56 replies to this topic

[Felicitatem Parco]

Yup.

Only a Lore-Breaker would want it to do more than just save you a ton for cheap C-Bills.

(I am sticking my tongue out right now)

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

Prosperity Park, on 26 January 2016 - 02:36 PM, said:

Yup.

Only a Lore-Breaker would want it to do more than just save you a ton for cheap C-Bills.

(I am sticking my tongue out right now)

I'd like to see Ferro get a % buff to armor or if not that see Standard Structure get a % boost to internal structure, that way Ferro gets in indirect buff because it's a weight saving option for mechs that want Standard Structure durability.

But why do that when PGI is counting on Quarks to do all the work?

[Khobai]

If FF gave 12% damage reduction in addition to weighing 12% less it might actually be worth using.



Lets use an Atlas as the test case, since its the heaviest mech.

An Atlas normally has around 576 armor.

Standard Armor weighs 576/32 = 18 tons
FF Armor weight 567/36 = 16 tons so thats a 2 ton savings

Say FF also gave 12% damage reduction, the Atlas would function as though it had 576*1.12 = 645 armor

78 extra armor is worth 78/36 = 2.17 extra tons

So FF with 12% damage reduction on an Atlas would save ~4.17 tons but also effectively increase max armor by 12%.

While Endo on an Atlas saves 5 tons.

The two would be pretty close then. And thered be different reasons for choosing them. FF would be for defense and Endo would be for offense/speed.

Edited by Khobai, 26 January 2016 - 03:30 PM.

[Xetelian]

Khobai, on 26 January 2016 - 03:17 PM, said:

If FF gave 12% damage reduction in addition to weighing 12% less it might actually be worth using.

This would help mechs that are locked with Ferro but it would also creep the power of the TBR and SCR.

[Khobai]

Quote

This would help mechs that are locked with Ferro but it would also creep the power of the TBR and SCR.

Obviously it would only apply to IS FF not Clan FF.

Clan FF doesnt need a buff its already way better. Clan FF is only 7 crit slots not 14. And Clan FF reduces armor weight by 20% not 12%.

So why buff something that doesnt need buffing?


The same logic applies to IS Endo. IS Endo should get a buff because Clan Endo is better.


ISXL should also be changed so it can survive side torso destruction. And the STD engine should get a structure buff so it still remains viable. Clan weapons (particularly lasers) should also be normalized down to the same level as IS weapons as well.


Its pretty obvious that meta superquirking is not the best way to balance this game. Clan vs IS tech needs to be balanced better at the base level in order to get rid of all the dumb IS superquirks that are plaguing the game right now. That's really the only way to properly balance the game...

Edited by Khobai, 26 January 2016 - 03:41 PM.

[Necromonger Commander]

Geeks being mean..... Not everyone is a loser who played Battletech instead of dating girls....

[oldradagast]

I thought FFA was simply a lot cheaper than Endo, and easier to add to a mech since you're changing armor, not rebuilding the mech's structure. In a game that has fully open customization, however, this reason means nothing, sadly.

Some sort of perk for FFA would be nice, or at least make it clear that it is NOT a way to get more armor on a mech.

[TELEFORCE]

I'd be fine with a damage reduction modifier for IS Ferro Fibrous armor.

[Dracol]

Endo = weight savings upgrade level 1
Ferro + Endo = weight savings level 2

Which it was explained more clearly to new players.

[Khobai]

Quote

Endo = weight savings upgrade level 1
Ferro + Endo = weight savings level 2

Which it was explained more clearly to new players.

Except theres clan mechs that have ferro without first taking endo

Which pretty much defeats your whole argument.

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

Khobai, on 26 January 2016 - 06:17 PM, said:

Except theres clan mechs that have ferro without first taking endo

Which pretty much defeats your whole argument.

There are also IS mechs that have Ferro, without Endo. [quite a few actually]

At the end of the day, it's just a lore reason, but Endo saves more weight for the same amount of taken critical spots.

[FupDup]

CMDR Sunset Shimmer, on 26 January 2016 - 06:52 PM, said:

There are also IS mechs that have Ferro, without Endo. [quite a few actually]

At the end of the day, it's just a lore reason, but Endo saves more weight for the same amount of taken critical spots.

Currently, IS mechs only have Ferro without Endo if the player chooses to gimp themselves. If the player is using the mechlab effectively, no IS mech has to carry FF before already equipping Endo.

[Tarogato]

I don't see what the problem is. Ferro is fine. Ferro has applications, advantages, and tradeoffs. It's a way of granting more tonnage to mechs that have spare slots, I don't see anything wrong with it or any need for it to have some sort of buff. It's already fine the way it is.

Edited by Tarogato, 26 January 2016 - 07:25 PM.

[Y E O N N E]

Outside of my Lights, I also have some big STD-engine heavies and Mediums that make good use of Ferro. My MAD-5M, for example, uses it to bring either a STD 340 with AC/10 and MedLas or a STD 325 with Goose and MedLas. My JM6-DD uses it for a STD275 with 2xUAC/5, 2x ML, and 4xMG. My BJ-1X has it with a STD 280. BJ-A with a STD 225.

Ferro definitely has its place. It's not common, and you get better benefits with an XL, but it's not completely useless.

[Narcissistic Martyr]

DjPush, on 26 January 2016 - 12:40 PM, said:

So... I don't usually use Ferro because you get more weight out of Endo-Steel. However, yesterday I was toying with different builds and decided to use Ferro. Why not give it a shot (along with command consoles and targeting compiters). So what is the deal with ferro-fiberous? Do you really get a 14% increase in armor? Or is this just a hoax like "double" heat sinks?

It just weighs less is all. What it should do is allow you to mount 14% more armor on your IS mechs. Clan mechs can continue to have it as a weight saving option and I'd argue that clan STD armor should allow you to mount maybe another ton of armor for balance reasons.

[El Bandito]

Note: Clan Ferro is actually a good option for Clan Battlemechs, since it saves more tonnage while costing half of IS Ferro. IS Ferro is basically useless on all mechs except Lights.

Stupid Clan tech.

Edited by El Bandito, 26 January 2016 - 07:59 PM.

[Escef]

Necromonger Commander, on 26 January 2016 - 03:40 PM, said:

Geeks being mean..... Not everyone is a loser who played Battletech instead of dating girls....

Some of us date women instead of girls... Because we aren't pedos, y'know?

[NextGame]

DjPush, on 26 January 2016 - 12:40 PM, said:

So... I don't usually use Ferro because you get more weight out of Endo-Steel. However, yesterday I was toying with different builds and decided to use Ferro. Why not give it a shot (along with command consoles and targeting compiters). So what is the deal with ferro-fiberous? Do you really get a 14% increase in armor? Or is this just a hoax like "double" heat sinks?

It's a hoax. What it really means is that:

• 1 point of ferro is slightly lighter than 1 point of normal,
  
• but those 1 points can absorb exactly the same damage before being destroyed,
  
• and you still have the same armour cap per mech.
  
• With ferro you are paying 14 crit slots for, if you are lucky, an extra tonne or so of free weight, which is an expensive compromise on most mechs over 35t

Edited by NextGame, 27 January 2016 - 06:35 AM.

[CDLord HHGD]

I believe it's supposed to be the only way to increase your stock armor points. Would be really cool if it worked this way (assuming they did something to curb the meta and insta-TTK).

[NextGame]

cdlord, on 27 January 2016 - 06:41 AM, said:

I believe it's supposed to be the only way to increase your stock armor points. Would be really cool if it worked this way (assuming they did something to curb the meta and insta-TTK).

This would give players an actual decision to make, don't be so sensible!