63 replies to this topic

[Dimento Graven]

Mister D, on 20 January 2016 - 01:26 PM, said:

Its just another good example of how inefficient PPC's are right now as a solo weapon vs Quirked lasers.

PPC's just do not have enough punch, nor range to match up to LL's +minrange, even with the velocity quirks, all sombody has to do is push you and you're done.

ERPPC's are just uncontrollably hot in a pair, range isn't an issue here either.

There is some admitted truth to that, and I think PPC's have a much more significant hit detection issue than even gauss does.

I could swear while piloting my BW that there were some ERPPC shots that APPEARED to hit very red critical areas but apparently didn't do any damage.

I'll have to play more and gather more definitive evidence though.

Quote

Remember, we lost a good chunk of Efficiency and Heatcap last patch too, so sustained DPS with PPC's got even harder.

Good to remind us of that. I do occasionally forget...

Quote

Now pair that with Accel/Decel nerfs + no JJ's, and low hardpoints, means you can't poke and retreat very well either, and have to expose yourself quite a bit to even get a shot off.
Recipe for fail.

Well, to get your primary weapons off. Torso mounts are fairly high, and limiting your hill humping to that height is effective mitigation of heat and exposure.

[Druarc]

Not sure yet as haven't even basiced them, really don't like IS PPC's though.

[xXBagheeraXx]

Dont get shot? I can do a whole game in an XL engined Muromets and live...while staring down people with UAC5's.

[Sigilum Sanctum]

There's a lot of hyperbole being thrown around in here. I wonder how people arrange their armor.

For the record this is how I do mine:
Black Widow Template

Adjust arm and leg armor to your style.

EDIT: BTW, I think they're fantastic.

Edited by Sigilum Sanctum, 20 January 2016 - 01:53 PM.

[lshtaria]

There's nothing that stands out to me as "broken" with the Warhammer. Armour and structure wise it feels like it's 5 tons lighter than the Marauder so... yeah all good to me.

Just remember those low arms. If you're exposing yourself to fire them, you're showing almost your entire torso profile as the arms are waist high.

Not DOA, no broken hitboxes, no durability issues. Great robot.

Edited by Milocinia, 20 January 2016 - 01:54 PM.

[Novakaine]

You know I used to think the Hunchback was a thin skinned piece of .......
Well you know the story.
But then I discovered something.
It's called Twisting.
Now the Hunchback are laser spamming torso twistin damage spreadin monsters in my book.

[LordBraxton]

TTK is the issue. Closed Beta was a far better game due to slow TTK and lots of brawling. MWO has felt like any other FPS for ages, just slower.

Before the slow movement speed was still MUCH faster than the TTK.

Allow me to explain: In MWO you move rather slowly, and die slowy compared to games like counterstrike or battlefield. However, the TTK is so fast that, adjusting for movement, you have the same movement potential as an unarmored soldier, moving at the higher speed of a traditional FPS. You can not move safely from cover to cover.

In CB you could gamble with your armor, and fight a protracted battle, sacrificing each chunk of armor for better team positionining.

Now the ONLY strategy is to NOT GET HIT. While the game is still slower than other FPS, this has caused the tactics to be essentially the same.

Corner camp, peek n poke.

Lame. Bring back 3025 plz

[OznerpaG]

i can't judge a mech before it's elited - i find un-elited mechs handle like a fully loaded 18-wheeler so i end up getting shot up a lot more anyways

gotta say though, i'm already in love with the WHR...

[Reza Malin]

Dimento Graven, on 20 January 2016 - 09:46 AM, said:

I dunno, I been gaussing the absolute crap out of Warhammers, and they seem to be able to take a hit quite like a champ.

I know there was another thread on this forum bemoaning the fact that the quirks make the WHM almost equal to an Atlas in structure.

You sure you're just not coming up against significant focused fire?

Damn near ANY 'mech feels 'squishy' when being fired at by 3 or 4 enemies at the same time...

This +1000

Im detecting classic pub quick match syndrome....you win some you lose more, mech and skill don't have much to do with it, only the lottery of what calibre team you end up on....

LordBraxton, on 20 January 2016 - 02:02 PM, said:

TTK is the issue. Closed Beta was a far better game due to slow TTK and lots of brawling. MWO has felt like any other FPS for ages, just slower.

Before the slow movement speed was still MUCH faster than the TTK.

Allow me to explain: In MWO you move rather slowly, and die slowy compared to games like counterstrike or battlefield. However, the TTK is so fast that, adjusting for movement, you have the same movement potential as an unarmored soldier, moving at the higher speed of a traditional FPS. You can not move safely from cover to cover.

In CB you could gamble with your armor, and fight a protracted battle, sacrificing each chunk of armor for better team positionining.

Now the ONLY strategy is to NOT GET HIT. While the game is still slower than other FPS, this has caused the tactics to be essentially the same.

Corner camp, peek n poke.

Lame. Bring back 3025 plz

I didn't play the beta but i cant help feeling drawn to this. I do wish some of the mechs (not lights, lol) took longer to kill, so you could really enjoy some good battles. Then you need not worry so much about writing yourself off before the battle has really begun because of one slight mistake or bad position.

Edited by Fade Akira, 20 January 2016 - 02:12 PM.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Xavori, on 20 January 2016 - 09:38 AM, said:

That's pretty much all the mechs in the game since PGI has never adjusted armor to deal with the fact that humans are much more accurate than dice rolls.

More like hasnt added any kind of mechanic to offset the player's accuracy, like Battlemech targeting computer delay, as it traverses the guns and zeros them in on the target, through a simple, CoF mechanic.

THe WoT/AW aim time+CoF mechanic is actually pretty good for making stuff not pin point. AW's mechanic I think is best though, its an RNG, but its not that bad really, you can still send almost all your shots right around the middle.

[Kenneth Kell]

i find nothing wrong with the WarHammer it takes hits like a boss even have a 4.33 KR in the WarHammer R like others have said if you stand out in the open and are targeted by 4 or 5 other mechs any mech will die quick

[Red Shrike]

I find the Warhammer to be decently well armored. That is, until I run into a laser/ballistic boat. At which point my armor is gone within 2-3 secs.

Dimento Graven, on 20 January 2016 - 01:34 PM, said:

There is some admitted truth to that, and I think PPC's have a much more significant hit detection issue than even gauss does.

I could swear while piloting my BW that there were some ERPPC shots that APPEARED to hit very red critical areas but apparently didn't do any damage.

A few games ago I got hit in the CT by PPC. It made my mech shake like it usually does, but I took no damage whatsoever, and it was well within range.

But other than that, the PPCs have about as much punch as two medium lasers.

[Lykaon]

CwStrife, on 20 January 2016 - 09:36 AM, said:

So myself and a bunch of people I know have bought the Warhammer... obviously... and for a 70 ton mech this thing takes damage like it's a damn raven. It's so weak. I get shot a few times and i'm already cored out, my arm is falling off. It's like the thing is broken... Anyone else have this issue? I feel PGI needs to really address this one.

The 6R actually has more internal structure than an unmodified 100 ton mech. Are you using the stock armor values because the out of the box 6R is short my 3.5 tons of armor.

[Lykaon]

Bishop Steiner, on 20 January 2016 - 09:54 AM, said:

WHM might prove to not be as tough as the MAD..... but think we need more than 24 hours of kneejerk reactions to tell.

Having both chassis what I find so far is the Warhammer is not the front liner the Marauder can be. The Warhammer's low slung arms and if built proper PPCs require a bit of comfort distance from the enemy to utilise.

I would say you do not want your warhammer to be the first mech the enemy sees (and thus locks onto) but the third or fourth mech encountered.hang back and let the front liners do the brawling and hold the attention of the enemy.

Once your team has the attention of the enemy and your warhammer is not going to be the focus of attention you can start dishing out the pain from more than 90m away

The warhammer can carry a significant amount of secondary firepower but let's be honest if you get caught in a knife fight you are down 14 tons of payload because those PPCs will not be much use.This reduces the Warhammer to the firepower levels of a mech nearly half it's tonnage but with all the agility we come to expect from a 70 ton mech. Warhammers are not the brawlers the Marauder can be.

Edited by Lykaon, 20 January 2016 - 03:11 PM.

[meteorol]

Bishop Steiner, on 20 January 2016 - 09:54 AM, said:

TBH, I always hear "this mech is too weak" (Zeus and Black Knight were prime examples) until people start getting them mastered, get their builds sorted....

Or, like in the Black Knights case, PGI changes the quirks to something along the lines of internal structure of a 95t (?) mech along with 20/15/10 laser quirks.

Edited by meteorol, 20 January 2016 - 03:22 PM.

[jonfett]

I've had some different matches with 3 different variants of the Whammy. All of them, I had 99% full armor, w/ it basically all front-loaded. Two of them I used the STD280, but I also loaded an XL340 engine into my BW from the Cicada event. The faster engine allows faster twisting to spread damage, but so far the CT is a soft squishy magnet for incoming fire no matter the engine. I keep getting my CT cored, while the rest of the mech is untouched or in the yellow.

[John Archer]

NextGame, on 20 January 2016 - 09:37 AM, said:

As bad as black knight?

Not even close. It cannot go toe to toe with a Black Knight. The OP is right...this thing acts like it has paper armor.

[StonedVet]

Is this a serious thread???? Holy hell OP quit playing if this is a topic that seriously bothers you. We face these things nonstop in CW now and it tanks like a damn assault. Either get better or quit the whining.

Nuff said ..

[Joe Mallad]

CwStrife, on 20 January 2016 - 09:36 AM, said:

So myself and a bunch of people I know have bought the Warhammer... obviously... and for a 70 ton mech this thing takes damage like it's a damn raven. It's so weak. I get shot a few times and i'm already cored out, my arm is falling off. It's like the thing is broken... Anyone else have this issue? I feel PGI needs to really address this one.

lmao! I live longer in my WHs than I do in most other heavies. And I'm ripping through other mechs just fine with my WHs. You probably get cored so fast because you play it like its supposed to be dead center in the enemies face.

[MarineTech]

Hey OP...