buy them all). The lack of variety of tonnage for good mechs, particularly within the smaller tonnage range is pretty restrictive and really encourages stacking several of the same mech.

You can complain that the new tonnage limits allows for stacking meta, but that's nothing new and isn't going to improve by dropping the max tonnage, they were stacking loads of the same mech since the beginning. Early clan CW was nothing but Stormcrows and Timberwolves, rare was the occasional kitfox or Dire Whale and for as much as you saw them the rest of the Clan mech might as well have not existed. Wave 2 introduced swarms Hellbringers, etc... It has little to do with the tonnage limits and a LOT to do with the HUGE gap between how good some clan mechs are compared to other clan mechs. There are very few 'decent'/midrange clan mechs in terms of competitiveness, Clan mechs tend to either be massively dominate or nearly useless, without a lot of in-between ground. I'd call the increase in tonnage a good thing, it means players have a greater opportunity to build drop decks from the selection of mechs they actually HAVE but doesn't really change people spamming meta-mechs, it just shifts slightly which meta they choose to spam.

You don't HAVE to max the tonnage of your drop deck, my IS drop deck is under-tonnage and performs much better that way than if I try to force the extra tonnage to meet the max requirement, an increase in tonnage doesn't mean you have to adjust your dropdeck, it means you have more options if you think you have a better build available.