21 replies to this topic

[Mortec]

Greetings,

Slight veteran player, but fairly new to CW.

Soo, I've joined a House and the reinforcement call came up.

Planet info said my House was the occupying unit - which to me sounds like we're controlling/holding it. Text next to it said something along the lines of 'bla-bla-bla Council has issued contract for Defense, (or something like that)' and lastly the button to get in queue said 'defend' (or is it 'defense'?, can't remember right now).

Get in game.

We're attacking..

Eh?

Hopefully, and perhaps most likely, I've missed something obvious here.

Thanks.

Edited by Mortec, 04 January 2016 - 09:33 AM.

[MrJeffers]

Mortec, on 04 January 2016 - 09:30 AM, said:

Greetings,

Slight veteran player, but fairly new to CW.

Soo, I've joined a House and the reinforcement call came up.

Planet info said my House was the occupying unit - which to me sounds like we're controlling/holding it. Text next to it said something along the lines of 'bla-bla-bla Council has issued contract for Defense, (or something like that)' and lastly the button to get in queue said 'defend' (or is it 'defense'?, can't remember right now).

Get in game.

We're attacking..

Eh?

Hopefully, and perhaps most likely, I've missed something obvious here.

Thanks.

There are two different types of matches in CW - Invasion which is Attack/Defend with the Omega and the generators, and Counterattack which is just an attack/defend with the mobile base omega.

When the enemy wins an Invasion match, the next match for the defenders will be a counterattack mission to take back that territory. This is the game mode you played - you have to attack and kill the enemy who is occupying your territory to take it back under your control.

[Mortec]

First of, thanks for the reply.

And yes, it was indeed a Counter-Attack, but what I'm probably getting at, and here - again, back to probably something I've missed, is how - or where, can I see that it will be Counter-Attack?

Just seems weird calling it Defense..

Thanks again.

[Gas Guzzler]

Mortec, on 04 January 2016 - 10:50 AM, said:

First of, thanks for the reply.

And yes, it was indeed a Counter-Attack, but what I'm probably getting at, and here - again, back to probably something I've missed, is how - or where, can I see that it will be Counter-Attack?

Just seems weird calling it Defense..

Thanks again.

When the looking for opponent or match preparation countdown is going, it will say you are counter attacking. You can also look and see what tick mark on the planet diagram the little icon is on, and if the little icon is on a red tick and you are "defending the planet" then you are counter attacking. If the little icon is on a blue tick you are defending.

The Counter-Attack game mode happens when a tick mark is taken by the enemy. You are trying to take it back by counter-attacking. The enemy is getting a "hold territory" type match where they are simply defending against your counter attack so they can keep the tick.

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 04 January 2016 - 10:57 AM.

[Vxheous]

Mortec, on 04 January 2016 - 10:50 AM, said:

First of, thanks for the reply.

And yes, it was indeed a Counter-Attack, but what I'm probably getting at, and here - again, back to probably something I've missed, is how - or where, can I see that it will be Counter-Attack?

Just seems weird calling it Defense..

Thanks again.

Just to add to what the others have said, the terminology gets a little bit confusing. When it pops up asking for you to Defend, you are Defending the planet, but not necessarily the one of thirteen Grids that are contested on said Planet. An attacking Faction needs to be in control of 7 of 13 Grids of a planet by the time Ceasefire ends to capture a planet. The Counter-attack mode in CW is meant for the Defenders of the planet to re-capture a Grid that was previously taken by the Attacking Faction.

Depending on which side of the fight you are playing from, you always have one of two fights:

If Attacking a Planet:
1. Attack (where you attack the base, and the gates are closed and there are turrets) Win Condition is to destroy Omega
2. Defending a Counterattack (where you spawn inside a captured base, but there are no turrets to help you and the gates are open). Win Condition is to Either keep Omega alive, or maintain a Higher Kill lead when Match ends.

If Defending a Planet:
1. Defend (where you are inside a sealed base, and turrets are on your side) Win Condition is to keep Omega alive.
2. Attacking a Counterattack (where you spawn outside a captured base, but there are no turrets to oppose you, and gates are open). Win Condition is to Kill Omega AND have Higher Kill lead when Match ends.

Edited by Vxheous Kerensky, 04 January 2016 - 11:46 AM.

[Mortec]

Top notch lads - thanks!

Things got way more clearer now.

[Armando]

The Mech Academy needs a basic tutorial about how CW works IMO. Instructions on how to tell if the match will be an attack or defend....lesson on what map the match will be on based on the queue screen, etc.

[Sandpit]

Armando, on 04 January 2016 - 11:47 AM, said:

The Mech Academy needs a basic tutorial about how CW works IMO. Instructions on how to tell if the match will be an attack or defend....lesson on what map the match will be on based on the queue screen, etc.

The map screens, queue screens, etc. are VERY difficult for anyone to just look at and figure out.

[Armando]

Sandpit, on 04 January 2016 - 12:07 PM, said:

The map screens, queue screens, etc. are VERY difficult for anyone to just look at and figure out.

For those wondering WTF Sandpit and I are talking about the following is a great thread to check out...

http://mwomercs.com/...ones-quick-map/

[Mortec]

Kinda glad I made this thread now, 'cause

Armando, on 04 January 2016 - 11:47 AM, said:

The Mech Academy needs a basic tutorial about how CW works IMO. Instructions on how to tell if the match will be an attack or defend....lesson on what map the match will be on based on the queue screen, etc.

and this

Sandpit, on 04 January 2016 - 12:07 PM, said:

The map screens, queue screens, etc. are VERY difficult for anyone to just look at and figure out.

are things to put into real consideration.

[MrJeffers]

Mortec, on 04 January 2016 - 12:39 PM, said:

Kinda glad I made this thread now, 'cause



and this




are things to put into real consideration.

This thread has some useful information as well:
http://mwomercs.com/...61#entry4168361

[Armando]

Mortec, on 04 January 2016 - 12:39 PM, said:

Kinda glad I made this thread now, 'cause



and this




are things to put into real consideration.

Happy to help!

Also, Check this out (Single best read for a new player to MWO regarding CW IMO)...

Kin3ticX CW Guide

Edited by Armando, 04 January 2016 - 01:26 PM.

[Chameleon257]

Armando, on 04 January 2016 - 11:47 AM, said:

The Mech Academy needs a basic tutorial about how CW works IMO. Instructions on how to tell if the match will be an attack or defend....lesson on what map the match will be on based on the queue screen, etc.

I don't know how many times I've told our pugs when we are dropping less then 12 we're not worried about the van on hold territory when we have a clear kill advantage by more than a wave of 12.

We also have seen people because we sit and watch them hit the gun instead of the van behind the gun. We tell them to turn around and shoot the van and unless they just shoot at us will let them kill it until they get bored. The academy would be the perfect place to explain this!!

[Not A Real RAbbi]

There NEEDS to be a FW/CW tutorial in the MW Academy, PERIOD. Preferably one done with significant community input, so we KNOW that it addresses some of the things we see from first-timers, like shooting directly AT gates or the cannon. Individual tactics and team strategies are not so much the point there, but getting a player through A SINGLE INSTANCE EACH of attack/defend and counterattack/hold, with Captain Adams or someone else (GOD PLEASE SOMEONE ELSE) talking/walking the cadet through.

NEED. Strong word. Totes intentional.

[Sandpit]

Armando, on 04 January 2016 - 12:12 PM, said:

For those wondering WTF Sandpit and I are talking about the following is a great thread to check out...

http://mwomercs.com/...ones-quick-map/

that's the tip of it, but being able to look at queues, know where you're at in the queue, see how many games are about to finish up, knowing what each section of the circle means, etc.

Even the "quick play" options that show planets being attacked and such is really difficult for players to understand. Are they attacking? Defending? Is it better to have a higher number against theirs or vice versa?

Stuff like this needs in game documentation that's easy for players to access.

TheRAbbi, on 04 January 2016 - 01:38 PM, said:

There NEEDS to be a FW/CW tutorial in the MW Academy, PERIOD. Preferably one done with significant community input, so we KNOW that it addresses some of the things we see from first-timers, like shooting directly AT gates or the cannon. Individual tactics and team strategies are not so much the point there, but getting a player through A SINGLE INSTANCE EACH of attack/defend and counterattack/hold, with Captain Adams or someone else (GOD PLEASE SOMEONE ELSE) talking/walking the cadet through.

NEED. Strong word. Totes intentional.

I agree
It would be nice if, to graduate and get that final cadet bonus, new players had to play one "CW style" drop with a drop deck before being sent out into the wild to fend for themselves.

I'd like to see a cadet queue added personally as it would solve so many of these issues, but it's never something that's gained much attention when I mention it in threads and PGI doesn't seem interested in it.

[Davegt27]

Quote

Posted Today, 10:30 AM
Greetings,

Slight veteran player, but fairly new to CW.

Soo, I've joined a House and the reinforcement call came up.

Planet info said my House was the occupying unit - which to me sounds like we're controlling/holding it. Text next to it said something along the lines of 'bla-bla-bla Council has issued contract for Defense, (or something like that)' and lastly the button to get in queue said 'defend' (or is it 'defense'?, can't remember right now).

Get in game.

We're attacking..

Eh?

Hopefully, and perhaps most likely, I've missed something obvious here.

Thanks.
Edited by Mortec, Today, 10:33 AM.

Welcome to the Twilight Zone

Edited by Davegt27, 04 January 2016 - 04:20 PM.

[Armando]

Sandpit, on 04 January 2016 - 02:29 PM, said:

that's the tip of it, but being able to look at queues, know where you're at in the queue, see how many games are about to finish up, knowing what each section of the circle means, etc.

Even the "quick play" options that show planets being attacked and such is really difficult for players to understand. Are they attacking? Defending? Is it better to have a higher number against theirs or vice versa?

Stuff like this needs in game documentation that's easy for players to access.

From your keyboard to the devs @ PGI's eyes !!! I couldn't agree more.

[Willard Phule]

Armando, on 04 January 2016 - 11:47 AM, said:

The Mech Academy needs a basic tutorial about how CW works IMO. Instructions on how to tell if the match will be an attack or defend....lesson on what map the match will be on based on the queue screen, etc.

Considering how long we had to wait for that Tutorial, asking them to add anything at all to it at this point would be an exercise in futility.

Still....perhaps some MANDATORY cut-scene type of movie/instructional video sort of deal that you have to watch before you're allowed to drop in CW? Or, if you want to take it down my "new guys never learn" personal viewpoint....make them watch it every time they drop as long as they have Trial Mechs in their drop deck.

One would think that by the time you own 4 mechs, you don't really need your hand held anymore.

Sandpit, on 04 January 2016 - 12:07 PM, said:

The map screens, queue screens, etc. are VERY difficult for anyone to just look at and figure out.

They have gotten better, though, you have to admit that. CW1 was an absolute nightmare to try to figure out.

The part that bothers me has to do more with basic visuals than actual mechanics. Being a solo player yourself, you've probably seen it, too. It's that whole "Pilot Receiving Orders" changing to "Transferring Pilot and Mechs" and back to Pilot Receiving Orders." We both know what's going on....we're solos, when a small group comes in and takes up those slots, you get put into another line. No biggie. It's just the visual of going back and forth that's so frustrating.

For what it's worth....I can't help but think that with the huge influx of new guys and solo players in CW, it almost makes you think there should be a "general militia" type of queue. Sort of a "I don't care which planet you send me to, just send me somewhere I can help my faction" kind of deal. First in, first out. If a 10 man needs 2 guys, they take 2 from the top and move on.

Or, alternatively, if a planet is about to be attacked with a ghost drop, then it can snag 12 guys from the pool to defend with, and so on.

Chameleon257, on 04 January 2016 - 01:30 PM, said:

I don't know how many times I've told our pugs when we are dropping less then 12 we're not worried about the van on hold territory when we have a clear kill advantage by more than a wave of 12.

We also have seen people because we sit and watch them hit the gun instead of the van behind the gun. We tell them to turn around and shoot the van and unless they just shoot at us will let them kill it until they get bored. The academy would be the perfect place to explain this!!

That's NOWHERE near as awesome as the trial mechs vomiting laser beams and ammunition at the closed gates after the turrets have been dropped. I used to tell them to shoot the generators, but if there's one thing I've learned since Closed Beta....new guys don't listen in game and they don't tend to learn very quickly. It's better if you can just sit back and have a good laugh at them.

[Rushin Roulette]

Vxheous Kerensky, on 04 January 2016 - 11:34 AM, said:

2. Attacking a Counterattack (where you spawn outside a captured base, but there are no turrets to oppose you, and gates are open). Win Condition is to Kill Omega AND have Higher Kill lead when Match ends.

Nice explanation summary

Id also like to stress a really important point on this position for all new CW players (and apparently quite a few "veteran" players). Omega does NOT matter unless the aggressor side are ahead in kills or there is a possibility of a close finish. There is no point in running in to kill Omega and wasting a bunch of mechs while the opponents can leasurly take apart your team which is currently building up a bunch of heat shooting at the Omega field HQ.

The same applies to the defending side. If you are well ahead in kills, then there is no point even attempting to defend that mobile field HQ. The only thing it is useful for, is to tell you where at least one opponent is shooting at.

[Major Lag]

nvm.

Edited by Major Lag, 08 November 2016 - 03:04 PM.