163 replies to this topic

[Kjudoon]

Just like people rage about torpedoes and aircraft in world of warships. And yes it does come down to demanding that it is unfair to use indirect fire because they can't shoot back in kind. They are wrong of course. It is not unfair. It is a strategically superior action but has its own risks.

I am sure it was thought unfair to fling incendiaries over walls with catapults and trebuchets. War is tough all over.

[MrMadguy]

For those, who say, that LRM - is bad weapon, that LRM boats are all about personal reward farming and don't contribute anything towards team WIn - see, how presence of LRM60 boat affects match results:

[TyphonCh]

MrMadguy, on 29 January 2016 - 01:14 AM, said:

For those, who say, that LRM - is bad weapon, that LRM boats are all about personal reward farming and don't contribute anything towards team WIn - see, how presence of LRM60 boat affects match results:

1 match doesn't really prove anything. I've had dozens of great matches in my LRM boats, but it doesn't make a good weapon. They're heavily reliant on your team spotting well, getting good position, dropping UAV's etc, and the other team being bad. That's about it.
Long range missiles. Suck. Period.

Edited by Team Chevy86, 29 January 2016 - 01:19 AM.

[Kjudoon]

I wonder if you would complain this hard if that was done with direct fire weapons.
Do you see the point that the weapon is over needed if it can do that level of damage without killing?
How about we compensate its killing power by giving it a +300% crit chance?
Then you wouldn't see so much damage but more kills in line with df weapons?

Edited by Kjudoon, 29 January 2016 - 01:25 AM.

[Kjudoon]

And on look... An arctic cheater and marauder df build had the most kills with half the damage... Huh.

Nothing to see here. Move along. Working as intended.

[Wolfways]

SkaerKrow, on 28 January 2016 - 10:32 PM, said:

LRMs aren't broken, but they're frustrating for people because a LRM-boat can rain damage down on you while you have no opportunity to hit them back. It's the same reason that people rage at artillery in World of Tanks and snipers in Call of Duty. They're not broken, they're just really freaking annoying.

I find light mechs really annoying, but I don't make 10 threads a day about it

[Galenit]

TimePeriod, on 28 January 2016 - 12:43 PM, said:

The gruelling fact I realized was quite simple; if you get narc'd, that's it. Pack your bags, you are dead.
Its not even a discussion here.

Or just take ams that will kill some missiles.
Did you even know that the narc-beacon is a slow moving missile?

No ams, no whine.

Edited by Galenit, 29 January 2016 - 02:49 AM.

[Oldbob10025]

surgetank, on 27 January 2016 - 02:27 PM, said:

The time has come for lrm mechs to be nerfed as its spoiling any one to one battles. take Polar map as a example its a pure Lrm map which is a shame as it could be a great map but as it stands you have little change of a good brawl due to never getting close. ok you say use ECM and AMS but its no use against so many lrms boats i was on the map the other day and the opposing team had 4 lrm boats and just about killed all my team.This is not fun anymore.

nothing towards you my friend but I hear only this

"I just want to laser vomit, waa waaa waaa"

LRMS are fine the way they are and might need a boost or something like better ECM system to combat it but as it stands its so easy to just have a SUPPORT mech ie a light mech made to support or a role mech to help you out but most of the time everyone scatters looking for squirrels.

LRMS are countered with Derp module or ECM or not being spotted.. or go run behind a building (yes even assaults can hide) but so easy to counter that weapon its not even funny.. Laser Vomit mechs with ER large lasers you can do almost anything against because they direct fire unless you dont engage them...

LRMS are fine or if need be do something more with them but I love how people always whine about LRMS because they dont
1)Talk to the team members in VOIP
2) Walk to a wall
3)Talk to your ECM support buddies
4)Get a Derp Module
5)Use ECM yourself
6)Use better Tactics

Laser Vomit mechs
1)i'm Special because I can fire 100 Large lasers and you die with one volly
2) Hit from across the map
3)ECM means nothing to them
4)Dont need to talk to anyone see number 1
5)Shall I go on

[pyrocomp]

Kjudoon, on 28 January 2016 - 05:48 PM, said:

Pyrocomp I did not read any other post you made because of MEGO. Mine eyes glazeth over syndrome. I was addressing the commonly held fantasy that lrms are no skill op garbage. A stellar example of Orwellian doublethink if I never saw iit.

I hope you do understand how poor you excuse is and that will be enough. Anyway, in past 2 years over the forum LRM-threads (and at some point it was LRM-daily-whine-thread) there were no indication or general inclination to turn LRMs to twitch weapons. Twitch weapons (in almost any game) are either hit-scan ones of with extreme projectile velocity. There were proposals to change the LRMs to be unguided direct fire weapons (with THAT low speed? Even not basiced yet DWF will manuevere out of it on 600 m) but not twitch ones. So you've overreacted a bit.
So anyhow, there exist no notion towards changing LRMs into twitch weapons. Just general desire to see them somehow different without any direct description on just what we want to see. Thus LRMs remain the same. When community had the common notion of what was wrong with LRMs then PGI changed that (lower damage, spread, flatted dive at the end of flightpath etc).

[Kjudoon]

Pyrocomp, I dealt exclusively with the 'can't aim' fallacy. I didn't know or care really about your other posts because I ignored them.  Now you specified Pinpoint Aiming and you are right... But the way you couched the statement still helped perpetuate the fallacy that there is no aiming at all.  And I proposed a ludicrous solution as well.  In all honesty, you were the soapbox to address others as to the inaccuracy of that belief.

Edited by Kjudoon, 29 January 2016 - 03:51 AM.

[STEF_]

MrMadguy, on 29 January 2016 - 01:14 AM, said:

For those, who say, that LRM - is bad weapon, that LRM boats are all about personal reward farming and don't contribute anything towards team WIn - see, how presence of LRM60 boat affects match results:

Some questions here.

1) tier territory?
2) if it was the aws-8R, don't u think that doing only one kill with 985dmg is bad? (I mean when I do around 800-1k, I manage to do around 5-6 kills...because my weapons do not spread, maybe....)
3) how many enemies were standing in the opening without cover? and how many without radar depr.?
4) do u think that ONE screenshot can talk about statistic?

[M4LX WMD]

LURM Love =p

[1Grimbane]

stop whining and get ams on your ride if your that worried about lurms

Edited by 1Grimbane, 29 January 2016 - 10:04 AM.

[wanderer]

Quote

1) tier territory?
2) if it was the aws-8R, don't u think that doing only one kill with 985dmg is bad? (I mean when I do around 800-1k, I manage to do around 5-6 kills...because my weapons do not spread, maybe....)
3) how many enemies were standing in the opening without cover? and how many without radar depr.?
4) do u think that ONE screenshot can talk about statistic?

1) Odds are, that's in the T3 or worse range.
2) He's launching missiles. Effectively, he was hammering every component on the 'Mechs he hit- and he hit eight of them. Missile boats tend to get far more assists than kills as result, though you tend to shift a bit with practice.
3) It's Canyon, so relatively clear fire lanes unless someone's pinned near a rock. Telling how many had radar dep? Impossible. Canyon's generally considered a relatively friendly map for missile boats.
4) Nope, but my goodness do I have plenty of them. Think my best on my ALRM30 Orion was six kills and six assists on Canyon. Of course, given most damage possible is based on ammo load and you -cannot- get 100% hits, effectively most missile boats get about two-thirds of their ammo load as potential damage. I do see 1K+ games under best-case conditions with 1800 missiles to start.

[MysticLink]

lrms are not bad weapons, they are meant to annoy you and draw you out to fight. Played well, they can be deadly weapons. Played against well, and they can be the most useless type weapon.

It's as balanced as a weapon can get. Everyone needs stop complaining that they are too weak or too strong.

[CDLord HHGD]

surgetank, on 27 January 2016 - 02:27 PM, said:

The time has come for lrm mechs to be nerfed as its spoiling any one to one battles. take Polar map as a example its a pure Lrm map which is a shame as it could be a great map but as it stands you have little change of a good brawl due to never getting close. ok you say use ECM and AMS but its no use against so many lrms boats i was on the map the other day and the opposing team had 4 lrm boats and just about killed all my team.This is not fun anymore.

[Mystere]

Kjudoon, on 28 January 2016 - 11:10 PM, said:

I am sure it was thought unfair to fling incendiaries corpses over walls with catapults and trebuchets. War is tough all over.

FTFY.

[Iyada]

LRMS are annoying at best. They might want to lower the rocking and cockpit obscuringness of them, but idk that's imo. I've been telling my friends for a long time, i think they broke lasers and ballistics as soon as they decided perfect accuracy was a good idea. Maybe I'm being ignorant, but i feel like it wouldn't have been very hard to implement some kind of accuracy penalty for moving/running/jumping(well, they kinda did that already). just my opinion in case anyone wants to flame me lol.

[Lugh]

Kjudoon, on 27 January 2016 - 11:07 PM, said:

People who agree with the op either have no idea how lrms work, have never used lrms, have lrmphobia, or are just intractably bad.

My money is on all of the above.

And incidently mr 895 damage and 1 kill, with that much damage in my HBK IIC(0) I've had 6 kills, with 4 most damage dealt. So yeah. Great weapon..

I got the 8 kill acheivement with that much damage and 4c- UAC 5 direwhale.

Edited by Lugh, 29 January 2016 - 12:20 PM.

[Mcgral18]

MrMadguy, on 29 January 2016 - 01:14 AM, said:

For those, who say, that LRM - is bad weapon, that LRM boats are all about personal reward farming and don't contribute anything towards team WIn - see, how presence of LRM60 boat affects match results:

I say they're a bad weapon.

Here's what a 225M optimal range DIRECT fire weapon system can do, back to back last night:







How reliable are your LRMs? This Nova has, on multiple occasions, gotten back to back 1K damage matches, with a large selection of high scoring matches. Handful of Terribad, because you know, 225M optimal is risky, but it can kill any single thing before overheating.

LRMs are too situational for things like that. They depend on the map, and worst of all, your opponents, more than anything. This just relies on the Map. Very little you can do to mitigate a 200+ direct damage before heat cap.